AsPD and The Genetic Link

Comingoutofmyshell wrote:My point here is that, it's interesting that yourself as and AsPD parent believes that your child will not be AsPD yet I as an non AsPD parent maybe actually raising one due to my PD. Weird really but a topic I find interesting to discuss.

Not to exacerbate your concerns, but based on (unscientific) observations on this board, seems like quite a few PD parents end up with PD kids. I'm sure some of it is shared genetic predisposition, but it seems some PD parents have quite an impact on their child's behaviour. Seems like NPD parents are the worst, but there are all kinds of horror stories. Of course, the ones (PD or non) that are really messing up their kids are the ones who don't care, and care, so that says a lot.

Kanin hasn't been around here much lately, but she's BPD w/ sadistic urges and antisocial traits, and has a BPD parent. Though, I think she said once, that the BPD parent wasn't nearly as harmful as the "non."

Mike has never stolen from me or anyone he has connected personally with. He steals from complete strangers. It's almost as if he chooses when to have a conscience.

Mikes 42 years old and his parents have been left to pick up after him for the last 20 years. There is no doubt that his mother loves him, she has just accepted that he's a sociopath. I don't see how that could be traumatic for him.

Dang ya'll are all parents! haha.

Yeah if my dad has a PD then I'm sure as heck to have one being so much darn like him *sigh* He's always very distant and very smug. I know he was the youngest and his dad died when he was 12. He also did a lot of drugs when he was younger. Now he just smokes pot. I'm prolly actually different since I'm the most like him. My other sisters seem to favor my mom more.

Course not sure about me mom. She used to be an alcoholic I heard when I was a younger like...I dunno toddler an dstuff and a pill popperwhen my basically stepdad left (then a year later i had to move in with my dad urg) . She has gottenher act together ,though. Everyone in my immediate family either smokes pot or drinks. I know for sure my grandmother is crazy on my mom's side. And her brothers got issues too, but I heard all of their childhood is really bad. I didn't get to hear specifics, but it did slip that they would get locked in closets. And my mom always refers to it as 'her hell' .

I'm lucky not to have had any abusive parents, though , that have ended up in jail or anything.

I would definitely say their behavior influenced me, but I also think I was just naturally distant. My mom says when I was a baby I didn't cry a lot and it was hard to keep me from just sleeping. Ha. She'd have to wake me up to try and feed me.

Well coming , you can't quite tell right now, but it doesn't hurt to be prepared , just don't take it to the point of being paranoid.

jessicaborthwick wrote:no one in my family ASPD or any other mental illness
im the only one that i know of
im also the only one thats been in a psych ward or prison
my mums 1 of 10 children so i must have picked the short straw

Here, here Jessica. But I disagree with the "short straw" analysis.

Comingoutofmyshell wrote:My son has ADHD and ODD and I'm wondering that he might be going more towards the AsPD route. He has been/is difficult at times and has been prone to occasional strong bouts of all-out rage which very suddenly surpass. He seems to show compassion and perhaps empathy at times but at other times show complete lapses in both with some of his actions. I don't recall any emotional response from movies, he is more likely to highlight a beating or destruction. Perhaps this is just a boy thing?

It could just be a boy thing. Your son is quite young still. He will no doubt change in some ways as he grows older. Is he on any medication at all for his ADHD?
My daughter was on Ritalin for awhile, but I lost the prescription one day and she ran out of medication. I've kept her off it ever since because I noticed there wasn't a great deal of difference when she was on it to when she was off it.

My point here is that, it's interesting that yourself as and AsPD parent believes that your child will not be AsPD yet I as an non AsPD parent maybe actually raising one due to my PD. Weird really but a topic I find interesting to discuss.

I wouldn't be too concerned about labeling your son with anything at this stage because he is only young still and most children do change as they get older. Though, with that said, I've been considering taking my daughter to a psychologist and getting her tested for conduct disorder. My daughter is a teenager and at a stage where her behaviour is becoming more of a concern, primarily due to the fact that she is still very defiant. Just as I don't think she'll develop Antisocial Personality Disorder, I don't think her ODD has reached the conduct disorder stage either, but I'm not entirely sure that I should disregard the possibility altogether.

Is it not possible (not knowing your child's age here?) that children are able to mimic emotion in the right situation ie home. Yet take them out of the home they actually become who they want to be?

It's possible my daughter could be mimicking the emotions of others (other kids at school, people in movies and tv shows etc. She's not likely to be mimicking mine though because the only emotion I exhibit fully is anger). I do find it unlikely though because her emotions do seem genuine and she does appear to show genuine empathy and compassion for others at times.

The current view among experts is that psychopaths are basically born. Whether they go the socially deviant route, or the corrupt politician/corporate psychopath route depends on environment. In other words, most of the core psychopathic traits we talk about here on this forum - lack of empathy, lack of guilt, lack of remorse, lack of emotion, etc - are absent in the psychopath at birth. I think that's saying a lot, so here's some quotes if you care to read them, all by leading experts in the field, that back up this assertion:

"Bad Childhoods: While many believe psychopaths become the way they are from abusive childhood experiences, there is no evidence to suggest this is true. Most children who suffer abusive childhoods do not become psychopaths, and many psychopaths grow up in healthy families. Some attachment difficulties in infancy are a symptom of psychopathy, not a cause. (Hare, 170, 172, 175)"

"A Nature/Nurture Model of Psychopath: The position I favor is that psychopathy emerges from a complex - and poorly understood - interplay between biological factors and social forces. It is based on evidence that genetic factors contribute to the biological bases of brain function and to the basic personality structure, which in turn influence the way the individual responds to, and interacts with life experiences and the social environment. In effect, the elements needed for the development of psychopathy - including a profound inability to experience empathy and the complete range of emotions, including fear - are provided in part by nature and possibly by some unknown biological influences on the developing fetus and neonate. As a result, the capacity for developing internal controls and conscience and for making emotional “connections” with others is greatly reduced."

“This doesn’t mean that psychopaths are destined to develop along a fixed track, born to play a socially deviant role in life. But it does mean that their biological endowment - the raw meterial that environmental, social, and learning experiences fashion into a unique individual - provides a poor basis for socialization and conscience formation. To use a simple analogy, the potter is instrumental in molding pottery from clay (nurture), but the characteristics of the pottery also depend on the sort of clay available (nature)."

“Although psychopathy is not primarily the result of poor parenting or adverse childhood experiences, I think they play an important role in shaping what nature has provided. Social factors and parenting practices influence the way the disorder develops and is expressed in behavior."

“Thus, an individual with a mix of psychopathic personality traits who grows up in a stable family and has access to positive social and educational resources might become a con artist or white-collar criminal, or perhaps a somewhat shady entrepreneur, politician, or professional. Another individual, with much the same personality traits but from a deprived and disturbed background, might become a drifter, mercenary, or violent criminal."

“In each case, social factors and parenting practices help to shape the behavioral expression of the disorder, but have less effect on the individual’s inability to feel empathy or to develop a conscience. No amount of social conditioning will by itself generate a capacity for caring about others or a powerful sense of right and wrong. To extend my earlier analogy, psychopathic “clay” is much less malleable than is the clay society’s potters usually have to work with."

“One implication of this view for the criminal justice system is that the quality of family life has much less influence on the antisocial behaviors of psychopaths than it does on the behavior of most people.” (Hare, 173-4)

Mr. No One wrote: Here, here Jessica. But I disagree with the "short straw" analysis.

i wouldn't call it was a bad thing

You didn't just skip me..

crystal_richardson wrote:You didn't just skip me..

who skipped you

Rot in prison bitch!