Dealing with Paranoids

For me, there is no best way. It runs its course, and even then there is no actual end. Even if someone tells me whatever it may be isn't true, they're lying right to my face. Once it's entered my mind, it's the only truth.

With that said, it can be avoided, but only because of conditioning; I already know for fact I will be betrayed. There is no surprise. I needn't any effort from someone else, I got the whole thing covered, and they know where the door is.

Can't say I care much if people are hurt in the process, I simply don't connect with guilt.

Traum wrote:For me, there is no best way. It runs its course, and even then there is no actual end. Even if someone tells me whatever it may be isn't true, they're lying right to my face. Once it's entered my mind, it's the only truth.

With that said, it can be avoided, but only because of conditioning; I already know for fact I will be betrayed. There is no surprise. I needn't any effort from someone else, I got the whole thing covered, and they know where the door is.

Can't say I care much if people are hurt in the process, I simply don't connect with guilt.

Wow! I hope you are not married and I hope you never want to marry because you will destroy someone's life. Best you to stay single.

It's only finally solidified in my mind that my mother suffers from (probably mild to moderate) PPD, but over the years I've developed coping skills to deal with her "episodes".
1. I don't tell my mother too much. Either she will panic and worry about my decisions and continue to harass me to STOP whatever decision I am making, or she will say something that hurts my feelings. Keep it light and keep your distance.
2. When my mother does say something hurtful- like asking me who's filling my head, or talking bad about my grandmother, I mostly ignore it & don't take it personally. As my dad always says "pick your battles" and I know from experience there is no winning against the "voice" of paranoia whispering in my mother's ear. It's not that she hates me, it's just that she legitimately feels that I'm saying something mean to her (when clearly I'm not) and so she's responding to the (incorrectly) perceived criticism.
3. When mom is open to being spoken to, I will do what her mom- my Grandma G. used to do... give her a good dose of reality- telling her that these feelings are "silly" and "childish". I hate to talk down to her (or anyone for that matter!) like that, but it works. Dismissing and invalidating her irrational fears is what helps her to wake up and smell the coffee.
4. Have a sense of humour about it- when I'm stopping over to see dad and check in on mom, when she says something hurtful or irrational, I just play mental BINGO. She doesn't mean to say the things she does, it's just that her mind is off on another planet.
5. Have a witness- Because my mother tries to keep everything a secret, having someone around that she considers an outsider around helps keep her in check. For example, when I have my husband with me, or even put her calls on speaker phone so he can hear them, she controls herself better. Plus, my husband is a better able to communicate with her, whereas she has trouble processing what I say.
6. Communicate in writing, with dad. It's better to text my dad with info and updates because my mom listens to him.

An item of interest to me and perhaps too late in dealing with my PPD wife (my diagnosis). Her outbursts of paranoia always seem to have a regularity to them such that I could almost plot the next episode on the calendar-about 4-6 weeks between. For a long time I searched topics on drug interaction as she takes about 7 different drugs for atherosclerosis related problems. I did find one researcher in CA who is studying such effects including aggression and anger which my wife exhibited strongly in her episodes.

Another interesting pattern is that during her incessant accusations of my infidelity she pleaded with me to "just admit it so I can forgive you." Now that we are in divorce proceedings I sometimes wonder what would have happeed if I did falsely admit adultery. It always seemed best to maintain the truth.
It occurs to me that once I did admit this it would serve her overwhelming desire for another sphere of control-in this case over my adultery. So it could still go on but be controlled through her forgiveness?

I don't have PDD but get kinda paranoid due to PTSD symptoms.

Best way to deal with it is by confrontation. Full disclosure and transparency. If you're trying to be sensitive by skirting around the issues I'm probably going to assume you're trying to manipulate me. Then I get violent.

Well , confrontation did not work. In the ten years (yes 10 years) I experienced monthly accusations of infidelity at least half ended up in confrontation. (Do the math: 10 years of monthly episodes). When I was rested and patient I tried logic and cognitive type therapy ( you saw something, but it was not what you think etc). But when ordinary human frailty and fatigue ruled there was confrontation. It seemed to help her after about an hour. The next day the terrible roller coaster ride started up again at ground level toward its inevitable crescendo and descent.

I ask the OP: if a stranger offered you a free sandwich, would you eat it?

I'm told most people would say "yes, absolutely," without needing any other qualifiers. And that just sounds completely insane to me.

My gut reaction, unless this stranger is giving me this sandwich because I came into their restaurant carrying a "Buy One Get One Free" coupon, is "Why, what's wrong with it?" Is it spoiled? Maybe even laced with drugs? Is it even a type of sandwich I would like? Are the ingredients any good? Does it have some kinda gross sauce on there? Did the chef make it wrong? Am I on Candid Camera?

For a paranoid person, "there's no such thing as a free lunch" isn't just a cliche. It's a survival strategy. If a stranger walks up to you and offers you something you didn't work for or pay for, you're going to be damned suspicious on general principle. It's nothing personal. It's just the way we're wired.

So, that's the first thing you need to know. The second thing you need to know, is if they propose you guys go to the movies, they'll think it's safe. If you propose you go to the movies, they'll be skeptical and maybe even suspicious. If not about your motives, then about the behavior of the general public they have to wade through to get to the theater.

Paranoids value control. They like to have options. They like to have choices. Especially the choice to make up their own option from scratch, because that means nobody else tampered with it. "Do you want McDonalds" is bad. "Would you prefer McDonalds or Hardees" is better. "Where would you like to go eat" is better still. If they pick someplace really weird, be like "Huh. That's interesting. Why there?" You'll find that it's not arbitrary. They always have their reasons. The reasons might get really weird.

If they seem reluctant to talk about their reasoning or internal mental state, it may be because they don't trust you (or someone else, real or imagined, within earshot) with their fears. Just be like "Oh well, never mind, it's not a big deal" as nonchalantly as possible. Again, it's not personal. They are living through their own personal horror movie, and they don't know when, who or what is going to jump out at them and Ruin Everything.

Paranoids can go from taciturn to vocally opinionated when and if they start to trust you. This can get annoying, but remember that it's coming from a loving place. If your relative with PPD goes on and on about how the food you buy at the grocery store is full of pesticides or the uber-rich 1% are gaming America's financial system or 9-11 was an inside job, and getting increasingly animated and loud the less interested you are, it's only because they love you, they perceive a real or theoretical danger, and they urgently want to warn you about it.

You can't talk them into seeking help. Trying will just make them question your motivations, or at least your competence. The best thing you can do is give them access to an internet connection (encrypted by a virtual private network, naturally, for privacy's sake) and just enough information that they will want to look it up themselves. If they think it's their idea, they'll be more likely to take what they discover at face value.

Ironically, certain types of psychological tricks used by advertisers, con-men, and businesses might be more likely to work on people with PPD, even as their minds are naturally hardened against other types of ads, scams and persuasion strategies. My advice is not to try to persuade them into anything at all. Even if it works, they might feel as though you tricked them, later.

(They might feel this anyway, even if you didn't try to persuade them at all. Remeber that this is just their damage. They can't help it or control it. Forgive them for it.)

Easily-verified facts are your friends. "It's 20 degrees outside" is better than "you should wear a coat." The former makes them feel smart and secure as they cleverly put on a coat to defend themselves against the danger of hypothermia. The latter makes them feel like you're trying to control what they wear, for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with the temperature.

Give them options. Give them tools. Give them an easy out. Avoid the phrase "don't worry about it." They likely literally can't not worry about it. Instead, say "yeah, that sucks. But, hey, it could have been worse!" They will get behind you on that one. Paranoia means always realizing how it could have been worse.

I am not a psychologist. These are not treatment strategies. I am a PPD sufferer. These are coping strategies, which is what I think the OP was asking for.

cherlyn wrote:I've dealt with a PPD who inserted herself into my life at a very young age for 40 years. She's 80 and I'm 42. I've been FREE for almost 6 months now after let's see - after her ruining my son's birthday, my having to call the police to get her to leave, harassing my mother who passed away in March, and threatening to have me arrested and to sue me. Nice. I am still amazed at how WONDERFUL it feels to not have to deal with her, try to impose boundaries, predict temper tantrums, and worry about unannounced visits, and hear about the latest lawsuit. To remember the dread and discomfort of each visit, the obligatory phone calls... FREEEEE!!!!! WHEEEEEEEE!!! I would NEVER and I mean NEVER EVER allow a toxic person like this in my life ever again. Ever. What a feeling to only have NORMAL (relatively speaking, of course) people I choose in my life. When she dies I will breathe a sigh of relief her twisted and toxic soul has left this realm. I'm still trying to make sense of the damage such long term exposure to a PPD has caused to me. So, yeah. What I've read here sounds like the straight up emotional abuse I had to deal with. And, yes, she has been violent in the past. If someone is seeking and help and knows they have a problem, that's great. But all this, "How can I tell PPD they are irrational, overdramatic, incorrect, hurtful and paranoid without, you know, UPSETTING them...?" is just b.s. Being an enabler and/or codependent won't help anyone. I say leave the slim potential for change right where it belongs -with a psych professional. Not that there's much of a chance of that happening. If you can, run far, run fast, and don't ever look back. And for God's sake, do whatever you need to to protect children from this damaging personality.

You know... part of me wants to defend this 80 year-old stranger. But it does sound like whatever you were doing to try and help her, it wasn't healthy for either of you. The sad thing is, leaving her alone probably really is better for her and for you, assuming she can live unassisted. Every person is different, of course, and every relationship is different. And I haven't heard her side of the story. But you're correct that any attempt to try and persuade a paranoid (of pretty much anything) is likely to end in drama and/or tears, especially if they haven't realized that they have a problem yet. The harder you push, the more they dig in their heels, because pushing makes you look like part of the thing they're irrationally afraid of.

But between enabling their behavior and endlessly beating your head against the wall, I honestly believe there's a middle road of respect and understanding. You are probably not the best person to walk that road for this individual, though, Cherlyn. The good news is that Paranoids tend to be resilient, self-reliant individuals. Assuming she wins one of those lawsuits every now and then, I'd imagine she'll probably be okay by herself in the short term.

Enjoy your newfound freedom. You've more than earned it.

I realize this thread is quite old. Nonetheless, I am posting here because this thread is so relatable to me and has been comforting to read.

My fiance has PPD (undiagnosed). I always knew there was something different about his perception on life, people, etc. It's been an exhausting 4 years. Yesterday I googled the phrase "person always thinks people are lying" and that lead me to a page about PPD and to my horror it explained my fiance to a T. I couldn't believe it. There was a name for it and he exhibits every single thing listed.

My fiance is always right. Even when I point out ways he's contradicting himself, he still argues his point of being right. He complains all the time. It's as if nothing is good enough for him. He is the only one that can complete tasks appropriately. No one else is of capable mind to make decisions, but him. He is very controlling. My fiance always feels slighted. I once made pancakes for him and my 3 kids and he accused me of giving the kids all the hot ones and purposefully saving the cold ones for him. He accuses my children of lying and being sneaky when they are just doing normal kid stuff. Everyone is against him. He needs constant validation and praise. I am accused frequently of being unfaithful. He once argued with me that he saw me sitting at a bar with a man's arm around me. I was at the bar, which he knew, sitting next to my cousin ( who owned the bar) and no one else. He truly believed that he saw that. That or he was gaslighting me. Either way things like this threaten to end our relationship regularly.

My fiance has a 20 year old son that hardly speaks to him. He acknowledges that he was not the best father and pushed his son so hard that he pushed him right out of his life. Yet, I see him doing the same thing with my children and it scares me. He is preoccupied with thoughts of co-workers trying to make him look bad or his boss intentionally "setting him up" to fail. My fiance has accused me of "plotting" against him. When I've asked for specifics on what I am doing that makes him think that his response was "I don't know, but I'll find out".

I'm saddened and yet kind of relieved. I knew all along that while I am not perfect that me or the kids were not the real issue. I am saddened that it seems that after 2 days of scouring the internet for information, it looks as though the amount of people with PPD who can change is quite slim. Still, as of today, I remain hopeful.

I am beginning therapy on my own (he doesn't believe it therapy) in hopes that it will give me the tools to help him and at the very least, the tools to help myself. I love this man deeply in spite of the negative aspects of him and will leave no stone unturned. If it comes to ending the relationship, then so be it.

Hi lucilleboose,

You mentioned:

I am beginning therapy on my own (he doesn't believe it therapy) in hopes that it will give me the tools to help him and at the very least, the tools to help myself. I love this man deeply in spite of the negative aspects of him and will leave no stone unturned. If it comes to ending the relationship, then so be it.

The above is absolutely admirable quality in you. But good intentions or not, please do sincerely consider a new life since currently he is your finance. In light of the prognosis: Paranoid personality disorder is often a chronic, lifelong condition; the long-term prognosis is usually not encouraging.
Please do read the posts on:
http://www.psychforums.com/paranoid-personality/topic174532.html#p1833303

Please distance yourself and save your children from a lifelong period of isolation and heartbreak.