The difference between rejection and abandonment?

crystal_richardson_ wrote:You can reject after acceptance too though can't you?

I agree there is physical and emotional abandoning, but the difference between rejection and abandoning is not temporal in my opinion (one happening after the other or that one is even required initially).

You can not abandon someone, physically and even emotionally, while also rejecting them.

rejection/acceptance pertains being unwanted/wanted respectively.

but just because someone doesn't want you doesn't mean they are going to abandon you physically, or even emotionally, as they may still support you.

which leads me to define abandonment as withdrawal of support.

anyway, so distinctly:

rejection - you are unwanted

acceptance - you are wanted

physical abandonment - withdrawal of physical support

emotional abandonment - withdrawal of emotional support

Thank you for this Crystal.

I agree with your analysis.

crystal_richardson_ wrote:You can reject after acceptance too though can't you?

I don't believe so. Sure, you may get to know the person more to the point that you no longer accept them, but that would still mean that the relationship was still in its honeymoon phase and the person never truly accepted you because they did not yet know you. Maybe I introduced confusion when I said "immediate dismissal", and to clarify I don't just mean instant rejection, I would say the shallow phase of the relationship which usually lasts 4 months. Once you are past this, you can only "abandon" the other person, because you already gave them superficial approval.

You can not abandon someone, physically and even emotionally, while also rejecting them.

rejection/acceptance pertains being unwanted/wanted respectively.

Right, I think rejection and abandonment are mutually exclusive. They lie on a continuum with different levels or degrees, with rejection on one end and abandonment on the other.

I don't really understand the physical and emotional distinction.

justagirl00 wrote:I've been rejected plenty of times. I go on a first date with a guy and he never calls me or shows any interest in seeing me or even talking again. This bothers me a little bit like it does to anyone but I get over it quickly. I can rationalize it pretty easily, like "I guess I wasn't his type," or "I must have said something wrong." Its no big deal, really. I might send one email or text or something and then if I don't hear back from him I drop it.

Right, but because it is so immediate you can rationalize it and create excuses, so you never come to terms with the rejection. I think it would be different if you explicitly knew he thought you were weird or unattractive for instance, by say reading one of his texts to a friend about you, and he had some social standing that you couldn't just dismiss what he said as nonsense. Or breaking up after the third date or something, anything to make you feel insecure about. But it would have to get to you.

But after a relationship has been established, and then the person breaks it off....it is absolutely devastated. I go into full panic, every brain cell is on high alert. Its pure panic, terror, like I'm dying, it feels like annihilation, and something takes over to where I do everything in my power to prevent it from happening, including stuff that could get me arrested. I spend months in this state. It takes me months to get over it, even if the relationship was only three months.

You would obviously know better than I. From the sounds of it you do have hope of finding true love one day. I thought it was a feature of BPD to have given up on this pursuit. Perhaps your self-awareness makes you want to challenge this view.

But when I panic after a relationship ends, I don't think I'm reacting to the "rejection" part. Its more like this person has become a fixture in my life, and so when he wants to leave, its like someone trying to remove one of my limbs. Its hard to see how I will function without him. Even though I functioned fine before him, I forget about that part.

It doesn't hurt my ego. My ego can take a beating, actually. I think Narcs are the ones with fragile egos.

Its something else that I'm not sure I can put my finger on it or describe it. It makes me panic and something takes over to prevent the abandonment at all costs.

Could it be because BPDs take on the identity of those around them...so its like we are losing our identity when we lose that person who defines us.

This depends to an extent what a breakup like this makes you feel insecure about and why you feel worthless. Do you begin to doubt your superficial qualities or the deeper ones?

I'm sure some of those guys that rejected me did think I was unattractive or weird or something. I didn't say I didn't process the rejection. I try to figure out what I did wrong or what went wrong, but I don't tell myself "Its all them," or try to deny I've been rejected.

Not everybody will like everybody. I have rejected people as well after the first date because they just didn't do it for me, I felt no attraction or interest in them and there was no reason to continue. It doesn't mean they are worthless...just not for me.

IMO and I could be wrong, its just my opinion...but it may be a slightly more a NPD trait to not be able to handle or accept/process rejection because its about ego and value...as Esquire said, it upsets him when people don't respond when he approaches, and Esquire is an NPD.

My ego can take a beating because there are far many other people who have shown interest in me. I have no trouble getting male attention and many guys after one date have openly expressed how much they liked me and how smart and interesting and intriguing and exciting and attractive I was to them....so I can handle if a few here and there don't like me. Its not a big deal to me. I don't expect to win over everyone, there will always be people who don't like me for whatever reason. I can live with it.

And I have also had people outwardly criticize me and put me down and call me ugly or stupid or other things...I can handle it. It might make me angry, or annoyed, or hurt my feelings, but it doesn't destroy me like abandonment does. I know I'm not perfect, I'm not the smartest or most beautiful or interesting woman in the world. But that hasn't stopped me from getting people to want me. I think its more a matter of the way two people fit together and attract each other, rather than some inherent value. IMO (and again just my opinion) but I think it may be NPDs that tend to choose people based on their perceived "worth" or "value" and "image/status," etc. Most other people are more interested in the connection between two people, the unique bond or tie two people come to have after interacting with each other over a long period. Do Narcissists experience this? I'm not sure....? Or is it more about what the other person can do for them?

As for the breakups and why they are so hard for me, that is what I am trying to figure out. Since its not an ego trip for me. I know if one guy breaks up with me I will probably be able to get another one. But its always so traumatic when it happens. I don't know why.

*TW* It might go back to very early trauma as a baby and being abandoned when it threatened my survival. It must awaken that old memory I think, of sitting in my crib hungry and thirsty and cold and crying for hours and hours while being ignored and feeling literally abandoned and with the real possibility of death if my caretaker didn't come back and take care of me soon. It must trigger that old memory. That's the only answer I can come up with right now.

justagirl00 wrote:
*TW* It might go back to very early trauma as a baby and being abandoned when it threatened my survival. It must awaken that old memory I think, of sitting in my crib hungry and thirsty and cold and crying for hours and hours while being ignored and feeling literally abandoned and with the real possibility of death if my caretaker didn't come back and take care of me soon. It must trigger that old memory. That's the only answer I can come up with right now.

Hugs. Yea, when I'm triggered to feel abandonment, I truly feel like there is a 5 year old inside of me crying. I have an extremely strong reaction similar to what you described in your previous post.

Awwwwwwwww thank you Mary.

Hugs

Its hard sometimes.

But we will make it

Hugs

violet8 wrote:That the feeling of abandonment and the abandonment depression in an adult is something triggering the feelings from childhood, that abandonment is really the domain of small children where being rejected by a parent is really a matter of life and death. Having an unhealed wound like this any rejection that we may experience however slight or intense can unleash these feelings.

rings a bell

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paraphrasing my own post from another subforum, where i was referred to this thread (i'm hoping the perspective of an outsider might be appreciated here). i think questions like these can always be reduced to semantics, so there'll always be different interpretations, but this is the way i see it when i think of these two words:

rejection is directed. it's contingent on a reason or a trigger. it's a negative reaction or the perception of a negative reaction to something about you. so if you as a person are being rejected, then you are being equated to that thing about you. and if you are feeling rejected as a person, then you are equating yourself to that thing about you. it's easy and natural to equate yourself and get equated to just one thing or another about you when there's not much of a relationship yet

abandonment is undirected. it's not contingent on anything other than the person who abandons (or their internalized image). it's a hurtful action resulting from purely individual reasons (or the internalized hopelessness and helplessness first caused by such action). in other words, it's not about you, even if you're the one who suffers the effects of it. instead of being reduced to some particular thing about you, you and all the things about you are ignored. you're equated to nothing in particular or nothing at all

i think it makes perfect sense to link abandonment to childhood. because if you ever developed a sense that there's someone you can always count on, then i don't think you can feel hopelessly and irreparably alone and helpless later in life. because your brain will tell you that "there's someone you can always count on", even if it's not your parents or anyone else in particular anymore

for me, the sense that i'm being taken for granted in a relationship that i value (or that i feel i depend on) is the worst possible experience of both rejection and abandonment. the sense that i'm fading away without even an acknowledgement that i am fading away

justagirl00 wrote:*TW* It might go back to very early trauma as a baby and being abandoned when it threatened my survival. It must awaken that old memory I think, of sitting in my crib hungry and thirsty and cold and crying for hours and hours while being ignored and feeling literally abandoned and with the real possibility of death if my caretaker didn't come back and take care of me soon. It must trigger that old memory. That's the only answer I can come up with right now.

how do you remember this?

I don't remember this, but from what I know this is probably what happened.

My mom was depressed when I was a baby and my parents were splitting up. They were actually split up before my mom got pregnant with me but then they got back together to have me but then broke up again. My sister tells me all she remembers is them fighting all the time.

My mom is not an affectionate cuddly person so I doubt she held me much. My father probably did but my parents broke up when I was less than a year old so then he wasn't around anymore after that. I have early memories of my mom crying in her room and ignoring us. She was like that pretty much my whole childhood, it was very neglectful. She has even admitted this. So I assume I was probably neglected as a baby too. I can't ask her about it, but I'm guessing it happened that way.

justagirl00 wrote:My mom is not an affectionate cuddly person so I doubt she held me much. My father probably did but my parents broke up when I was less than a year old so then he wasn't around anymore after that. I have early memories of my mom crying in her room and ignoring us.

Mine is similar, except she did not cry.
I have three clear recollections of when I was 2-3 years old. Mainly, I'm all alone in all early childhood memories.
But you should not assume that she neglected you as a baby. I believe, from my own experience that the maternal hormonal activity is very different during that baby period. If the mother is not on drugs, drunk - something major. The the baby's needs are met.

Thank you for the reply Wendy. I'm sorry you had similar experiences as a young child.

Huge hugs

Maybe I shouldn't assume, and I can't remember what happened before I was about a year old (I do have pretty early memories though after that).

But my mom did have some severe issues going on. Depression, anxiety and maybe some dissociation. She wasn't drinking or on drugs but probably on some heavy psych meds.

I wonder if its possible that the physical contact with a baby can be triggering for her, she was a sexual abuse victim. I've heard for some sexual abuse victims, its a problem when they have babies and the close physical contact a baby requires can be triggering. I've heard from another close family member she did sort of abandon my sister as a baby. She left her with our father during their separation. (My poor mom, I don't blame her for all this. Her side of the family has lots of dysfunction, she did her best.)

I told this to my therapist also and she said if this is my intuition it may be true. Because when I'm feeling abandoned, I feel just like I think an abandoned baby might feel. Helpless, alone, panicked, crying, wanting someone to come, being ignored and unable to care for myself, wanting to be picked up and held. Its like an old, preverbal memory. I don't have proof and I can't ask, and maybe I shouldn't assume. But if it is true, I wish I had some way to erase or undo this old memory.