Feel like a huge ass - and cant cry!

KX - WTF???

Are you saying contact him anyways? Maybe call in a couple days and apologize profusely about my needs and wants??

FYI...i went to barnes and noble today and they dont have the Emotional Vampires book....so I will have to order it. damn.

Passive aggressive??? yeah probably. I will drop that too.

"KX - WTF???

Are you saying contact him anyways? Maybe call in a couple days and apologize profusely about my needs and wants??"

LOL, no mylife don't do that!!!

The next time he calls just do the typical HPD routine ie act like nothing has happened between you two.

This time the "nothing that happened" is the negativity though not "the false loving relationship an HPD forms with a non".

Anyway after he establishes contact and you act like nothing bad happened between you two then gradually follow the advice I just said.

Sorry about the mix up mylife I think I'd been mistakenly misled by Sam Vaknin's info on NPD. He's no expert just a self proclaimed N and a guy who admittadly is only helping people to obtain narcissistic supply for himself. I'd found many things I thought to be helpful on his site despite his half truths so I had subconsciously taken him as the authority on narcissism. He is not.

Hey though I'm mostly the HPD guy so its understandable I'd get lost in the world of NPD's at least momentarily.

Definitely here is what I think now though...

Al Bernstein mental health professional and verified PHD > Sam Vaknin self proclaimed N with shaky credentials from a diploma mill.

"FYI...i went to barnes and noble today and they dont have the Emotional Vampires book....so I will have to order it. damn.

Passive aggressive??? yeah probably. I will drop that too."

Yeah order it from Amazon kiddo as I think they've got it for as low as $8.

KX -

I ordered the book - finally, after all the times it has been suggested on this forum...it will also help in my practice too.

So since I sent him the txt: "i hear you. You dont need to talk to me like that more than one time"....there has been no contact. I have sent no txts or called.

I dont think he'll call me KX. Do you think it would be ok in a couple days to just call (not txt) and leave a message just stating hello, miss ya, sorry about the other night, give me a call sometime??

And then when we hook up again I will casually do the praising and all that....

You know I really wonder if I have just miss pegged this guy - maybe hes not NPD. He really does not brag about anything, in fact he doesnt talk hardly at all to me. But I see him constantly running his mouth to others. Seems like he has a lot friends/associates. But he does say things demeaning about most people he speaks of. He says things like, "i dont care if people like me, they will respect me". He did run for a city politician job recently. He just seems to act like his presence is enough for everything! Funny thing is that most people really like him, describe him as a "cool dude" "laid back" and all that. Why do I not see that person? The other day we got into a disagreement and he stated that he doesnt want anyone to know him. That there are reasons from his past that he doesnt want anyone to really know him. He stated, "this is my process". If I even MENTION anything to do with feelings or emotions, he just says, " I gotta go".

wtf?

Well mylife remember that "pleasant, polished and slick" is part of the ASPD diagnosis as in they often are this way for friends but people that get closer to them see the dark side which you have seen.

Also in Robert Hare's book Without Conscience it talks about ASPD's sometimes talking to people a mile a minute which does a few things.

It keeps their target from thinking, entertains their target as most ASPD's have the gift of gab and works to distract you from their true purpose/goal with you which they use grooming of their target to achieve.

Grooming is a slow subtle process used by most Cluster B's.

Basically it is making a person go a little farther then they normally would with just about anything little by little until they are fully down a self destructive path that is of some benefit to the Cluster B who initiates it.

"But he does say things demeaning about most people he speaks of."

How so?

An N might talk of how pathetic and beneath him others are with a lot of contempt while an ASPD might focus on how weak the people are in many ways compared to himself and do this with a cold emotionless rage.

"He says things like, "i dont care if people like me, they will respect me"."

Reminds me of the phrase "Its better to be feared than loved" since ASPD's don't understand love in the traditional sense I can see why he only cares about respect.

An N definitely would care if people liked him.

Well people that were above him on the social structure anyway or any boss that he has.

I'm sure digital.noface would agree with that.

"He did run for a city politician job recently. He just seems to act like his presence is enough for everything!"

This is a common thing with many Cluster B's mylife. Since you all lack a certain emotional awareness or empathy that we nons have it often comes off to those of us who don't know about your conditions as extreme confidence when really it is simply a lack of shame or embarassment that almost all of you have from the lack of empathy and total emotional awareness or no emotions or empathy at all in the ASPD's case.

For an NPD combine what I just said with thinking themselves a god and entitled to everything just by being alive and you've got a particularly greedy monster on your hands.

"Funny thing is that most people really like him, describe him as a "cool dude" "laid back" and all that. Why do I not see that person?"

Why does the HPD's lover no longer see the loving and fun girl that he remembers from the beginning of the relationship that all of her friends and new guys still see?

Its because whatever this guy is be he normal, ASPD or NPD he knows he has you and is winning the game.

Remember mylife many men have been instructed by friends looking out for them or parents when young on how to handle a woman such as yourself even if the words Histrionic Personality Disorder are alien to those passing on this knowledge.

"The other day we got into a disagreement and he stated that he doesnt want anyone to know him. That there are reasons from his past that he doesnt want anyone to really know him. He stated, "this is my process". If I even MENTION anything to do with feelings or emotions, he just says, " I gotta go".

wtf?"

Well from my brief conversations with several ASPD's they view all nons as emos and women that want to share deeply emotional things with them as whiners and as I'm sure you can guess by now ASPD's hate whiners.

If the guy is an ASPD and he was still in the process of capturing you he would cater to your emotional needs probably better than any non that is aware of how to handle an HPD but once he sensed he really had you good that ASPD would act like your current man is now for you.

KX - thanks for your lengthy and thoughtful reply.

I am not sure if ASPD fits him though...he has no criminal history, no drug usage, no violence, he is really responsible withwork and kids etc...He certainly has come characteristics of an ASPD but I doubt that he would ever get that diagnosis.

Really to sum it up: he lacks any and all empathy. He NEVER smooth talked with sweet nothings - he didnt have to - I was already giving him what he wanted from the start.

One last question that you didnt answer: Do I call and leave that nondemanding voicemail in a few days?


Also, was just thinking about times he has told me is really competitve....he would sleep with girls just to "see if he could".

"KX - thanks for your lengthy and thoughtful reply."

No problem.

"I am not sure if ASPD fits him though...he has no criminal history, no drug usage, no violence, he is really responsible withwork and kids etc...He certainly has come characteristics of an ASPD but I doubt that he would ever get that diagnosis."

You mentioned he does not like to talk of his past mylife.

Unless you've done a background check on him you cannot be sure if he's never been involved in criminal activities.

Also though ASPD's by nature are prone to crime some of them for whatever reason grow up to become reasonably productive members of society so keep in mind that not all of them do whats typically associated with ASPD's.

For example a doctor I watched once in a documentary about the ASPD murderer "The Iceman" Richard Kuklinski told Kuklinski that if an ASPD grows up in a loving home ie one with good instruction, follow through and all that good stuff the ASPD has a great chance of growing up to become something good for society like a firefighter, bomb disposal technician etc as opposed to a criminal.

The point is ASPD's by their nature crave excitement and if raised in a home like this can channel their need in a socially healthy and productive for everyone kind of way.

Anyway the excitement craving is basically to alleviate the intense boredom that comes with the condition.

The boredom is what produced the lifeless look you have seen in practice with so many ASPD's.

Oh and I think you said your guy had it rough growing up though so yeah you really can't be sure if he's not had a criminal past without a background check but eh thats getting into spying on him territory and I wouldn't recommend it unless you were going to marry him which doesn't look like it will happen as like you've mentioned before you will eventually drop him when things get far too frustrating or whatever or worse for you he may drop you completely before that happens lol.

"Really to sum it up: he lacks any and all empathy. He NEVER smooth talked with sweet nothings - he didnt have to - I was already giving him what he wanted from the start."

LOL, what drew you to this guy in particular then mylife? No offense but was it his status, his looks, his money or what???

"One last question that you didnt answer: Do I call and leave that nondemanding voicemail in a few days?"

Wait about 4 days mylife then send a reserved and humble but not sad type of nondemanding voicemail. Then simply wait.

Its all you can do.

"Also, was just thinking about times he has told me is really competitve....he would sleep with girls just to "see if he could".

An N wouldn't talk this way.

This is either the talk of a non that is skilled with women or an ASPD as they do if nothing else love their challenges.

What I would prescribe

Rx

1. You avoid this person
2. The rest of the forum stops responding to you one way or the other.

Yes I know we did talk about this and similar some time back- only I feel bad that we are all here, where we all are watching a car crash in slow motion- but none of us can do anything to stop it.

Golden,

I hear what you are saying. Actually I have made no contact with him since that last incident. I am doing well over it too. Part of my asking for advice is that I have extreme anxiety and afterall this is an HPD forum. The advice that i receive here is reassurance and really does help me GET OVER the situation not more into it. This forum is one of the only places that I can go to and feel BETTER about the situation....I am not naive here. I am not dumb just acting stupid. Lots of people come here and ask how to get over or get back at their HPDs....So I am a HPD asking how to get over and get back at a NPD. Albeit, I am a little more obsessive about it (which is why I probably also carry an OCD diagnosis)

if an ASPD grows up in a loving home ie one with good instruction, follow through and all that good stuff the ASPD has a great chance of growing up to become something good for society like a firefighter, bomb disposal technician etc as opposed to a criminal.

I like this.

A primary sociopath would have by theory a percentage of genetic predisposition to ASPD. So whatever type of household he came from he would still portray some of what is typically associated with ASPD right. But he would still dispite being employed in a good for society job. And by nature have that criminal element. What's funny is people point out the good for society job as if the individual is somehow different then the one working in a book store or not at all. Society judges in odd way's.

where we all are watching a car crash in slow motion- but none of us can do anything to stop it.

Those who get behind the wheel should first know how to drive. Some thing's are avoidable. If the driver choose to ignore the warning sign's, even when bystander's are waving red-flag's for them. Then it is willful. And in that case i say take a seat and enjoy the show.

Part of my asking for advice is that I have extreme anxiety

I understand this. We do have a good selection of Anxiety forum.

So I am a HPD asking how to get over and get back at a NPD.

A ball-peen hammer a straight razor and a vice-grip.

Seriously this site wasnt intended to be a place to come and get advice on getting back at someone. The fact people come here for that and do get the advice is a matter of those helping them hasnt been brought to the adimin's attention. I dont think that would be tolerated.

mylife, i think it is great that you are here as we can gather insight from you, and of course., you really are hpd. i see what goldendragon is saying, as well, like a slow car crash. but, a lot of us have been engaging in slow car crash type behaviour so we can all just help eachother...