Is it really possible to fully heal/recover with alters stil

Bringing this back because I have another question.

Is it true that final fusion is a "choice"? If, say, you ended up with a 'system' that you felt fully comfortable with, however many parts that may be, and you wanted to remain that way, is that "possible"? Like, could you "fully recover/heal" and still stay as separate parts, albeit much more integrated, but just not fully fuse? I hope that makes sense what I'm trying to ask.

ethanthealien wrote:Is it true that final fusion is a "choice"?

Yes. Alters cannot fuse or stay fused unless they want to.

ethanthealien wrote:could you "fully recover/heal" and still stay as separate parts, albeit much more integrated, but just not fully fuse?

Yes. It is called "resolution" or "functional multiplicity".

A lot of people confuse "functional multiplicity" with "cooperation". Cooperation is when alters cooperate with each-others but there is still amnesia, triggers, flashbacks... Resolution (functional multiplicity) is when you are fully healed from trauma, have no amnesia, no depersonalisation/derealization/that kind of symptoms, and still have different identities. Though at this point they are no longer called "alters" since they are like many faces of the same person rather than many persons in a trenchcoat.

The ISSTD Guidelines https://www.isst-d.org/wp-content/uploa ... ED2011.pdf explain that "final fusion" is NOT a requirement anymore to be considered "healed". In order to be considered "healed" you need to heal your traumas so that you no longer qualify for any PTSD diagnosis. Does not matter how many identities (parts) you are. You do you.

It does not even matter why you want/need to remain separate identities.

With my therapist we don't even talk about fusing or anything. We do regular mappings of the system just to follow my progresses, but the goal of therapy is to learn how to live a healthy life free of trauma. How your brain/system organizes itself depends on what you need. Some people need one identity. Some people need many. It can change depending on your needs. What matter is not how you get organized inside but that it is organized. Your brain manages its own organization system and your therapist helps you healing from the pain. And you are in the middle of it and just relax and enjoy the result of all this hard work.

ethanthealien wrote:Bringing this back because I have another question.

Is it true that final fusion is a "choice"? If, say, you ended up with a 'system' that you felt fully comfortable with, however many parts that may be, and you wanted to remain that way, is that "possible"? Like, could you "fully recover/heal" and still stay as separate parts, albeit much more integrated, but just not fully fuse? I hope that makes sense what I'm trying to ask.

From my experience until now, it seems it's a choice.
This past year, we had a lot of traumas and stuff resolved, which resulted in a huge wave of unexpected integration. We began the year with ~15 alters. Around September, we were only 6 left. Around November, 3. Now, we're only 2.

There's still parts of us not fully integrated, bits of unresolved traumas, etc. but they don't feel like totally dissociated and separate parts anymore. They mostly relate to the identity of the two remaining alters.

Those two remaining alters never wanted to merge. We've always said we wouldn't run away or toward fusion, we would just let it happens when it needs to happen, but truth is, Daem and I would hate to merge together. It never felt right. It was easier to imagine fusing with our persecutor parts, who were the complete opposite of me, with behaviors I really struggled to accept, than to imagine fusing with him.

So, when we saw how uncontrollable the waves of integration were, we were scared we wouldn't have the choice now our brain is healing. But... It doesn't seem ready to happen for now. We're not dissociated anymore, we mostly feel like one, we have access to resources and memories of each other, we're able to keep our outside behaviors coherent without much efforts as we're always co-conscious, we just still have differences in our thoughts and emotions, and how we relate to them. Like... We don't give each other a "it's not me" feeling, but more a "it's my soulmate, my other-half, me-but-a-bit-different" feeling.

The only way I can explain it is : we're not heavily dissociated ego states now, we're just separate ego states. Keeping our sense of identity separate is a choice. I could identify with Daem's behaviors and thoughts, I just don't want to ; like he doesn't want to identify with my behaviors and thoughts, even if he can.

I think as we never had a chance to develop a "whole" sense of identity (our traumas started at birth and "active" abuse started at 2yo), as we've used a lot the separation between us as a tool to help with our healing, it just feels more natural for us to organize ourselves (behaviors, thoughts, resources...) that way, even without dissociation.

So yep, right now, it's 100% our choice to not reach final fusion. At this stage, I feel like if we were able to accept being one, our brain would immediately make it happens. There's literally nothing stopping it but the comfort of a well-known functioning, and the attachment Daem and I have for each other.

We'll see if it stays that way :'D

The only way I can explain it is : we're not heavily dissociated ego states now, we're just separate ego states. Keeping our sense of identity separate is a choice. I could identify with Daem's behaviors and thoughts, I just don't want to ; like he doesn't want to identify with my behaviors and thoughts, even if he can.

That makes sense!
I've just seen a lot of people say that fusion isn't a choice, at least for them(?). I've seen people say that they never get a choice to fuse or not, and that even alters who didn't want to fuse still fused. So it confused me.

ethanthealien wrote:That makes sense!
I've just seen a lot of people say that fusion isn't a choice, at least for them(?). I've seen people say that they never get a choice to fuse or not, and that even alters who didn't want to fuse still fused. So it confused me.

I thought about that, and I would make the hypothesis unwanted fusions are the ones necessary to improve the functioning. If all the separation were solely existing thanks to dissociation, then yep, the person might not have any choice.

Like I said, we didn't have a choice in all the fusion/integration we had this year. Once we stopped dissociating enough, once we developed a strong sense of safety, it just happened. It was a bit scary, at first, to suddenly discover I was 100% identifying with thoughts and behaviors I wasn't used to see as mine before - but it quickly became our new "normal", as it is so much easier to function that way.

On the other hand, if the separation isn't solely due to dissociation, if it's a way to see yourself and you functioning beyond that, if it has cultural roots, etc. then I think it's when it becomes your choice. After all, beyond "healed DID/functional multiplicity", non-pathological multiplicity exists. It doesn't work like DID, it doesn't disturb the person's life, it can be parts of cultural beliefs, etc. and it's a way to be with yourself and the world.

For us, there are a lot of reasons explaining why staying multiple makes more sense. The main ones are :
- we have ADHD and our emotions are usually quick to rise and too strong for ourselves, so separation is a really needed tool to "diffuse" them, to be able to integrate them slowly and not just have our brain jump into DP every time something happens. One might see it a functional transient dissociation, like avoiding the "personification" stage of the integration process until the emotion is regulated enough ; opening a deviation road to make the traffic more fluid.
- as a whole, I am genderfluid female-male, so having a female ego state and a male ego state able to blend to different levels just... makes sense.
- we also have spiritual beliefs related to being multiple.

Some of us also have really strong spiritual belief's re being multiple too. One is believed by everyone to be a reincarnation of our mother's spirit and accepted as such and not seen by any human host as a 'version of me'.

There are also other non-human beings in the system who have never been seen as 'human past hosts/versions of me' but who are a critical, essential and much loved part of the system and inner world.

I don't know how much that 'time' (as in years spent dissociative and undiagnosed ,no 'therapy' etc) plays a part but our body is in its 50's and we have never had any therapy for being DID or even told anyone in the outside world of our 'inner world' or 'the secret others'. This is literally the only forum on the internet where we have allowed 'others' to come out and introduce themselves.

The outside world see's only 'one host' and that is who every human host acts as when fronting in public etc. For purposes of 'outside world functioning' we have actively chosen to remain a covert system. That maybe because of lifetime of bullying for being different for other more obvious physical reasons we know how much prejudice there is out there particularly towards 'mental illness' as opposed to physical. ...sad but still very true..even in 2023! ...someone left in a wheelchair from a car accident or something like MS/MND will automatically get much more sympathy and understanding than someone seen as 'mentally ill' ...even for 'learning disabilities' it seems to depend if you have something seen as 'sweet/cute' such as Down's syndrome as opposed to being considered 'odd' or having 'challenging behaviour issues'.

Jay

One of the things I'd like to add is that we've had to overcome a certain level of, I guess you could call it, 'assumption of low level multiplicity' with our T. Because we're autistic and mask, it was hard for her to understand that there's a lot of separation between the different 'masks'. I have never read anything about masking being a form of dissociation, but now I have to wonder if it is. But, like, when shopping we can appear NT so long as it's me and Leila. We're still autistic and wear gloves and listen to music (but who doesn't these days?), but we can approach people and even talk. It goes beyond masking into something else entirely.

Regarding spiritual beliefs, we've always thought that we had to step in and protect others from a 'corrupted soul'. One of our twenty has always felt like an 'outsider', and we've kind of circled back to that.

Overall, from what we've read, it has seemed to be very much up to the system.

Vi

ViTheta wrote:I have never read anything about masking being a form of dissociation, but now I have to wonder if it is

It does involve some level of dissociation because in order to mask efficiently, you need to disconnect from your emotions/sensory input. It is discussed, among other things, in: https://did-research.org/comorbid/devel ... -disorders

ArbreMonde wrote:[quote="ViTheta"It does involve some level of dissociation because in order to mask efficiently, you need to disconnect from your emotions/sensory input. It is discussed, among other things, in: https://did-research.org/comorbid/devel ... -disorders

Thank you. either it got missed or filed away and forgotten. It is extremely annoying that happens with such regularity. Truthfully, it seems to happen with distressing regularity with subjects which are difficult to work though or when the vocabulary/language choices don't fit what is expected.

ViTheta wrote: It goes beyond masking into something else entirely.

Vi

I think this is why Kit originally started her research in the direction of Autism Masking and then when people weren't describing exactly what Kit knew was within she started looking at other things being mixed in with the autism.

Jay