Read something about parts versus alters

This was really key for me, Rive, writing things down. From the first day an alter who clearly wasn't me fronted, for that hour, at least, there was no doubt it wasn't me, I went home and started writing. I wrote about what Jack did and said, what I thought about it, then later what other alters did and said, and I wrote what I thought about it then, including massive doubts. I recorded those. Once stuff was written, I kept going back and re-reading them. I would never have remembered most of it if I hadn't recorded it.

I typed all this into documents online, that happened to work better for me than writing on paper.

But especially, having it and re-reading it helped block most of the doubt from the beginning. My denial just never got out of hand because I had written down so many of my thoughts -- especially about denial. It was all right there on paper, outside of my head. I have always doubted my own experience to some extent. But I didn't doubt that I wrote what I wrote. There was just too much content there to ignore or deny it. And my desire to ignore and deny it was also recorded!

Rive,
There is a defensive instinct which says, "If I can understand what is happening, then I can be safe." This is the strength of logical mind which relies on objective proof. This is a good trait to be able to see things objectively and think your way through problems. It is useful in the objective world, but your inner world is subjective. You were raised in an environment that made no sense. When the logical mindset is locked in a defensive stance, it can become obsessive-compulsive thinking. You're looping and you're stuck. You're thinking and thinking but you're not observing and you're stuck.

Try to observe and accept rather than analyzing and judging your alternate aspects. Just let them exist. This is something I have done that helped me with self-doubt and denial. You should be in a place where you're very relaxed, preferably if you're going to sleep or waking up. At this time it is easier to access the unconscious mind which is different from the logical mind.

Imagine there is a stage and invite your mind to do what it will on the stage. The reason I say a stage is because its purpose is to tell a story with actors. You can be an actor on your stage if you want, or you can just watch what your mind does. So it doesn't matter if it's "real" or not because it's a story. This is your subjective reality. This is your dream, and dreams are nonsense to the logical mind but that's okay. Maybe you'll have trouble at first, but sometimes things take time and practice.

Hi Rive
I hope you are doing better. I know you are posting the doubts that goes on in your mind, when you are in that state of mind, it's hard or near impossible to take in what anyone tells you, even if they are well meaning. Even if what they say makes sense. Because your mind just goes into denial and start the doubting all over when anyone tells you it's a yes or no. There is no test like a ' pregnancy test' that gives you a positive or negative test result, you got to remind yourself that and observe your symptoms as a whole.
I think what you and Johnny Jack says is good, writing a denial book. And write denial as a symptom too, because well it's what alot of people including my husband has.
What helpe my husband was me taking a neutral stance and just being there for him when he was in denial. Telling him it's okay not have it figured out right now, take it slow. Because pushing him in the direction to believe it, his mind takes him running in the opposite direction. I know it's not my issue, it's him, something he got to come to accept in his own time. So we took our time. I stopped trying to convince him, and just goes like when you find out either way, I will support you be it you realise you have did or not. Truth is I knew it before him.
One thing is, you have only tried communicating via internal dialogue? Perhaps not expecting a instant reply, give it time. What about just leaving out notes around your room, Hi I am Rive, I have been wanting to get to know you better. If you would like that, you can indicate here. It may take weeks/months to get a response but just check the note sometimes while you let go of this anxiety and live your life. Take it slow, when the right time comes for you to get to know, you will find out then.

Rive wrote:So I read the big difference between having parts (IFS) and having alters is alters can operate independently. I have never really had much more than passive influence. No real switches. Does that mean all these thoughts that seem foreign could just be parts everyone has? I can't imagine anyone that has parts not alters would have thoughts of liking superman or Tell me their name. Or can parts do that too?

in IFS workbook it says parts do have their own perspective, feelings, memories goals motivations. a person does switch with parts, yes parts can think and talk like you posted.

btw you do realize by now that my t's post alters vs parts and all the others you keep looking at has things missing from it. She can tell when you are reading her posts cause in the profile it says the alst 10 members to visit her profile page thats how people find her past posts. She's been posting only integration stuff for months now and you keep mentioning reading about things she has posted in the past mentioning post titles. you must know by now that my T leaves things out of her posts on purpose like so that she can recognize when people are taking her posts other places and so that people cant use her posts to pretend or fit or self diagnose with her posts. I read some of her posts where she says to you not to try and use her posts to be them cause she made them on purpose not match the "typical stuff found by google"

instead of posting about what you are reading maybe post about what you are going through, it dont matter what my T is posting related to you, what my T posts is about my T. you will only get more mixed up by trying to put T's posts on you.

get the IFS workbook called self therapy workbook an Exercise Workbook for the IFS process by Bonnie J Weiss LCSW that book will tell you what parts are and what your IFS therapy is. your parts and alters will make more sense to you bercause you are the one answering the worksheet questions

This IFS starts to seem more and more like some kind of cult to me.

Andikirkwood, I didn't get that from what your T wrote. I don't understand why your T would tell you that information anyway. That seems weird to me. I don't take what your T says with a grain of salt anymore. She is very confusing. She always claims to be right and shoots down what other people say if it doesn't match what she says. If she works for you, great. I'm not interested in discussing this any further.

Let me explain Andi. There is this leader figure. She has patients and she tells them how they are like. She tells them to go in Forums, but those Forums are not allowed to disagree or question "how the patients feel they are". That is inside the "" marks for reason. I really deeply suspect not one of the patients went to her telling those things about parts and alters. So it's not patients feelings that are supposed to to be protected, it's how the leader made them see themselves that's sacred. There's lot of conflict every time someone does ask questions. It's always sign of unhealthy relationship/community when you're not allowed to question it's methods.

This leader is supposed to be an actual therapist to people, but they're not actual patients. They're some kind of defenders of the leader who spread the word and go and tell other people how questioning is wrong. You're not allowed to study the topic, you're only allowed to join.

What kind of T uses her clients to do some kind of dirty work for her like this? She is not the member of this forum, but we should have some kind of huge respect to her. Sorry, I don't. She's one forum member of some other forum. Non of us need to agree with her.

Just stop bringing her fights in here. Rive is allowed to tell what she has read. Your leader has to understand that when she writes something to open platform, in internet, people can use it. She can track it all she wants and send people after those who do, and it all tells how there's something really off. It's more than weird that a T tells her patients how she tracks people who disagree wit her and who she tracks.

So what? We are allowed to talk about anything we wants about IFS in here, based on something that was published long time ago or recently or never before. You coming here again to play defender of this -ism makes it look super weird. You have no rights to silence us. Did not have before, will not have in the future either. Just accept it. Go tell your leader we do not worship.

Rive wrote:Andikirkwood, I didn't get that from what your T wrote. I don't understand why your T would tell you that information anyway. That seems weird to me. I don't take what your T says with a grain of salt anymore. She is very confusing. She always claims to be right and shoots down what other people say if it doesn't match what she says. If she works for you, great. I'm not interested in discussing this any further.

She aint tell me the stuff about parts, its in the IFS workbook quoted word for word, she didnt tell me bout you visiting her profile page, I saw it when yesterday in therapy she opened her profile over there to show me how to make changes to my profile and she showed me how to tell when others visit my profile by showing me her last visitors to her profile list.

she did not show me her alters vs parts thread I read it myself with my own account. I read all her old posts. many I dont agree with but like she tells me Im not supposed to agree with everything shesposting about her not about me. cause I have read all her posts she didbnt have to tell me what she has posted to you. and she dont shoot people down she tells them to contact their own treatment providers. and she does put people on ignore when she knows they are trying to use her posts and take them elsewhere some do take that as being shot down. sher dont want to get in troubble on line so she made it that all her posts are moderated, that way even if false accusations happen she has proof. she even keeps and gives the moderators the pms that she gets. to prove she aint violating any rules and is not being rude, disrespectul or shooting anyone down.

thats ok that you take everything she posts with a grain of salt now. as it should be lol

Floralie wrote:Let me explain Andi. There is this leader figure. She has patients and she tells them how they are like. She tells them to go in Forums, but those Forums are not allowed to disagree or question "how the patients feel they are". That is inside the "" marks for reason. I really deeply suspect not one of the patients went to her telling those things about parts and alters. So it's not patients feelings that are supposed to to be protected, it's how the leader made them see themselves that's sacred. There's lot of conflict every time someone does ask questions. It's always sign of unhealthy relationship/community when you're not allowed to question it's methods.

This leader is supposed to be an actual therapist to people, but they're not actual patients. They're some kind of defenders of the leader who spread the word and go and tell other people how questioning is wrong. You're not allowed to study the topic, you're only allowed to join.

What kind of T uses her clients to do some kind of dirty work for her like this? She is not the member of this forum, but we should have some kind of huge respect to her. Sorry, I don't. She's one forum member of some other forum. Non of us need to agree with her.

Just stop bringing her fights in here. Rive is allowed to tell what she has read. Your leader has to understand that when she writes something to open platform, in internet, people can use it. She can track it all she wants and send people after those who do, and it all tells how there's something really off. It's more than weird that a T tells her patients how she tracks people who disagree wit her and who she tracks.

So what? We are allowed to talk about anything we wants about IFS in here, based on something that was published long time ago or recently or never before. You coming here again to play defender of this -ism makes it look super weird. You have no rights to silence us. Did not have before, will not have in the future either. Just accept it. Go tell your leader we do not worship.

she is a member here just not posting in dissociation. she dont post on this board cause when she came here it was for a different reason.

I aint bringing the fight from one site to another. Im not the one posting I read somewhere else this or that. I was just trying to tell rive they need to stop worrying about what other people are posting and post what rive is going through. I used my T for example this time cause rives tittle was the same as my T's thread title elsewhere and rives posts in this thread contained stuff from that other thread by my T. if you read rives posts and are on more than one site its easy to figure out where the posts are coming from.

I dont always agree with my T. she tells me thats ok Im not supposed to agree,and I wasnt defending her against rive. I was telling rive not to try and be like her posts. to post about what rive goes through, Also what I said to rive about parts having their own perceptions feelings and all came from page chapter 1 basic IFS concepts page 3 first paragraph in the IFS workbook "Self Therapy Workbook, An Exercise Book for the IFS Process" by Bonnie J Weiss LCSW (who is not my T)

It is Rive in the first post of this thread that said they are doing IFS. thats why I gave Rive the information on this workbook and what the workbook says parts are, so that if rive wants to they can get the book off amazon.

Floralie wrote:Let me explain Andi. There is this leader figure. She has patients and she tells them how they are like. She tells them to go in Forums, but those Forums are not allowed to disagree or question "how the patients feel they are". That is inside the "" marks for reason. I really deeply suspect not one of the patients went to her telling those things about parts and alters. So it's not patients feelings that are supposed to to be protected, it's how the leader made them see themselves that's sacred. There's lot of conflict every time someone does ask questions. It's always sign of unhealthy relationship/community when you're not allowed to question it's methods.

This leader is supposed to be an actual therapist to people, but they're not actual patients. They're some kind of defenders of the leader who spread the word and go and tell other people how questioning is wrong. You're not allowed to study the topic, you're only allowed to join.

What kind of T uses her clients to do some kind of dirty work for her like this? She is not the member of this forum, but we should have some kind of huge respect to her. Sorry, I don't. She's one forum member of some other forum. Non of us need to agree with her.

Just stop bringing her fights in here. Rive is allowed to tell what she has read. Your leader has to understand that when she writes something to open platform, in internet, people can use it. She can track it all she wants and send people after those who do, and it all tells how there's something really off. It's more than weird that a T tells her patients how she tracks people who disagree wit her and who she tracks.

So what? We are allowed to talk about anything we wants about IFS in here, based on something that was published long time ago or recently or never before. You coming here again to play defender of this -ism makes it look super weird. You have no rights to silence us. Did not have before, will not have in the future either. Just accept it. Go tell your leader we do not worship.

my T isnt traking anyone on other sites. last visitor is just something that all accounts have, no way to disable it. I sent a message to the website creator of psych central and asked them to take it off. he said theres no way to disable it I can click on the arrow and not see it myself but it will still keep track of who visits my profile. since its the same website my T is on I know she cant get rid of it either and she's not tracking me or anyone. its just part of the site that it keeps track of how many people visit the profiles and shows the names of the last 10 visitors. if you have an account over there your profile has it too and theres no way to get rid of it. you can close it so you dont see it but anyone who visits your profile will see how many people visited your profile and the names of the last ten to visit. like sites keep track of replies and number of members some sites keep track of visits per profile.