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Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

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Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Wed May 16, 2018 2:15 pm

Hello everybody,

If you all don't mind, we're going to use this topic for our findings concerning the psychology behind DID, but also about the mindcontrol we had to deal with. I invite you to do the same. Welcome.

Just now I discovered a patern we're dealing with while becoming more aware of the DID, the abuse and the complexity within the system. Unfortunately our abusers weren't only sadists but also skilled programmers, so we are not only dealing with naturally formed parts who disagree with any progress, but also with wat we call 'one trick pony parts' who sabotage, act on cues we don't know yet, and I've even identified a 'reporter' who still, without knowing why and how, reported our progress to the main abuser. To everybody who dealt with the same kind of abuse; you're stronger than you think, and they have less control over you than you think. For example; once identified, we were able to stop the reporter without much problems. It was scary when first noticing this, but it is empowering to know that we are in fact able to fight this, with our own strong will. I also already dealt with some 'spinprogramming' (willing to explain this) parts; turns out you can just ask them to stop.

About the patern. EA was starting to learn more about the others, Robin woke up after being inactive for eight months (and she didn't freak out!), we worked together on deciding to end toxic friendships (thanks for the advice and support, everybody who responded to our topic about it) and counterproductive therapy, I 'turned' the reporter; long story short; a lot of good things were happening. Intense, hard, but good.


And everytime this happens; getting somewhere, I turn into chaos, despair, depression, and hurt or sad littles front a lot. We don't know if the progress itself is a trigger to this, just like a 'none mindcontrol based DID system' might act, or if we missed a cue (who knows, we might even send the cues ourselves), but it is very clear and recognizable now that some kind of button is pushed on these moments that turns me into scrambled eggs.

Connecting with not only 'here and now', but also with the people on this website, helps a great deal. Thank you all. We are back on our feet again.

And now I can focus on daily chores and keeping us healthy again:) In stead of making a schedule, I've asked on paper what everybody would like to do and when. We'll see! Let's make this a dreamteam.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby birdsong87 » Wed May 16, 2018 2:35 pm

what seems like the first rule in overcoming RA/MC:
question everything, doubt your reality, all the time
Dx: DID cPTSD
L (host 1); Asti (host 2); Annett (teen protector); Maya (child); Age (observer); Thamara (child); Danielle (aut. teen); Mike (caregiver) and others
our blog on resources: https://www.dis-sos.com
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Wed May 16, 2018 2:40 pm

birdsong87 wrote:what seems like the first rule in overcoming RA/MC:
question everything, doubt your reality, all the time


And that's pretty damn scary, but, yes, I totally agree.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Thu May 17, 2018 8:26 pm

Haven't read this anywhere, so I don't know if this is common, but I have reasons to believe that we have introjects of the main abuser in every team/group/system, according to the trauma's they carry. My trauma is psychological and intellectual abuse; whenever I learn something, 'invent', or whenever I think I can trust my judgement, these destroying thoughts appear and the face mimics the very negative expressions the main abuser used to have. We've been noticing these facial expressions earlier when one of the DV's was triggered, but then the thoughts and actions are more brutal and different. Same goes for EA, Robin and Bart; each in their own 'field', same introject, or other introject from the same person, but very different thoughts and actions.

This was very scary for EA, last night, when becoming aware of this. How to accept, hear and even thank a perfect copy of this psychopathic abuser? Even more alarming; this gets triggered by 'outsiders' as well. We truelly hope we didn't cause people harm with this.

On the other hand, when thinking about those moments I now recognize; we had a lot of antisocial people in our lives, and I think socials didn't trigger this. Kind of makes sense to send 'her' on those moments? This also puts the toxic friendship we ended recently in another daylight; they had a blast, together. They were equals. It also just did not affect him when she lashed out. I thought he was very forgiving, but that's projection.. (In come the destroying thoughts; how narcissistic to think this).

So I think I found a reason to thank these introjects; thank you for recognizing antisocials, and for protecting us from them. Next step; we don't have to entertain them.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Fri May 18, 2018 12:55 pm

Now I think I know when I'm me ( :shock: ) I won't use a color for my own posts anymore. I'm sorry if we confuse or even trigger people with the changes we keep on making with the signatures and colored posts. I had a really hard time keeping us apart because all active parts also have littles and teens.

And because of the crisis we are in, we switch a lot. I also think that parts who were never able to make contact with The Outside or with us active parts, are running around in circles now, climbing on each other to get some 'out time'.

I don't want to supress anything, but I do want things to settle.

Last night I was wondering what made me surface, or, if I am a split from either Robin or ER (feel more connected with him, than with Robin) because of the traumatic events that were the beginning of this crisis/awareness (which was 'possible' because we don't have a job, for the first time ever, and the job we had was with a lot of responsibilities and hectic, and we live alone for the first time ever; we have the time now). I still don't feel a name, the EA has to do with our passportname nobody seems to want:), and I don't know if I'm an 'empty shell' OR co-aware.

I think it's the last option; I'm co-present with the rest. The rest isn't with eachother. I have too much of my own thoughts to be a shell, I think :D ER knows almost everything that happens, but a lot of it isn't 'his own memory'. Robin and Bart also begin to 'notice', be involved more. I think that's a good thing.

If the four of us can work together smoothly, that would be great. Robin was there for the jobs, finances, communication with companies, social life, performing with the art we sometimes performed with (no wonder she couldn't keep up with also cleaning the house and stuff. Besides, she dissociated a lot because she's intimidated easily:(). Bart was there for really hard work, physical, in tough surroundings, fronting when Robin was intimidated, fixing stuff around the house, and he loves his political discussions; he's our social justice warrior. ER somehow managed to keep a hold of all the IQ points we once had. It made us skip classes and stuff. This was when we were really young. We don't have any diploma's or anything. Things went downhill early. And he also was the reason Robin climbed to the top of the company where we had our last job. Our last T thought he stole ideas from Freud when he presented new theories about DID; he didn't. He's hardly ever out because he's always scared he's actually crazy, stupid, etc.

I suddenly know what I can do for us; I'm going to take care of us and encourage them to be more of who they are, so that they can actually do something with their skills. They never really got the chance long enough. Maybe Robin can help with timemanagement for that, and with the 'meetings' we'll have to have to get a good picture of all our needs and responsibilities:)

To everybody who reads this; I hope you have a nice day.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby VioletFlux » Fri May 18, 2018 2:04 pm

Hi Efragment,

Sounds like you're making some good progress and sorting things out, though from the sound of it you have a whole lot going on there.

Hope you're having a good day.

-Violet (1)
Most Active: Violet aka V2 (16); Melissa (7); Viola (17); Rebecca (∞);
L---- (14); Protectors: Charlie (6); Mike (35); Littles: Arin (6); Janet (4);
Body: 49f; Dx: DID; previously depression, bipolar.
Our Journey Thread - The whole Flux System
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Fri May 18, 2018 2:15 pm

Yes, it's a lot.. Thank you very much, Violet 1
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Fri May 18, 2018 11:02 pm

Posting this for documentation; if we need a date, we can find that here.

ER and I want to integrate, we felt ourselves talking together just now, this felt powerful, I already mentioned feeling more connected with him, and this morning I was thinking how effective it would be to integrate with him and 'ANP' with Robin and Bart. (Edit: is this controlling or cooperative of me?)

Our trauma's were the easiest; neglect, abandonment and psychological and intellectual abuse. Trauma's we can handle by studying and practicing. We know we face 'MC' as well, so we are not going to try this now.

Steps we need to follow;

Stabilize & welcome parts

Learn about the MC

Treat DID

We believe integrations happen spontanious during succesful treatment.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Sat May 19, 2018 11:30 am

****TW; graphic, details RA/MC, detailed description of internal debate concerning boundaries, privacy, oversharing, triggering ourselves.****

Everytime before writing about this in public, we have debates. We ofcourse always had zero concept of our own boundaries. And it's how we were trained. Robin always thought she had to 'give it' when a man showed sexual interest, and she always felt obligated to 'report' éverything we do, think, say. Confessiontime. Having zero privacy. Being instructed.

Then there's the normal attachmentissue that can also cause oversharing.

Then there's the walking minefield of triggers and cues we are, and not knowing exactly what we can and can not touch yet. Or, not trusting the fact we actually do know, inside.

Bart has a big say in this. We always come to the conclusion, because of him, that there's hardly any lucid detailed information about this available that's written or told by survivors themselves. We want to make a contribution. We want to help by sharing how we approach this. Feel free to contribute if you recognize stuff or have something to add. Everything's welcome, reader.

We read a quote from Allison Miller (skilled T who deals with RA/MC), about how she learned from survivors who came up with 'deprogramming' methodes themselves. This helped ER a lot, who is of the impression we can do way more ourselves than we think or are told by T's with unclear agenda's or knowledge.

So we're also helping ER with this to trust his judgement. And Bart for the 'justice'; not only do we want to help by sharing the approach, we want to help by telling the world survivors of horrific stuff do exist, even in luxury countries like ours, in Western Europe. And we are 'one of them'. The experiments, 'treatments', and brainwashing that was done to us, resemble WOII experiments. Just the fact alone that this actually happend in WOII, should tell you, reader, that it's possible this also happens in organized groups all over the world. Just because they can.

=========================================================================

Documenting the above about integrating with ER (for the first time, this sentiment was there from the beginning, off and on, in different ways), turned on a program. A mantra, this time. This happens a lot; thoughts that repeat the same thing over and over again. ER keeps on wondering if the abusers weren't as skilled as we often think (we ofcourse were forced to believe that, to be intimidated by them, full of admiration, to not question anything but ourselves, etc).

While the mantra was 'played' (it had something to do with 'never create solutions'), we felt a Br laughing; idiots, did they really think they could design us like that? Newsflash; they failed! They made a lot of mistakes! One of them being; not noticing the hawk. The hawk is ours (the pitbull is theirs. Main abuser even trained it in plain sight with a dog wistle. When ER connected thát dot (the dog wistle seemed normal to all), I ofcourse wondered if I'm just totally crazy, but the 'scrambled eggs' sensation wasn't there).

We only just learned that this is a 'floater'. Did they even know all systems have floaters? It makes a lot of sense; sometimes when you dissociate, you leave the body, look from above at what's happening. Your imagination literaly brings you to a distance from it. And the floater doesn't feel anything. There are several ways to dissociate, this is one of them, and it created the hawk who sees and memorizes éverything. Whenever he reports to US, the memories, flashbacks, or just plain information, feel 'flat', not 'alive', very dry, very, very detailed, and the pictures I get, are pictures of a girl I see, undergowing true horror. Every other flashback from other parts, invole me feeling it happening to me, in stead of seeing it as if I'm looking at someone else from a distance.

So, we were not impressed by that program. At all. We just recognized it's there, we didn't turn into scrambled eggs, and we can conclude it's not working (anymore).

We are going to claim all parts as ours. From the minute we started being aware and therefore healing, we took a stand; no more. Show's over.


That's it for now. For whoever reads this; I hope you have a great day. Be safe.
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Re: Discovering paterns. TW. Process, MC/RA

Postby Efragment » Sat May 19, 2018 12:09 pm

Just to clarify; the picture of the girl I see when the hawk reports is 'me'. And yes, that's weird.

We also know that abusers who think it's fun to torture others like this, implant false memories, in our case to make the world not believe us/make us look crazy. We've felt this from the very beginning; the none authentic 'urge' to go to conspiracyland or have borderline-like outbursts. That's not who we are, never have been. We've also never been psychotic (hallelujah for that one; that would've complicated stuff bigtime).

I often recognize this patern in other survivors. Conspiracy thoughts, 'scrambled' thoughts. This can very well be too much dopamine in your own brain, but it can also be there on purpose to keep the secrets a secret.
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