Offence of "making indecent images" your thoughts.

Some will know my situation from other posts.

What I find unfair is the term "making images" i.e the law says if you download images from the internet you are guilty of making them from parts accessed via the internet. But the person who made them is the person who photographed them or video'd them. You are merely obtaining a copy of the original. Also allowing to share them also means you have distributed them or shown them to others, but anyone with half a brain knows that peer 2 peer software works on the basic principle of people sharing files to get files, so you are in effect stuck in a situation that usually you have to share them to get them. This all seems a little unfair, I also would say the majority of people would not necessarily know this or at the least would not realise this is the case, I certainly had never given it that much thought.

Do you think it is fair to charge people with "making" rather than "possession"?

If you were involved in this situation would knowing what you could be charged if found out for change your outlook on viewing said images?

Would you agree with being charged for "distributing" via peer 2 peer software or would you say that would be more appropriate to sharing them directly with other people for example via email etc?

I am interested in everyone's views on this as it is something I certainly never knew or realised to some extent.

There are things that often need to be discussed to be understood or taken in context rather than one law fit all, but if so how can a law be applied differently to individual cases?

There are things I know now that would very likely have made me think twice about what I did, maybe I was just too blind to see it. The saying "if I only knew what I know now, I would have done things very differently" is how I feel.

I think generally if you're using p2p, you need to be wary of how they work. I never thought of that before actually, but it makes sense they could get you for distribution. As far as technicalities, I think laws should change in the US because children pornography to me is small children below 13. Consequences for possession of images or videos involving underage teens should be treated differently because these days, many go on webcam or take videos of themselves. Laws haven't caught up with technology. I think in Germany, they term it "youth porn" which is still illegal to posess, but doesn't incur the same sentences as outright CP.

As far as "creation" of the material in your case, that doesn't make sense, unless they're going to the ludacrous conclusion that distribution on a p2p network classifies as creation since you're basically uploading a copy of the original file to other people on the network.

Laws in these matters are tricky and often too much of a grey area, unfortunately. In some cases, images of clothed children can classify as CP if they deem the individual as having deviant desires. Things should be clearer than they often are.

In my simple opinion which I know is hard I would say stay away from all of that stuff because if you are caught they don't care if you made it or what not, they know that you have it and they are not going to be easy on you no matter what. I know its hard to stay away from things that you may enjoy but you gotta do it if you don't wanna feel guilty or paranoid your entire life, that is why I am so glad the police took all mine when I was sent to prison!

The logic behind it is that if you download an image then you have created a new copy that didn't exist before, thereby contributing to proliferation. Naturally the law distinguishes between the sexual offence and the creation of images. By charging you with making an image, therefore, the court is not drawing a parallel between the downloader and the sexual miscreant, but rather a parallel between the person who created the original image and the person who created the copy.

From the technology standpoint, if you are using P2P you are both creating and distributing. In my state, I also know they segregate the law (by one degree of felony from another) between 15-17 year olds and anything younger. As far as I can tell, it makes sense. The punishments may seem relatively disproportionate, but that's part an attempt to deal with severe offenders and a bit of politics. Judges also have discretion in their sentencing at the end of the process. The police, DA, Judge, and supporting politicians all "look good" when they crack down on people for this.

Thanks for the replies, I appreciate all the people taking the time to respond and offer their viewpoint.

I suppose the problem was having the mindset I was only viewing stuff that had already been created therefore it wasn't as bad as those actually making it.

Obviously I now have to deal with things as they happen, but I am so far 8 months clean from that stuff, and I very much doubt I will ever relapse, I have no intention whatsoever to search for those things ever again.

revolutionex wrote: As far as technicalities, I think laws should change in the US because children pornography to me is small children below 13. Consequences for possession of images or videos involving underage teens should be treated differently because these days, many go on webcam or take videos of themselves.

It's true that these teens are not necessarily harmed while the record is made, but it becomes potentially harmfull when the record is released on the internet. Most of them have not consented to it. That's why those records should not be publicly available.

Hey I have a better question, do you think it's fair to be a child in one of those videos? Speaking from personal experience I can say no it's physically painful, frightening, soul destroying and makes you suicidal. Why don't you stop focussing on self pity and legal technicalities and start focussing on the sick reality. I hate you

11alexandra, I like the way you think. Let's focus on what the child in the video wants. In your case, you don't want your images out there, and I think your wish should be respected the same as any other victim of child pornographers.

That said, I don't like the way our laws are structured to dishonestly punish people under crimes other than they were written for. I don't like the mission creep that means you can get more prison time for downloading a file than you can for molesting a child.

11alexandra wrote:Hey I have a better question, do you think it's fair to be a child in one of those videos? Speaking from personal experience I can say no it's physically painful, frightening, soul destroying and makes you suicidal. Why don't you stop focussing on self pity and legal technicalities and start focussing on the sick reality. I hate you

I am sorry you feel that way. The last thing I want it ti cause upset to anyone. I am sorry for what happened to you and nothing can change that for you I understand that. However I have never harmed an adult in my life let alone a child.

I posted this because I wanted to understand what things meant in a legal sense and whether people actually understand what they risk to lose being involved in such things and to prompt a discussion not for self pity.

I am nearly 12 months clean of such destructive behaviour and am getting help to deal with my problems and trying to work out what caused me to go down a very bad route in my life.

I have my own issues in life that I need to deal with which I believe is part of why I did what I did, so I am still a human being, yes I will pay for what I did and sadly I cant change the past. All I can do is try to work out where things went wrong and make sure I don't make the same mistakes.

I just want people to not make the same mistakes I did and if that enlightening people how serious things are so be it.

I don't wish to argue with you or upset you I just wanted to explain.