OCPD - Another Spouse Sufferer

Greetings,

Well, I have plenty to share, but how about a little levity first. I wrote a brief short story that parallels one of the issues I have faced in the past. I think I wrote it to resolve some inner turmoil. I'm not sure what I'll do with it. Maybe I'll share it with the wife to get her reaction. Then again... maybe not. Well, here it is for your reading pleasure.



One Day, A Very Long Time Ago…


After a long day of inventing, Mr. Caveman returned to his cave carrying something in his arms. Mrs. Caveman, noticing the strange object Mr. Caveman was bringing into the cave, decided to ask about it.

“Hey, what’cha got there?”

Mr. Caveman tried hard to contain his excitement, “Honey, what I have here is going to forever change humanity as we know it. I call this invention ‘The Wheel!’”

Looking doubtful, Mrs. Caveman asked, “What’s it for?”

“Why, it’s to make our lives a little easier! Check this out…”

With that, Mr. Caveman went and got some logs and put them on either side of the wheel. He connected the two logs with an axle through the wheel, and then attached a woven basket between the back part of the two logs. He then added two small handles at the end of the logs.

Having assembled the contraption, he proudly exclaimed, “Now, having invented the wheel, I have just now invented the wheelbarrow!”

“Ok, ok. So you’ve invented the wheel, and then the wheelbarrow, but what’s it all for?” Mrs. Caveman asked again, not feeling too comfortable with all this mess in front of her.

“Well, you know those rocks that we are constantly moving from point A to point B?” he asked, hoping to get her on board with his invention. “Well, instead of moving them by hand, which we can only carry one or two rocks at a time, now we can move 10 to 12 rocks at a time in the wheelbarrow, thus making our work more efficient. I can make you one too, and it’ll…”

“STOP!” Mrs. Caveman interjected loudly enough to echo throughout the cave. “That’s not the way we do things around here Mister…”

Mr. Caveman, trying to make a case for his new invention, explained, “Yes, I understand that’s not the way we have done things around here in the past, but, with new technology comes a new way of doing things.”

Mrs. Caveman was starting to get a little worked up, “Listen, all my life I have moved rocks by hand. It’s the way my father did it, it’s the way his father did it, and his father’s father before him. That’s just the way it’s done, and it’s the only correct way to do it!”

Mr. Caveman sheepishly tried one more time, “But, we can get more done, and I can build you one too…”

“You’re not hearing me! I neither need one, nor want one,” she replied. “Look, I can see how this invention might help some elderly and/or feeble people in getting their rocks moved, but I am neither elderly nor feeble!”

In a last ditch effort to salvage his inventions, Mr. Caveman pleaded, “Ok, I understand that you neither need one, nor want one, but can I keep one for myself. My back is starting to give out, and this invention could sure save my back for a few more years…”

At this point, Mrs. Caveman was getting visibly perturbed, “What part of ‘That’s not the way WE do things around here’ don’t you get? I don’t want that thing in my cave. I don’t need it and neither do you! End of discussion. In fact, I’m heading out to move some rocks and this thing better be gone by the time I get back…”

So, it was with a heavy heart that Mr. Caveman took his inventions and dropped them into the nearest tar pit.

And mankind had to wait another million years before somebody else invented the wheel, thus setting mankind back one million years.

Thanks for your story. With all the aggravating traits we have to endure from our favorite OCPDers, many of us find a healthy and overriding sense of humor is absolutely essential to survival.

I too wrote a story 1.5 years ago, "Bats in the Belfry." I have to re-visit it from time to time so ensure I don't get them.

Hi All,

I have been married to my wife for 14 years now, and I love her dearly. We've been to marriage counceling twice. It's always been a struggle, but it's even been more so recently. We had a really big blow-out about a month ago (more about that later) which is what prompted me to start reading about personality disorders.

I always knew something was "different" about my wife. She doesn't seem to acknowledge or understand the concept of "Choosing ones battles." All battles, from the mundane to the important, were equally attacked/defended with the same gusto and always to the bitter end, with the bitter end being, she gets her way.

I've been in IT for my whole career. I tend to process things in a logical manner. She tends to process things in an emotional manner. When logic confronts emotions, well, logic rarely wins in this household. The best way to illustrate this is to describe one of my real-life examples.

One cold winter, after previously having agreed to it, I went to the hardware store and picked up some of those clear plastic vent covers that redirects the air from shooting straight up, to venting more sideways. It seemed to work well in warming the house a little more efficiently.

Well, after winter ended, and just about the time in late spring when things started warming up, I went around and picked up all the vent covers and put them away until next winter. On the first day that the air conditioner was turned on (central air), I came home to discover that all of the vent covers had been taken out and placed on the vents. I asked why she had done that, to which she replied, "Because the air is on, and so the air circulates better."

I attempted to explain the laws of physics to her; hot air rises, cool air does not. I had to be sure to try and do it in a way that didn't offend her. When I engage in a teaching moment, she invariably sees it as "talking down" to her and/or being condescending. I tried anyway, "Honey, remember that hot-air ballon ride we took a fews years back?"

After a little bit of this, she claimed to understand that hot air rises, but when the discussion returned to removing the vent covers for the summer, she resisted... hard. "They need to stay there to better circulate the air," she insisted.

"But honey," I tried to reason, "if you direct the cool air parallel to the ground, it won't rise. The AC will work harder because it will take that much longer for the cool air to reach the thermostat, and turn it off."

"Well, I don't believe that!" This is the recurring mantra she uses now when this subject comes up. This was quickly followed by, ""Can't you just leave them there simply because that's what I want?"

This is probably the most frustrating thing to deal with, for me. The "I'm right and you're wrong" despite logic and the laws of physics pointing to the contrary.

I guess the laws of physics don't apply in my house.

That wasn't the major blow-out by the way. More on that later.

Having read quite a bit on the topic of OCPD, I realize now that I was JADEing with her (justifying, arguing, defending, explaining) which, as I understand, one shouldn't do with an OCPDer because it falls on deaf ears. But what's the alternative, other than just giving in every time?

Whew! I'm rambling, but also venting. I think it's therapeutic for me. Please bare with me.

(To be continued later...)

Then there was the time after we had purchased a new car, a mid-sized SUV.

We have a second fridge in the garage so the the parking is such that, if you pull in too far you risk hitting the front of the car when opening the fridge, and if you don't pull in far enough the garage door won't close. There's about six inches of play on either end.

One day, having grown tired of the guessing game, I did what I've seen many others do, and that was to hang a string with a weight on the end, from the ceiling, strategically placed so that when it hits the windshield upon pulling into the garage, one would know that they are in the "sweet spot." It worked perfectly. I was able to pull into the garage, just right, every time.

Well, that didn't last too long. As soon as my wife noticed it, she demanded that I take it down. When I pressed her for a reason, all she could say was, "I don't need, I don't like it, it bugs me!"

"Well, I need it. I can't judge the distance as well as you," I countered.

"No, you don't need it," she insisted. "It won't hurt you if you have to get out of the car a few times and re-adjust it. It's good exersize. It bugs me. Take it down, or I will!"

As near as I can tell, having forced the conversation again when "company" was around, and listening to the verbal jibes she would use to put the practice down, she somehow views it as a crutch of an extremely demeaning nature that should only be used by the feeble or the elderly. My OCPD take on it is, to use it would somehow demonstate that one is less than perfect.

As usual, I acquiesced.

It's when I don't tow the line that usually results in a blow-out.

I'll save that for my next post.

(To be continued...)

We have been married for 2 and 1/2 years, and while i knew there were behavoirs that i just couldnt wrap my arms around, my husband to be was so wonderful in so many ways. We seemed perfect for each other on many levels. I had been divorced for 10 years and had all but given up on finding someone to have a truly loving intimate relationship. After these past two years, i have become very anxious and depressed, because if feel that my husband wants to control my every move. He crticizes my grammer, my cooking, how i plant my roses, i am not capable of loading the diswasher or doing his laundry. And you can forget driving. He is not capable of sharing an intimate thought or connecting in any real way. He is very sarcastic and avoids answering any question with a direct answer. I am a smart, educated, very capable women, who tends to walk on egg shells. I am seeing a therapest who has stated she thinks my husband has OCPD and after researching, i think she is right. So, now what do i do? Is it possible to have a happy intimate marrage with a person with this disorder? If this is an illness, do we not take our marrage vows to heart when we say for better or worse? I am very sad and dishearted, feeling that after 10 years of trying to be so careful i have indeed made a mistake i tried so hard to avoid. Are there any words of encouragment out there?

sandy farler hoyt wrote:He is not capable of sharing an intimate thought or connecting in any real way. ...... Is it possible to have a happy intimate marriage with a person with this disorder?

Intimacy is probably the biggest issue that cannot be corrected with the current PD management tools. That is because there is a dysfunctional emotional "processor" in the brain that is further inhibited by the constant Anxieties characteristic of OCPD (and OCD). http://ocpd.freeforums.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=426

sandy farler hoyt wrote:If this is an illness, do we not take our marriage vows to heart when we say for better or worse? I am very sad and dishearted, feeling that after 10 years of trying to be so careful i have indeed made a mistake i tried so hard to avoid.

Few of us SOs knew about OCPD; it is relatively unknown. One of the first steps to dealing with the PD situation is to detach emotionally. http://ocpd.freeforums.org/search.php?keywords=detachment&terms=all&author=realitycheque&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=-1&t=0&submit=Search Only then will you be able to work your way out of the FOG. http://www.outofthefog.net/

detach emotionally?? what kind of marriage is that?

I am so glad to have found this forum. After reading many messages here, it is comforting to know that others are dealing with the same issues and that good information is available. I need to just let some stuff out here.

I am being treated for depression (that is going very well, thank goodness) and during one of the sessions, I started discussing some of the issues that my wife and I have. I am the first to admit I am not perfect but I also know that I do a lot of things well. The psychiatrist listened for a while and then said that my wife is likely OCPD. I am not sure if she is clinically OCPD but she must be close.

We have been married for 20 years and we have an autistic son. He has progressed remarkably well and will be graduating from high school this year with some excellent career plans. A lot of the credit goes to my wife for keying into diet and vitamin issues, and her OCPD characteristics were very helpful. OTOH, I have also greatly contributed to my son's stability and feelings of self worth especially since he hit puberty.

I realized a long time ago that my wife had some issues. The journey we have been on with my son has given me some insight into PDDs and I realized early on that my wife has some autistic characteristics. Autism and OCD didn't quite fit though. My son was originally diagnosed OD (oppositional defiant) and ADD/ADHD by the schools but that didn't fit. Finally we came upon Asperger's and things started falling into place. These things are more than labels; they are keys to finding out what works and what doesn't.

The OCPD suspicion re: my wife really fits, and fits much better than anything else, so maybe there is some hope.

I was OK with her personality 'quirks'. I have had to work with many different kinds of people so my definition of "normal range" is quite wide. A lot of the stuff that she does, I just let slide. There have always been some tender moments (not enough to be honest) that make up for the other crap. I've been a positive guy since I was 17 and decided one day that teen-age angst was not the way I wanted to be.

So... then my son started to grow up and she has an extremely hard time dealing with the fact that she can't just design his life for him.

Then she started pulling a lot of crap on him that she does with me such as insisting that he help her with chores and then continuously criticize him for the way he does things. This led to a pattern, starting when my son was about 12:

1. Wife and son work together (some chore)
2. Wife criticizes son in an effort to teach him the "correct way"
3. Son feels put down, gets angry, fumes, finishes chore, stomps away, spends 4 hours reading Wikipedia
4. Two days later, minor conflict between wife and son turns ugly. Neither will give in, escalates, son threatens to kill her then to kill himself.
5. I intervene, separate them and make sure they both cool down.

I tried all kinds of ways of explaining to her the dynamics that I saw. I pointed her at material that she herself had researched that pointed to different ways of handling things but she would not acknowledge at any point that she was doing something that was part of this degenerative dynamic.

I spent hours with my son talking about this (ie: he is a worthwhile person, not all his fault, momma loves him, etc etc) and the scar would start to heal when things would repeat themselves.

Finally, I started intervening before things got bad. When she started putting him down I would step in and do the chore with him but this made her angry. Eventually I put it to her that I wasn't going to let her drive him to suicide.

Since then we barely speak to each other.

I really don't want to battle her but I can't stand by and let her abuse my son. I also don't want to let him know about my OCPD suspicions or say anything negative about her to him. I really try to limit discussions to what actions people did and whether there were better ways to handle things. I steer clear of put downs or insults and I don't allow my son or daughter to name call.

It's tough. Autistic son, OCPD wife. Fairly normal daughter. And all wonderful people in their own ways. Sigh.

Thanks for listening.

FaultyHusband,

I commend your handling of your family situation. I've been forced to play the role of mediator between OCPD spouse and 17yo son with depression problems. We have a similar dynamic involving rules, right-vs-wrong ways of performing tasks, silent treatment for undermining authority, and a "normal" other child who fortunately helps buffer the two.

Talking about the OCPD actions, rather than the mom/wife herself, is an excellent way of 1) keeping the bad behaviors from being personal and 2) teaching son to address problems with others in a healthy, non-emotional manner. At his age he can understand that some people can be problematic when they fall prey to Cognitive Distortions, of which you may aware if you're being treated for depression. This helps avoid the labeling (i.e., OCPD) and the associated generalizations and stigmas, and focuses on common dysfunctional behaviors we all should be mindful of in our daily interpersonal interactions.