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How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

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How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby astraldeath » Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:53 pm

Are there any methods of going from a vulnerable narcissist with low supply to a more grandiose type?
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby AProphet » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:13 am

astraldeath wrote:Are there any methods of going from a vulnerable narcissist with low supply to a more grandiose type?


Vaknin describes one such method. Immediately following a life crysis become the counterdependant to another invert, restoring supply and shifting your patterns to the grandiose type.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby AProphet » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:26 am

Heres the excerpt. Says conversion is temporary though.


The inverted narcissist can become a classic narcissist in one (or more) of the following (typically cumulative) circumstances:

1. Immediately following a life crisis that involves the incapacitation or dysfunction of the inverted narcissist's partner (sickness, accident, demotion, divorce, devastating financial loss, death of a parent, or a child, imprisonment, loss of social status and, in general, any other narcissistic injury).
2. When the inverted narcissist, injured and disillusioned, then meets another - inverted - narcissist who restores a sense of meaning and superiority (uniqueness) to his life. The injured narcissist derives Narcissistic Supply from the inverted narcissist.
3. As part of an effort to secure a particularly desired Source of Narcissistic Supply. The conversion from inverted to classic narcissism serves to foster an attachment (bonding) between the narcissist and his source. When the narcissist judges that the source is his and can be taken for granted, he reverts to his former, inverted narcissistic self. Such a "conversion" is always temporary. It does not last and the narcissist reverts to his "default" or dominant state.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby Akuma » Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:08 am

astraldeath wrote:Are there any methods of going from a vulnerable narcissist with low supply to a more grandiose type?


Covert/overt and vulnerable/grandiose are different things so not sure what youre actually asking about. But being more open about one's strengths and successes and allowing oneself to be more self-accepting etc are pretty standard and realistic therapy goals.
dx: dissociative disorder + npd
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby AProphet » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:53 am

Akuma wrote:
astraldeath wrote:Are there any methods of going from a vulnerable narcissist with low supply to a more grandiose type?


Covert/overt and vulnerable/grandiose are different things so not sure what youre actually asking about. But being more open about one's strengths and successes and allowing oneself to be more self-accepting etc are pretty standard and realistic therapy goals.


No Akuma. Covert, inverted narcissist, narcissist codependant and overt, classical, grandiose are the same thing. Just different names.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby astraldeath » Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:05 pm

AProphet wrote:Heres the excerpt. Says conversion is temporary though.


The inverted narcissist can become a classic narcissist in one (or more) of the following (typically cumulative) circumstances:

1. Immediately following a life crisis that involves the incapacitation or dysfunction of the inverted narcissist's partner (sickness, accident, demotion, divorce, devastating financial loss, death of a parent, or a child, imprisonment, loss of social status and, in general, any other narcissistic injury).
2. When the inverted narcissist, injured and disillusioned, then meets another - inverted - narcissist who restores a sense of meaning and superiority (uniqueness) to his life. The injured narcissist derives Narcissistic Supply from the inverted narcissist.
3. As part of an effort to secure a particularly desired Source of Narcissistic Supply. The conversion from inverted to classic narcissism serves to foster an attachment (bonding) between the narcissist and his source. When the narcissist judges that the source is his and can be taken for granted, he reverts to his former, inverted narcissistic self. Such a "conversion" is always temporary. It does not last and the narcissist reverts to his "default" or dominant state.


That’s interesting, thanks.

Is there any way of making it permanent, or at least making classical narcissism the more default form? I’m assuming I’d actually have to work on genuinely improving myself in order to do that.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby AProphet » Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:10 pm

The source text is unclear. Does "such a conversion" apply only to point 3 or to all points? We would have to consult with the author.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby AProphet » Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:32 pm

astraldeath wrote:
Is there any way of making it permanent, or at least making classical narcissism the more default form? I’m assuming I’d actually have to work on genuinely improving myself in order to do that.


In my experience you cant improve or change yourself consciously. Its an automaton. You dont ask or understand the reason behind your actions. To understand the reason you have to peer into the subconscious, f.e. dreams.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby LearningtoStand » Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:40 pm

As someone who transitioned from a closeted/covert narcissist into an exhibitionist/overt narcissist within the last year, I can tell you that it takes a long time, a lot of struggle, a lot of effort, and a lot of emotional turmoil. Most importantly, I became aware of and embraced my true self beneath my false self. To do so, I discovered my unconscious motivations, why I behaved narcissistically in the first place: early abuse and neglect which left me crippled by unacknowledged shame/anger I took out on people around me without understanding why. I discovered those motivations by exploring my unconscious mind with the help of a lot of pot, a lot of acid, and a good therapist. I would also encourage closeted/covert narcissists who want to become self-aware to read the Gnostic writings found in the Nag Hammadi library, which encourage self-knowledge and self-reflection, as frightening as that can be starting off.

AProphet's insights also fit my experience:

"When the inverted narcissist, injured and disillusioned, then meets another - inverted - narcissist who restores a sense of meaning and superiority (uniqueness) to his life. The injured narcissist derives Narcissistic Supply from the inverted narcissist."

I've met two people like that now, both women I dated, one about a year ago, one this winter/spring, who believed in me, who saw the good in me, even if they ultimately used me.

Is the transition temporary? There's truth to that in my life. I keep working at it. It's a daily battle to stay self-aware so that I can function better and stop hurting others. I've stopped hurting myself, so that's a good start.

What matters most is finding the unconscious forces which drive the narcissistic thoughts and actions. Once you make the unconscious conscious, you can, if you stay vigilante, if you don't forget, change those patterns of thought and action.
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Re: How to go from covert narcissism to overt narcissism?

Postby ZeroZ » Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:29 am

I’m not sure if this can be self controlled, more likely a response to outside influences. I think in my case and a self realized theory of my own is that when I was very young watching my father bully and stomp his way around the neighborhood like an uncontrolled child who had to prove to the world how tough he is and how he isn’t the one to mess with and how he could kick anyone’s ass blah blah.

I think I devalued him, I think I saw that type of behavior as childish and idiotic and refused mentally to follow his example, in doing so I hid my Narcissistic side which undoubtedly exists beneath a thin layer of normalcy that can be exposed by any direct challenge to certain triggers. Added to that that I was often shamed for expressing myself in a way that was inconvenient for him and it starts to make sense that I started to deny my true self. It feels like I’m cutting against my true nature to intentionally be grandiose until I am threatened and then like a demon deep inside me is released it attempts to destroy all who stand against me
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