Are we Co-dependents better persons that the HPD's

Hi,

Nice point of view Oknow. My HPD had a 'Forget that one' folder in her inbox" too.

It is incredible when one starts to share his stories, the kind of resemblances we get from one another...

HPS's are really very alike...And so were we ( Co's)...

hello iones

like you I am also civil to my ex HPD . I like the women in fact despite the agony she caused me. now that I understand hpd I find it is the fact that it was all make believe through a disorder that is the heart breaker. the disorder itself is what I hate, not her. I stilll mail and chat but armed with the knowledge of where I stand in the scheme of things Im learning not to allow her behaviour to bother me. Can't say im completely immune yet but getting there. I know a lot in this forum would not agree and advise complet nc, but I don't seem to be able to keep that up for long. I've read all the books and see it for what it is now. the poor cow will suffer too in the long run. cheers

donlimpio wrote:Lones:

Hell yeah, we're waaay better than them.

Conscience vs. no conscience
Functioning vs. hardly functioning
Mature vs. infantile personality
Truth vs. lies
Loyalty vs. betrayal
Empathy vs. selfishness
Realism vs. naive fantasy
Value driven appraisal of people vs. '######6'
Profoundness vs. superficiality
Caring for others vs. abandoning others
Awareness vs. illusions and delusions

The list goes on and on (feel free to add).. .

The most glaring difference and foundation is thatCodependency is a treatable condition. HPD is a permanent type II disorder

The level of emotional blackmail that an HPD does to her victims is sociopathic at best. The chronic pathological lying, manipulating, deceiving, cheating, financially sabotaging, and emotional soulsucking far outweighs any kind of damage a codependent can create

The deception/manipulation piece alone is morally criminal at best

There called emotional vampires for a reason. Some really do get off on the torture

Oknow: you're civil to her? Sheeesh. I'm not saying you shouldn't be, but my feelings are just very different. I think if she EVER sets foot within a 50 ft circle I'm likely to rip out her spleen through a nostril.

Honestly, I'm a bona fide pacifist and have never even laid a finger on a woman, but what she did to me was so extreme and disgusting that I don't think she'd leave with a straight nose and all her hair. Yeah yeah, I know, the goal is emotional detachment... Well, I'm not there yet.

donlimpio wrote:Oknow: you're civil to her? Sheeesh. I'm not saying you shouldn't be, but my feelings are just very different. I think if she EVER sets foot within a 50 ft circle I'm likely to rip out her spleen through a nostril.

Honestly, I'm a bona fide pacifist and have never even laid a finger on a woman, but what she did to me was so extreme and disgusting that I don't think she'd leave with a straight nose and all her hair. Yeah yeah, I know, the goal is emotional detachment... Well, I'm not there yet.

You know well that you're perfectly entitled to take all the time you need. Having said that, I'm thinking more and more that 'time' is really the most important component in recovery - and the only part that can't easily be controlled or offered via a source of support.

As for the comment about the 'Straight nose/hair' - Yet again I'm reminded of how the HPD can take an otherwise decent, normal human being (although none of us are perfect, of course...) and sometimes cultivate in us the most terrible feelings of anger and urges for violence. Really, at various points in my life (before the HPD) I've been confronted with situations which could provoke violence. In each instance of them I've walked away without any great effort. But with the HPD? - it took every single ounce of my strength and whatever 'good' parts there might be of my character to hold myself back from strangling her.

Yeah. She started calling me at late hours. When she "feells" she is missing me.

Now she calls me more that 2 or 3 times a week...

She thinks she knows that she can cameback to this country when she whants and I'll forgive her... (I'll explain that on better in a moment)

I feell a litlle of a coward. It has been less then a month since we sepparated. I managed to do it in a civilized manner even after what she made me go trough. I've learned in my life that the best "revenge" you may have with these girls is avoid conflictuous sepparations. Because ist harder for them to blameshift, and this way she will suffer more the next time someone dumps her and she feels regreted by having lost what we had because of her stupid irreal "movies" (maybe I'm wrong!?).

The thing is that she is calling me more and more. Part of me recognizes this has a simptom that she is out of male "sources" for now. I have absoluttely no doubt that the moment she finds another suitable source she will suddently stop calling just like that.

At the same time she says she misses me and that she still loves me, but meanwile she says she is searching for a home there at her hometown (I can now see this as a tipical HPD contradiction).

To the facts:

I can honestly say that I still feel the Hype everytime she calls.

I end up going on the same conversation as her, saying that I also miss her and like her, etc, etc. DAMN I'M SO COWARD!!!!

I hope she does not came to me again, because the least I could do was to talk to her about her pathology and to demand (as a condition) for har to seek appropriate terapeutical help. I'm still not strong enough to reject her completly...!!!!

But I do know that, at the best scenario, she would just agree with all my demands even if she would be sure that she has no pathology at all, only to deceive me again till she gets bored again and starts to search for a better "source", again...

Do you really think that HPD cannot be cured?

ps: Best thhig that could happen to me is for her to find a suitable "souce" as soon has possible, and meanwaile me finding a "normal" woman so I can stop feeling attracted by her "spiderweb"...

Thanks to the "Felowship" of the forum...

I just read your post OKnow.

I understand what you are saying to me...

But let me ask you someting:

When you say "the disorder itself is what I hate, not her".

And who is she? If not the disorder? how can you separate what you think "would"" be her real self, from the "disordered been"? Not even she knows that! (I'm sorry if I'm being too much blunt with you on this one. Sorry!)

...And this one is for me and you...

"I stilll mail and chat but armed with the knowledge of where I stand in the scheme of things Im learning not to allow her behaviour to bother me".

Do you (and I), really think that this is a healty, long therm way of living a life? And you know, you can manage to do that, maybe 359 nine days in a year. Bust I must warn you, that you will not manage to do that even if it's just for some 6 days on an entire year. And when you fail, she will be there to be "dissaponted" with you, and will start searching for another source. This alone if she can be faithfull and loyal to you even before that!

My "movie" is to still think that, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, if she could recognise the "desease" and get a suitable theraphy, maybe just maybe, we could be together again. But...I know that is a too risky journey, so I prefer her no to comeback, cause I'm still not strong or brave enough to just reject her...

lones wrote:Yeah. She started calling me at late hours. When she "feells" she is missing me.

Now she calls me more that 2 or 3 times a week...

I can only speak of my own experience and what worked for me. When I decided (or depending on how you look at it, found the strength) to leave, I made it a clean break - I left behind almost everything I owned and even my business. I moved to the other side of country. As soon as I arrived there I changed my email address and phone numbers.
So while that meant there was no contact at all. it was at the price of a lot of compromises. For me, that price was worth it.
That was the easy part, and I appreciate I was in a situation to do that - not everyone has such freedom. But it certainly put paid to any attempts or her part (or on my own?) to make contact for any reason at all.
Dealing with the aftermath of HPD is difficult enough without having her intrude from time to time. I don't see how recovery can begin and then progress when she's still on the scene.

I feell a litlle of a coward.

Here's something I think is important for all of us post-HPD; don't ever be tempted to beat yourself up over anything. That includes viewing yourself as a 'coward' or as a fool or weak or anything like that. You reason you came to the attention of the HPD in the first place is because you have all the good, human, noble traits that they themselves can't posess. You simply made the mistake of getting involved with the wrong person, and then tried to do what you believed was intrinsically right to help the relationship/them.

I've learned in my life that the best "revenge" you may have with these girls is avoid conflictuous sepparations. Because ist harder for them to blameshift, and this way she will suffer more the next time someone dumps her and she feels regreted by having lost what we had because of her stupid irreal "movies" (maybe I'm wrong!?).

Blameshifitng - my highly personal opinion about this, is that I don't give a sh*t about what she says about me. And if she's going to find regret in the future and misery throughout her life? - too bad. But it's neither here nor there for me. She had years of my life and she's not getting a moment more. I really don't care what happens to her one way or the other.

The thing is that she is calling me more and more. Part of me recognizes this has a simptom that she is out of male "sources" for now. I have absoluttely no doubt that the moment she finds another suitable source she will suddently stop calling just like that.

Again, I can speak only for myself. The fact of the HPD having any supply/sources/interest or not isn't any of my business. It's not something I'll invest any of my time in thinking about.

I can honestly say that I still feel the Hype everytime she calls.

They're very good at what they do. And coupled with that is the fact that you're still entrenched in her.

I end up going on the same conversation as her, saying that I also miss her and like her, etc, etc. DAMN I'M SO COWARD!!!!

Don't beat yourself up.
And it's true that you 'miss' - but you're only missing the illusion they carefully construct and then present to you. What you're missing isn't real.

I hope she does not came to me again, because the least I could do was to talk to her about her pathology and to demand (as a condition) for har to seek appropriate terapeutical help.

You've offered help and support. She's unlikely to take it. Even if she does, even if she can be cured, she'll stop being the woman you dream she is - because that woman doesn't exist in the first place.

But I do know that, at the best scenario, she would just agree with all my demands even if she would be sure that she has no pathology at all, only to deceive me again till she gets bored again and starts to search for a better "source", again...

This is probably very true - so don't be surprised when it happens. And try to prepare yourself for it by recognising exactly what it is.

ps: Best thhig that could happen to me is for her to find a suitable "souce" as soon has possible, and meanwaile me finding a "normal" woman so I can stop feeling attracted by her "spiderweb"...

Even when she does find someone else you'll still need to attend to yourself - to what you've been through with her. You're the important person in all of this - not her. It's your life you're speaking of here, your future.

Thanks to the "Felowship" of the forum...

When you feel the need to do so, post. Nobody will judge you (and if they do, they'll only be either HPD, HPD apologists, or general lunatics). There are very many helpful and supportive people here who have been through real experiences with HPD partners (as opposed to the 'Well, I knew this girl who was kind of HPD in some ways' well-meaning but grossly uninformed/backstreet psychologist types) and will probably surprise you in how they recognise what you've been though and will go through.

I don't post here so much now, but I count on the posters here as one of the reasons I've come so far. In that respect they've been invaluable to me. So I hope you can this use this resource as part of your own journey away from the HPD.

WOW!

First of all, let me thank you for your detailed explanation.

It is true that I cannot "separate in that way" from her.

We have loans toghether (which are all under my name!).

So I'm dependent on her "good will" to keep up to her word and pay her half-part (that's why I'm trying now to get another part-time job, besides my own...Just in case... ).

She also took some of my favorite pets which I would like to see again, in my lifetime...

But, being honest, if it wasn't that, I'm still not sure if I was brave enough (and it is bravery alright!!!) to do what you did.

I hope someday I can get the state of "emotional detachment" you got, not to even bother if she is happy of she is getting what she deserves...

The best I can do now is coping more or less in a good way with the break-up, my new life without her, and trying to be more carefull next time I fall in love...

In this scenario I guess that she and I will eventually end up finding another person for ourselves. I hope by that time, when I get a "Normal" loving woman, I can finally get that emotional/sexual detachment you got.

Funny thing though is that I'm conscient that I will only find this "person" when I've cured myself from my co-dependent atraction to these emotional vampires...

So, I think it is time for me to stop thinking so much about her and her pathology (which now I know more or less) and start treating my own

As I said, I was fortunate enough to be able to make such a clean physical break from her.
When I arrived in my new crappy little apartment all I had in the world was one suitcase and a bag. When I left I took a real financial hit (actually, I took a hit in more ways than one) and had to start all over again, even with my business. So while I was left almost totally wiped-out I was also left with lot of looking at the situation and myself with as much honesty as I could muster. The latter was/is the most difficult part of it all. However, there are some victims who post here who have a child with the HPD - and I can't even begin to imagine what it's like for them. But I admire them for their strength in getting on with their lives and I take inspiration from them. Kind of puts my own ordeal further into perspective for me.

'Emotional detachment' - for about a period of a year beforehand I was starting to achieve that and it led to me accepting I had to leave. In my own case I'm not looking for another woman to be the final piece in the puzzle which makes that detachment complete. And while I'm aware that because we're all different it means we all deal with things differently, I know if I was to depend on another woman to complete the process of recovery it would be a case of 'papering over the cracks'. That's not for me.
I can't change what happened in the past, but I do all that I can to ensure the HPD has as little influence on my life in the future as possible.

Time and patience will see you though this and eventually get you where you want to be. But yes, it would be a very good move for you to understand and accept that your priority is yourself.