In Control vs Out Of Control

Something which always confuses me:

Say I'm going through a difficult time, and I deal with this using self destructive coping mechanisms. They get more and more extreme as I feel more and more desperate.
I'll talk to someone about what's going on, and they'll express the opinion that things are "out of control". They'll elaborate on this a little, then say something like "Only you can control this."
To me, this seems like a contradiction. If it's out of control, how can you control it? Surely the definition of "out of control" implies it can't be controlled?

Also, bonus question for you all:
People often say that bad decisions I make are "the illness" and not really me. But how do you separate the "illness" from who you are? People without BPD sometimes make bad decisions, how do you know which decisions are BPD and which are just a result of the person you are?

flowingtears wrote:Something which always confuses me:

Say I'm going through a difficult time, and I deal with this using self destructive coping mechanisms. They get more and more extreme as I feel more and more desperate.
I'll talk to someone about what's going on, and they'll express the opinion that things are "out of control". They'll elaborate on this a little, then say something like "Only you can control this."
To me, this seems like a contradiction. If it's out of control, how can you control it? Surely the definition of "out of control" implies it can't be controlled?

BPD is like an airplane being on autopilot.

Your parents or caregivers set you on autopilot as a child.

You keep running along. But LIFE comes and brings with it.....conflict, problems, turbulance....a storm!

A plane on autopilot can only make it in clear weather and in ideal conditions.

This is exactly how it is with BPD.

A plane on autopilot will soon be out of control if severe weather developes and ideal conditions do not exist. It is at that point that the plane needs a real pilot.....someone who can think and act based on the change in circumstances. You cant depend on autopilot if circumstances are not ideal......you need someone to take responsibility who knows what they are doing, who knows the plane, who knows how it works, who knows what it needs to stay up in good weather, but who can also take external factors into consideration and make adjustments.

Someone with BPD is like a plane on autopilot. When bad weather comes they dont step up and assume control over the plane when they can.

They dont believe they can because they are so afraid of the storm and so freaked out by the responsibility that they dont stop and think of what they can do to change things and to keep the plane up. So they dont do anything.

The plane is out of control now and in a storm, but it is an ACT of omission, meaning they do nothing to gain control over the plane.

BUT its is not their fault. No one ever taught them how to fly a plane or what to do when the outside conditions are not ideal. No one ever taught them how to fly a plane the old fashioned way. They need another pilot to teach them. Someone who knows what they are doing.

Also, bonus question for you all:
People often say that bad decisions I make are "the illness" and not really me. But how do you separate the "illness" from who you are? People without BPD sometimes make bad decisions, how do you know which decisions are BPD and which are just a result of the person you are?

What we do and who we are are 2 different things.

Thats what this means.

If I hit someone on the head am I a bad person?

An act is just an act. It says nothing at all about what is INSIDE a person.

Other people can judge ONLY the act.

But only YOU can judge your intentions or the feelings BEHIND the act.

What if I hit you and it was an accident? Am I still a bad person? No
Is hitting someone still bad? yes
What if I hit you because I saw a bee on your head and I know you are allergic to bees and could die from anaphylaxis?
Am I a bad person then? No
Is hitting someone still bad? Yes

In the MOMENT. No one is ever going to like being hit in the head.

We live in 2 worlds
The world of actions and the world of our feelings or intentions.

These are basically 2 languages we all speak.
If you understand the language of actions but never understand the language of feelings or intentions, then you are going through life with only half of what you need to judge circumstances or situations accurately.

This is very similar to what we have just covered in DBT therapy. It relates to the mind, and there are 3 defining catergories. Emotional mind, wise mind and rational mind.
The times we are "out of control" comes back to being in an emotional mind. We dont make decisions based on the actual situation we make them based on how we are feeling and it fuels the self destructive behaviour.
Because we are so used to jumping straight to the self destructive behaviour its hard to change. Time, therapy and self awareness are all things that will help you regain control when you are in these tough situations.

flowingtears wrote:Also, bonus question for you all:
People often say that bad decisions I make are "the illness" and not really me. But how do you separate the "illness" from who you are? People without BPD sometimes make bad decisions, how do you know which decisions are BPD and which are just a result of the person you are?

People without BPD sometimes make bad decisions, yes, they do...
and then... they... sometimes... more often than not... realize...
"ooopsy..." - they made a bad decision... and then... they learn... from their mistake...

BPD (and some other mental illnesses) sufferers... sometimes... more often than not... make the same mistakes over and over again... and most importantly... do not seem to be learning from their mistakes...

doing the same thing - expecting different results... ? == "illness"

Do we learn from our mistakes?
My opinion and experience is i dont see them as mistakes the majority of the time, it is a behaviour that has manifested itself over several years and it is how we try to cope. Sometimes we dont know any other way and the time between thinking about doing something impulsive and doing it is very little, it is hard to intercept it and deal with the situation/emotion in a less destructive manor.

supressedemotions wrote:Do we learn from our mistakes?
My opinion and experience is i dont see them as mistakes the majority of the time, it is a behaviour that has manifested itself over several years and it is how we try to cope. Sometimes we dont know any other way and the time between thinking about doing something impulsive and doing it is very little, it is hard to intercept it and deal with the situation/emotion in a less destructive manor.

I understand what you are saying. You are coping. Surviving.

Surviving is not the same as living.

Its like playing a game.

Anyone can be either an offensive or defensive player.

But when you are a defensive player, you cant think much. You are too busy surviving and just trying to stop from being scored upon.

But when you are an offensive player EVERYTHING is different.
You analyse the other team, you come up with strategies and plans and moves to get yourself what you want which is to score!

People with BPD are defensive players.

And when you are alone .....which would be the time to be thinking up an offensive strategy, I think someone with BPD might be thinking more about just getting back in the game. How can I get back in the game? I just want to play. I dont care how I play just get me in the game again!!

To have some control or strategy....you have to know who you are. What you think, what you feel, what you believe, what you value, what you like, what you dont like ect....
And once you know that....that is SCORING....getting those things...
So then you come up with a plan....how can I get those things and not hurt anyone while I am doing it?

In the game of life the idea is that everyone gets to score. ( be happy, get what they need)
But in the rules its not polite to hurt anyone when you score.

So the offensive plan would be to get what you want( score) without hurting anyone else.
The only way to do that is to really know yourself.
If you know what hurts you....then you will also know what hurts others.
If you know what you want....then you can also know what others want.

Some really thought provoking stuff in these posts...

And 'This End Up' ... Are you a Therapist? You seem to have a massive wealth of knowledge. Really finding reading your post's useful. Thank you.

-- Fri Aug 17, 2012 7:10 pm --

[quote="flowingtears"]Something which always confuses me:

Say I'm going through a difficult time, and I deal with this using self destructive coping mechanisms. They get more and more extreme as I feel more and more desperate.
I'll talk to someone about what's going on, and they'll express the opinion that things are "out of control". They'll elaborate on this a little, then say something like "Only you can control this."
To me, this seems like a contradiction. If it's out of control, how can you control it? Surely the definition of "out of control" implies it can't be controlled?

I know where your coming from on that one, I too tend to use self destructive coping mechanisim's too and to be honest, somebody telling you 'only you can control this' , isn't particularly helpful is it!? I mean, if you could control it you/we would be controlling it. Unfortunately, a lot of us don't have the reasources inside of us to do so. Do you have therapy/counselling? Anyone whom you can talk to who has a more understanding and helpful approach to helping you to help yourself?

Hi Me,
I am sorry you lost your post! I hate when that happens!

I have taken to writing in notepad and then cutting and pasting because it has happened to me so much!! Dont we all have enough trauma in our lives without this too!?!?! lol

I am not a therapist. I did come from a dysfunctional home. My mom is a narcissist and my dad was an alcoholic. I was a mess!!!

At some point I became bound and determined to have a good life and I did anything and everything I could think of to try to make that happen.

I also have this perverse fascination with people. Why why why do I do this or why why why do they do that? Its bizarre but I think it helped me a lot to understand things for me.

I am happy if anyone gets any use out of something I say. Its kinda weird for me though cause I always figure I am just trying to figure me or my life out some more!!

I thank you for your kind words.

flowingtears wrote: "Only you can control this."

I hate being told this. Then reason being that if I thought I could control it or had control of it I wouldn't be taking the time discussing it with you.

reflection wrote:

flowingtears wrote: "Only you can control this."

I hate being told this. Then reason being that if I thought I could control it or had control of it I wouldn't be taking the time discussing it with you.

Someone doesnt have to have BPD to feel this way.
A lot of people with no personality disorders feel this way and act this way.
Its a problem for a lot of people.

Everyone is this way sometimes.

In the past the biggest way that I did not control my life was by doing or saying nothing.

I would FEEL inside like something was unfair or not true or like I was being disrespected ect ect
But I didnt do anything when I felt this way.

Not doing anything is still a choice. Its the choice to do nothing when you can speak up or stand up for yourself. Saying something or standing up for yourself is emotional self protection. Its not always a physical act.....something someone DOES with their body. A lot of times its just about speaking up.

Its scarey for anybody to do.
But at the same time, I can honestly say I never regretted doing it!

I think when we feel wronged......the feeling is always right in what is says about us.
I am mad cause something feels unfair. I dont like unfairness. Nothing wrong with that.

But I still have to analyse the context in which this is occurring. I still have to weigh all the facts because sometimes the situation changes things.

The other thing is this.....all our actions reinforce our beliefs.

So everytime a person DOESNT say something when they feel wronged inside.
Its the same thing as saying to yourself....I dont deserve to stand up for myself. I am not as important as this other person who is walking all over me.

Think of how many times in your life that you never speak up and you have some idea of how much you put yourself down.

And its not only a BPD thing. EVERYONE does it. They have whole books about it!

People Pleasers, Boundaries, Assertiveness Its all about this.....just standing up for yourself and saying when you feel wronged.

And since no one does this ....we all suck at it! lol


Normal people suck at it as much as anyone else. They might be a little ahead of the game but I am tellin ya. We suck at it when we start.


And here is something else. Once you think about it and decide for yourself....yeah ya know....I really SHOULD stand up for myself.....who the fuk are they? Who says they are any better then me?

Ok I am gonna do it!

Well then you start having a diffeent problem.

Then you start REALLY sticking up for yourself and slaying people in your path! LOL Its a mass of destruction and verbal assault! Its like a godzilla movie run amok.

And this is progress! Yes it is.....at least then you are standing up for yourself.

Ok so ....everyone messes up when they are learning you know? I mean if no one does this....why should we be good at it? We're not!

We just let the fur fly. But after a while......you start to see this in yourself.
Well....maybe I was a bit too harsh.....
So you start trying to bring it back a bit.....make the punishment fit the crime more.

After you do that a while you get 2 things.....more self worth and more of what you need in life.

You get self control. But no one is handed this on a silver platter. Its not easy for ANYONE to do.
But it can be done.