Attachment.

I have done a lot of reading these last few days. This time though I didnt just read it. I processed the information and how it relates to me. You would think that being told you have an attachment disorder it would be easily comprehended. Its right there in 2 words. I didnt get it.

A week or 2 ago I posted on the narcissist forum about how happy I was. I had a place to go. Knew what was going on. (Or so I thought) I was going to accept me. Was going to stand still. I was going to fix it.

I was either still in denial or delusional. Maybe a little of both.

I Don't Attach.

Not to my friends. Not to my pets. Not to my husband. Not to my children. Not to anyone.

I needed to write that. The realization and significance of that has been/is vital.

At one time I thought I belonged with the narcissists. They are empty. They dont attach. Its superficial. I felt though. I hurt.

So then I thought I belonged here. To the borderlines. They are empty. Love/hate. Which could be attachment. They feel. They self harm. I dont.

So then I was confused. I think I just wanted to belong. Somehwere.

Maybe though its not so much about belonging. Its more about understanding. Expressing. I have found that from people of all types on this forum.

I thought I did attach. I had even told my therapist he was wrong. I am married. I have kids. Friends. Pets. A home. How was that not attachment.

Its not attachment because I could leave it all. If I thought something better or more promising came along I could leave.

I thought need was attachment.

I know of love. I know what I think it is suppose to be. I dont feel it though. i dont feel it from my husband and I dont feel it from my children. I only know that they love me. I cant give it. Not the way I should. I dont know how to.

I have plenty of anger though. Lack of remorse, empathy, conscience. Inability to trust.

Its a damn good thing people with disorders are so charming. Hell. That and manipulation is about all we have to market ourselves.

You know. Ignorance truly is bliss.

Thought some of you may be able to relate to this. Signs or symptoms may also be found in other disorders. I read that RAD is the least researched and most poorly understood in the DSM. Also that abuse can occur but that on its own it does not explain attachment disorders.

Also known as a reactive attachment disorder, attachment disorder in adults is a problem that begins in the most impressionable years of childhood and manifests itself over time into adulthood in a much severe form. The reason for this may be neglect by parents, separation from parents due to death or divorce, or physical or sexual abuse during childhood. Due to these circumstances, children slowly develop feelings of detachment, in that they fail to form long and lasting relationships with anyone and find trusting even their close ones difficult. If not checked at the right time, this continues into adulthood, and ultimately becomes a serious psychological disorder. Fortunately, treatment is possible to a certain extent and is extremely important at the earliest, simply because it is relationships that form the important bonds in life and every effort should be made to nurture and maintain them. Moreover, the symptoms of this disorder may become severe enough to lead to dangerous self-destructive behavior.

Symptoms

In adults, attachment disorder may be characterized by one or more of the following symptoms. It is important to note that in order to identify the presence of the disorder, more than two to three symptoms should be evident, which ought to be continuously monitored. The presence of just one symptom or a symptom for a short period of time may not be sufficient evidence for the presence of this condition.

Impulsiveness: Adults with attachment disorder indulge in impulsive behavior, which they may or may not regret later.

Negative and Provocative Behavior: This condition creates a general negative mindset and leads to provocative behavior that angers others along with oneself.

Desire for Control: Persons suffering from this disorder have a strong desire to control their surroundings and manipulate people and events around themselves. They may use means like lying, cheating, and even stealing to do so.

Resistance to Love and Guidance: A natural symptom of an attachment disorder is the lack of ability to connect, empathize or sympathize with anyone. People who suffer from this disorder also face difficulty in giving and receiving love and affection from others. They are unable to develop feelings of closeness. They also refuse to accept general advice and guidance from others.

Lack of Trust: Along with the lack of ability to empathize, such persons fail to develop trusting relationships with others, irrespective of their closeness with the person in question.

Anger and Agitation: Adults suffering from attachment disorder are deeply sad and depressed within, and tend to feel isolated. They are overcome by stress and frustration. However, they conceal these traits by showing anger very often, either openly or covertly. Anger is displayed through destructive, cruel and hostile behavior, and such persons may often argue with those who don't agree with them.

Superficial Positive Traits: The other side of the coin is that in spite of the above mentioned symptoms, persons who suffer from this disorder can also appear charming and can often easily engage one in long and interesting conversations.

Addictions: Adults suffering from attachment disorder are also likely to indulge in substance abuse such as alcohol and drug addiction; they may also suffer from an addiction to gambling, even to work.

Helplessness: Due to the symptoms of isolation and depression, persons suffering from attachment disorder feel helpless and feel like they are being accused by family and friends at all times for various reasons.

Lack of Responsibility: This means that they refuse to take any responsibility for their negative actions and are unable to handle conflict with others.

Confusion: Such persons are always confused, puzzled, and obsessed with finding answers to their queries. This confusion leads to general lack of concentration and a disability to hold their attention towards any activity for long.

Hi Reflection.

I've only just seen this and have found it very interesting. I too have been diagnosed with an attachment disorder and as you said there's just not a lot of information out there. I've been searching and not found much I'm not sure I really match to many of those symptoms. But then again I might just be denial at this moment in time. I have been diagnosed with ambivalent attachment disorder to be exact so I don't know if the list is too broad.

I am glad that you have finally made the realisation that you have needed to and I only hope that it will help you and your recovery.

If you have any other info I would be very interested to have a read

Thanks!!

Hello Keep On Trucking.

What kind of symptoms do you have with that disorder.... How does it affect you. I find information but much of it is just repeating the same thing over again. The whole at birth until age3 our primary caregivers neglected and/or abused us...... Yada yada.

I want more information on how THAT progresses into where I am now. As an adult. I think I have researched attachment in just about every way possible. I know it has a lot to do with lack of trust. And obviously being unable to form attachments or even love. At least in a way that is healthy and unabusive.

Tbh the entire knowledge of it just angers me. As irrational as it may sound I think of how I was abused growing up and now I have to deal with the realization that it was most likely going on as I was an infant. I think what ######6 right did you have as parents to take from me $#%^ I was going to need for my entire ######6 life. And I know that it most likely was not done intentionally but I don't care. I have not a ######6 clue on how to fix this. I'm not about to do some stupid rebirthing $#%^ and I would dare anyone to try holding therapy with me.

How do you feel about everything.... Are you in therapy....

Be interested to hear anything you have to share.

*****Trigger Warning*****

I think to attach to others, you first have to attach to you.

And this is going to sound weird maybe, but all that anger has a purpose.
Anger means we have been violated.
Anger is a signal. Like a stop sign, a danger sign, or a yield sign. Who would ignore those in real life?
You could die!
In the same way, ignoring anger results in a kindof emotional death.

Your body goes on, but inside you grow cold and empty.

Anger has to do with values.

Things like honesty, fidelity, and protection.

Someone maybe was not honest with you, betrayed you and/or did not protect you.

That is worth being angry about! You have a right to it.
There is old anger and there is new anger.
Old anger is what causes one to die emotionally. Someone who we should have been able to trust, betrayed us or did not protect us. This someone is often in the past.....a parent, sibling , grandparent, ect....

They were wrong. Most certainly.
To attach, you first attach to you. The child inside. Anger is just a cover for pain and hurt. One cant know the pain and hurt of others or empathize until they can feel the pain of their own life.
It is good to be angry when its justified. To talk about it, to say how it was unjust and to see it and feel it. It also needs to be worked out.
The past often cannot be redone physically, but in other ways it can. imaging an instance of betrayal again and reworking it by playing the part of what a GOOD parent would have done is one way. Another way is if these abusive people are still living. Often they are not changed. Someone who abused , for example by sexual betrayal, may not still be sexually abusing their child, but make no mistake, they are still a person who betrays. So it is possible to confront them as an adult ...with power and right, and set them straight with boundaries or even just by letting them what they do is wrong and you will no longer take it.

To have a self....means only to live ones values. U have to value yourself to stand up and protect yourself. If you value protecting you. Then you have to first be on your own side! This means not allowing others to abuse or control, saying no to others sometimes, or doing what is right for you even if they show displeasure. If you value honesty, then you have to confront lies and be honest yourself. Whatever you value you have to live it and stay true to it.
Being true to yourself means not breaking your own values. Every time you break your own value system its like you are betraying yourself. So if you believe for example, good people dont lie. Then you cant lie. If you do ...all you will be doing is striking yourself emotionally.
Anger is important because it speaks to the values we hold and the good we are born with.
The way to build a self is to be married in a sense and true to your values. to live them.

to feel the pain of anger is to know how deeply you have been wronged. To heal is to feel it and to demand justice. Justice is had by living ones values, and by protecting oneself now and in the future.

Reflection,

reflection wrote:
What kind of symptoms do you have with that disorder.... How does it affect you. I find information but much of it is just repeating the same thing over again. The whole at birth until age3 our primary caregivers neglected and/or abused us...... Yada yada.

I guess I have a lot of BPD symptoms and this is why I relate to a lot of people here. I am 'high functioning', I hold down a job and not many people in my life realise what problems I have. I have phases of self harming, severe suicidal thoughts, chronic emptiness and feelings of despair and desperation, which manifests in physical pain. Push, pulling with people, pets, any bonds in general really, and I don't have really any friends left ...none that I am particularly bothered for. My memory is absolutely shocking (don't know if this is a symptom though lol). I have 'episodes' of rage and severe emotional distress where I will scream and sob until I throw up, for no apparent reason, it just feels like it builds and builds until I can't contain it anymore. There's loads more other little things as well. I am very dependent on my boyfriend, cognitive dissonance, severe mood swings and things like that. How would you say it affects you? ~Are you 'high-functioning'?

As for attachments... now I know what I know, looking back on my life I have realised I have always been completely unstable and would abandon at the drop of a hat if I thought some one would abandon me. I am quick to make attachments but even quicker to drop them. I have no interest in keeping in contact with people and would probably go months on end without hearing from another soul if I didn't go to work!!

I understand what you mean about feeling angry about it now you are aware of it. I was exactly the same, I blamed my dad and my mum for all my life mistakes and the years and years of feeling pain (first aware of empty feeling at 15, but thought it was normal). However I am now coming through that and realise that my mum couldn't help what she did, she was mentally unwell herself. She didn't do anything bad just passed me on to her friend as a baby. I love my mother more than anything in this world. I recently learned that my dad denied me as a child as I didn't have the same hair colour as him and my siblings which I was very angry about but it doesn't really surprise me any more and I'm just sort of over it, consciously anyway.

I think the only way to get better is to look your demons in the face and tackle them one by one, it won't go away on it's own. I have tried that and although some of the feelings fade at times they will always spring back up. I am in therapy now and I wish I had done it earlier. I won't lie, it's not easy. You have to be 100% honest!! It's not easy admitting things that you've done it the past or you feel right now but I take the view that I am not the first to do this or think that and I certainly won't be the last and the therapist will have heard it all before, I am in no way unique. Part of the process will be shrinking my inner child as it is the predominant personality at the moment.

Over all I am sort of plodding along right now and look forward to each week for the next installment of therapy and can not wait to beat this and get on with my life. I went through the relieved stage, then the angry stage, now I am at the 'hurry up, I need to know everything I possibly can so I can have a better life' stage!! I have incredibly positive days and some terribly negative days. Luckily I am feeling positive today or else this post could be a lot different!!

Sorry to have waffled and I hope some of it is relevant to you. I would love to hear your thoughts about things. I am interested about you saying you can't love, can you expand on that? I am quite the opposite, I feel I have too much love to give and it feels like it over flows. There are bad days where I don't feel like I can however. Do you feel like you can't love all the time?!

KOT xx

Sharkmouse wrote:Your body goes on, but inside you grow cold and empty.

Sharkmouse wrote:To attach, you first attach to you. The child inside. Anger is just a cover for pain and hurt. One cant know the pain and hurt of others or empathize until they can feel the pain of their own life.

Firstly Sharkmouse let me say you write with feeling.

You do grow cold and empty when you don't allow how you feel to have an outlet. I also agree that anger is a cover for pain and hurt. I have done that for so long that I often find myself unable to separate anger from sadness. They have both become 1 in the same to me.

Empathy. When I read that last sentence I feel blank and yet have a tightness inside. I am not completely without empathy. Idk how I feel where that word is concerned.

Attaching to myself makes perfect sense. I am not aware of how to do that yet. Though I am getting there. I have wasted my lifetime running from myself. Idk if it was myself that wasn't good enough or my demons. I don't think I liked any of them.

Values. Until you wrote that not something I have thought of. I have for days now though.

Thank you for your post.

keepontrucking wrote:chronic emptiness and feelings of despair and desperation, which manifests in physical pain. Push, pulling with people, pets, any bonds

I have more mental pain than physical. Some days I want nothing more than to just sleep.

The push/pull I do with EVERYONE. Was never even aware it was an issue. I found that behavior of mine completely normal. My husband has told me I do this on a constant basis. Idk why I do it. I want attachments. At least I feel as though I do. I need them. I don't want to be alone.

keepontrucking wrote: I have 'episodes' of rage and severe emotional distress

keepontrucking wrote:just feels like it builds and builds until I can't contain it anymore.

I relate to this. It's as if it consumes you. You have no choice but to let it out. And I truly mean no choice. It's as if someone else has taken over. My behavior during these moments is terrible and destructive and crazy. I have no control. Afterwards I often think what the hell just happened.

keepontrucking wrote: I am very dependent

I am as well on my husband. He is my foundation. My stability. I can and could be self reliant but I have no desire to be. I am high functioning but easily overwhelmed. I require balance and consistency.

keepontrucking wrote:As for attachments... now I know what I know, looking back on my life I have realised I have always been completely unstable and would abandon at the drop of a hat if I thought some one would abandon me. I am quick to make attachments but even quicker to drop them. I have no interest in keeping in contact with people and would probably go months on end without hearing from another soul if I didn't go to work!!

Abandonment I don't even like to talk about. Attachments I make quickly as well. They are often shallow and superficial though. I didn't use to think that. I don't require many people in my life. Though I want them there when needed. I am not one to pick up the phone and call. I don't think like that. And basic chit chat overall doesn't interest me much. I want there to be something to say or discuss. I am working on all of this. I have 2 friends that I am open with. They accept me and don't place high expectations on me. I am a good friend and there for them. It's just different. I don't feel the need to always fill the silence. Not sure how to explain. They both drink. A LOT. They have issues of their own. They are both beautiful though and the friendship has a special quality to it. I actually cherish it. Just realized that.

keepontrucking wrote:I understand what you mean about feeling angry about it now you are aware of it. I was exactly the same, I blamed my dad and my mum for all my life mistakes and the years and years of feeling pain

I don't blame them. That's a lie. Not there yet.
I was a person then. Even if my life is my own now.
I don't believe in apologies and I'm not one much for forgiveness.

keepontrucking wrote:I think the only way to get better is to look your demons in the face and tackle them one by one, it won't go away on it's own. I have tried that and although some of the feelings fade at times they will always spring back up.

This is so true. Every time I have thought I am "better" or "past it" something has happened to make me realize that is not the case. Then ALL those negative feelings are there again. They exhaust me but I am NOT putting them back in boxes this time.

keepontrucking wrote: I went through the relieved stage, then the angry stage, now I am at the 'hurry up, I need to know everything I possibly can so I can have a better life' stage!!

This made me laugh. And I hope that you get that better life stage.

keepontrucking wrote:Sorry to have waffled and I hope some of it is relevant to you.

I didn't think you waffled at all and all of it was relevant to me. Which is also why it took me some time to respond. Sure you understand that. You write well.

keepontrucking wrote:I am interested about you saying you can't love, can you expand on that? I am quite the opposite, I feel I have too much love to give and it feels like it over flows. There are bad days where I don't feel like I can however. Do you feel like you can't love all the time?!

This part I may struggle with. And likely the most cause for the time length in response.

I feel as though I am blocked..... Just sitting here.

It has to do with watching my husband with our children. With me. I see in him what I don't have in myself. Emotions maybe. Ways of interacting. He's a good man.

Maybe it has more to do with attaching. Or maybe I feel it but don't know how to express it. Idk KOT.

I like talking to you.

I have more mental pain than physical. Some days I want nothing more than to just sleep.

The push/pull I do with EVERYONE. Was never even aware it was an issue. I found that behavior of mine completely normal. My husband has told me I do this on a constant basis. Idk why I do it. I want attachments. At least I feel as though I do. I need them. I don't want to be alone.

I know this one, a day very rarely goes by without having a nap just to get through it and have a rest. My physical manifests in my stomach and chest which is pretty standard!

I didn't realise I did it either for years and years, it was an automatic reaction. A learnt behaviour, a survival response.

I relate to this. It's as if it consumes you. You have no choice but to let it out. And I truly mean no choice. It's as if someone else has taken over. My behavior during these moments is terrible and destructive and crazy. I have no control. Afterwards I often think what the hell just happened.

I am interested to know whether you are able to control it to a certain extent. For example I will always have my 'episodes' at home. Occasionally I will be a bit obviously irritated else where but nothing out of the ordinary. Nothing that would set alarm bells off anyway. This is always interesting to me. Maybe it's because it's the only place I feel safe to express these awful emotions and that it shows that I trust my boyfriend enough to allow him to see me as I am?? I know what you mean about not really knowing what happened. It doesn't feel like you actually did it.

I am as well on my husband. He is my foundation. My stability. I can and could be self reliant but I have no desire to be. I am high functioning but easily overwhelmed. I require balance and consistency.

How do you feel about this? Do you like being dependent? I don't have any desire to be anything but dependent however I don't like it. I frequently obsess about my boyfriends death or severe injury and my life would be over. He's just popped out with the dogs and I am convinced he will get beaten to a pulp and never return. It's ridiculous.

They are both beautiful though and the friendship has a special quality to it. I actually cherish it. Just realized that.

I like this a lot I am glad you have two special friends in your life. I feel I concentrate on peoples bad points too much to see their good points. It is only within the last 2 weeks I have been able to change this view on one of my old colleagues. A symptom of ambivalent attachment disorder is, 'Unlikely to view others as altruistic'. this is me through and through

I don't blame them. That's a lie. Not there yet.
I was a person then. Even if my life is my own now.
I don't believe in apologies and I'm not one much for forgiveness.

I get this, I really do. I didn't think I would ever say what I am about to but here goes...
It's not about getting apologises from the people that have done you wrong it's about allowing you to forgive yourself.
I was hell bent on revenge, about getting that ever important apology that was never likely to come. Apologise to yourself, forgive yourself and you will be able to move on. It sounds so absurd I know.

They exhaust me but I am NOT putting them back in boxes this time.

How do you think you will do this? You said before you don't want to do therapy, for the time being at least. I personally feel it is the only way forward, it's not easy but it's better than the prospect of being like this for the remainder of my life. How do you feel about this?

It has to do with watching my husband with our children. With me. I see in him what I don't have in myself. Emotions maybe. Ways of interacting. He's a good man.

Maybe it has more to do with attaching. Or maybe I feel it but don't know how to express it. Idk KOT.

This is a difficult one.

There are a number of things that spring to my mind but probably aren't relevant.
Perhaps you don't feel comfortable with love as an emotion. You do have it there but you don't realise it. It makes everything more uncomfortable so it's easier to shut it off? I believe you have love, you just don't have 'normal' access to it?

Thanks for taking the time to respond, I am very interested with things that you have to say. It makes me think (in a good way).

I like talking to you too.

reflection wrote:Attaching to myself makes perfect sense. I am not aware of how to do that yet. Though I am getting there. I have wasted my lifetime running from myself. Idk if it was myself that wasn't good enough or my demons. I don't think I liked any of them.

Values. Until you wrote that not something I have thought of. I have for days now though.

This is very interesting to me. Because I know know one thing about attachment. Its constant....long term. It never goes away. It is consistant and steady and never changing. Even when someone dies. I still feel attached to them.

Only thinking bout this now , a light bulb went off. I am not really attached to them, to people. I am attached to the way they made me feel.
They made me feel valued.

And that led me back to values and attaching to oneself.

To trust others I have to trust me first. Gotta believe I know what is good for me.
That led me back to anger. Whatever makes me angry somehow points me to something I value as good. If I get mad because someone is unfair to me. I value fairness.

Ok

Stay with me LOL

If I look to others for fairness all the time. I am never going to get it.

Why?

Because not everyone is fair.

Ok so how do I get and keep this thing I value? This fairness?

I have to be fair first. Every time I ACT fair. Its like I am proving to myself. I am fair.

But other people are not always fair. Other people are sometimes fair and sometimes not.


OK so where is the consistancy? The choice is me or them? Which of these factors do I have some kindof control over? ME


If I feel like it. I could be fair every day of my life! FOREVER! lol

I am the one with the power to be steady, consistant. If I attach to my value of fairness. If I commit to it. If I live it. If every time I have the choice to be fair or unfair, I choose being fair.

What about these other people?

Fuk em.

lol

No seriously. I can pay attention when I feel they are being unfair and I can do something about it. I can point it out to them and say hey. You are not being fair. I am. And I want you to be fair too.

They can say ok or they can leave.


Some people are fair. A LOT. Some people are not.

If I keep speaking up and demanding fairness. The people who like fairness will stay with me. And the ones who dont will leave.

So then. I have me. My fairness with me all the time. And only people who agree that fairness is good all the time.

If I look to others for consistancy though......let them decide if I will get it or not, then I will never have it!

But if I look to me. I can have it. All I have to do is make a pact with myself to be fair and keep demanding others be fair too.

Then in the end. Wouldnt I be attached to fairness?

If I do this with lots of values......dont kill.
I Wont kill. Will never do it. Got that pact with myself. Good.
And I demand people in my life dont go around offing anyone. Good I can make this pact


Dont steal. I can make that pact too

Dont lie, Dont cross the road on the red. Bam bam I can make pacts with myself all day long. LOL

And I can keep them. Seems all I have to do is be loyal to me. Oh look loyalty! I can do that too. First I can be loyal to me. To what I value.

Something you value stays. I mean we get rid of trash, but who gets rid of something of value?
If I value loyalty and honesty, then I can keep them if I live them. If I choose to live them. I can attach to me. I am the only one with the power to enforce consistancy. This makes sense to me.

I attached to people who were also honest, loyal, loving. Not because of them, but because they had something I valued, something I chose to live.

Maybe attachment is about consistancy and value. Constantly protecting something one values inside??

@ OP, damn, I relate to a lot of those symptoms..