I feel guilty and would love some feedback

Dilnarc, I don't know how far you've gotten in DBT, but two modules that I think you're really going to like are Distress Tolerance and Interpersonal Relations. The DT is a biggie for me, and I think it'll help you, too. In fact, you've said that you already use it.

When you commented that you didn't let yourself go into "BPD mode" when the other girl said she and your husband were going to be hanging out on your birthday? That was a VERY effective use of Distress Tolerance. Believe it or not, you scored a big victory, there. Good on ya!!

Having these intense, emotional reactions is something that we have to live with. What we don't have to live with, is how we deal with them. You're already in DBT, so you're making efforts to work on your responses. Again, another huge step, and another big congrats!

Something you may want to do, when you're not feeling overly trigger-able, is to sit and talk with your husband. DBT can be very rough for us, so having a loved one that understands and supports our efforts through DBT can make a huge difference. While he may see the differences, he may not realize how hard you're working at it. Certainly something to talk about...

i just noticed your user name ..do you feel that you have some narc traits too to some extent or is that choice of name a random coincidence?

I originally joined this forum because I believe my mother-in-law is either narcissistic or has traits of NPD. So "dil" = daughter-in-law and narc = narcissist. I had a lot of trouble with her early in my relationship with her son and came on here for support.

Since distancing ourselves from her, my issues have been continuing to emerge, so now I'm on here to get support for that. I don't have enough criteria to be diagnosed with BPD, but I have 3-4 traits. Intense emotions, difficulty controlling anger, challenging relationships. I don't cut, self-harm, or do other impulsive behaviours like gambling, promiscuity or the others. I don't feel "empty". I know myself well and feel quite fulfilled. I've struggled with an eating disorder throughout my life. I have it under control right now.

I just have trouble regulating emotions when they're intense. I get triggered in PTSD fashion when certain events happen. I have a very strong need for safety.

Peoples emotions and severity of them are somewhat different ..rage can be so intense that you cant even comprehend it yourself and question your self "self analyzing" and yes ofc you feel guilty sometimes embarrassment that they have seen your breaking point. i know this feeling myself

Thank you. I am afraid of my own rage. My husband has said that he wonders if I look for situations to get upset about and I tried to tell him that it's really not true. I do everything I can to avoid situations because I find it so scary to go into that state. I lose sleep for 24 hours, it sets my whole schedule off, I have cortisol and adrenaline running through my system that needs to flush out. My appetite goes off. It's so much to manage and I would do whatever possible to avoid those upset situations.

I wish he understood that I very much try to avoid them as much as I'm able. It's not fun for me.

reactions are different with every day and every situation can be different that's why we are hard to read/fathom/ understand for others..you are seeking answers for yourself and that's a great start.

Thank you so much for your encouragement. My husband just told me that he doesn't feel safe with me and those feelings are valid, so I gave him the space to tell me what he felt and to validate them. It also brought up a lot of shame and that's why I came on here to talk about it.

Somewhere deep down, I worry he thinks that I'm doing it on purpose and that I can control it more than I already do. That I'm bad and need to punished. That's a big one. I withdraw and say I'm going to sleep on the couch because I feel like I should be punished for having such strong emotions.

dilnarc wrote:

i just noticed your user name ..do you feel that you have some narc traits too to some extent or is that choice of name a random coincidence?

I originally joined this forum because I believe my mother-in-law is either narcissistic or has traits of NPD. So "dil" = daughter-in-law and narc = narcissist. I had a lot of trouble with her early in my relationship with her son and came on here for support.

Thank you the reply i was curious only

yes i totally get where your coming from and it is more or less what most of us go through, and its tough not only from our side but from their side to, they cant understand why we cant hold our temper or refrain from saying this or that ..but you can help him understand when you have the tools from DBT to help you...

i used to lock myself im my pc room and not eat just coz i was embarrassed how i behaved but couldn't back then admit it (1 year ago)

Its hard i know ..but youll get the help you need

Casper wrote:Dilnarc, I don't know how far you've gotten in DBT, but two modules that I think you're really going to like are Distress Tolerance and Interpersonal Relations. The DT is a biggie for me, and I think it'll help you, too. In fact, you've said that you already use it.

I have done Mindfulness and Interpersonal Relations. I gained a few nuggest from IR and used it to help me with some small conflicts with other people. But, it didn't get to the heart of anything, which is Emotion Regulation.

I'm currently in Emotion Regulation, which has been helping a lot. I've only been doing it for a couple months and they are short staffed at the mental health centre, so it's been slow going. I had several "aha" moments while doing these worksheets and feel hopeful it will continue to help.

I am familiar with Distress Tolerance, having worked with that module for the last few years. The thing about trauma that I'm learning is that the amygdala kicks in and the prefrontal cortex goes offline during a triggered state.

So, what I need is to get into my body during those states. It's a physiological response, I think.

When you commented that you didn't let yourself go into "BPD mode" when the other girl said she and your husband were going to be hanging out on your birthday? That was a VERY effective use of Distress Tolerance. Believe it or not, you scored a big victory, there. Good on ya!!

Thank you thank you thank you!!!! I used the skills from Emotion Regulation. Checking the facts. What actually happened. Well, she said my husband suggested Wednesdays. And then I checked in to see if my emotions were fitting the facts or just based on my thoughts. Turns out, they were based on my thoughts. He doesn't care, he wishes he was her instead of me, he forgot, etc...

And then I imagined as many possible other explanations. Turns out she misunderstood and he not only had no intention of spending my birthday with her, but had already taken the day off work without me even asking him.

Thank you so much for pointing out my victory! That makes my day. <3

Something you may want to do, when you're not feeling overly trigger-able, is to sit and talk with your husband. DBT can be very rough for us, so having a loved one that understands and supports our efforts through DBT can make a huge difference. While he may see the differences, he may not realize how hard you're working at it. Certainly something to talk about...

Thank you for the suggestion. No, I am not sure he fully understand how hard I'm working at it. Understandably so. For him, when a slip-up happens, it brings him right back to here we go again. I get that. So, I think it's partly up to me to continue pointing out all the hard work I'm doing so he knows.

It's like they say in the design world. Good design isn't noticed. In other words, if something is designed well, it just works seamlessly and people don't notice it. They just enjoy it. Bad design gets noticed because it causes inconvenience.

Similarly, he won't necessarily notice all the times I've done hard work to avoid an outburst. For him, it's just easier sailing and he doesn't think about it. He will, however, notice the upsets.

Hey dilnarc,

I don't have BPD, but I have been married for 25 years with no major issues so I thought I might weigh in here. Firstly, your anger is very justified. I won't comment on your reaction because I can't relate to that. But I see some troubling signs from your husband's behavior:

1. He is married to you. He should not be "hanging out" alone with ANY female for ANY reason. If he legitimately needs to study with her, it should be done at your house with you there, or he should make plans ahead of time to bring you along. He should be with YOU on your birthday.

2. I admire you for your trust that he was not aware that you did not have any food in the house, but in my opinion, he should have known. He lives there too and his main concern should be taking care of his family (you).

3. If he does need to make an unplanned trip and leaves you stranded, and your only mode of communication is through Facebook, he should be making sure you got the message... checking more than once to make sure.

My step-mom is a narc so I know how they work and it sounds to me like your husband has picked up on some of her tricks, or may have NPD himself if he wants to say all of your problems are on your emotions. To be honest, it sounds like he may be baiting you in order to get you to react so then he can put all the blame on you and make you feel crazy/guilty.

My advice would be to continue to lay down the ground rules, stay calm when he violates them and then address HIS behavior. I hope this helps.

I think it's a bit dodgy that he insists upon hanging out with a female friend who he's admitted that he finds attractive and after he was unfaithful. Wanting to spend time with her on your birthday!!? He won't be winning the Mr Sensitive Guy Of the Year Award any time soon.

I must applaud you, as I think a lot of women without BPD would be pretty angry about all of this. t sounds like you're doing some good work on yourself with your DBT.

Your husband sounds like he isn't ready for a marriage.

You deserve so much better.

CloudShark wrote:I must applaud you, as I think a lot of women without BPD would be pretty angry about all of this. t sounds like you're doing some good work on yourself with your DBT.

I'd like to echo cloud
well said

dealuvsGod wrote:Hey dilnarc,

I don't have BPD, but I have been married for 25 years with no major issues so I thought I might weigh in here. Firstly, your anger is very justified. I won't comment on your reaction because I can't relate to that. But I see some troubling signs from your husband's behavior:

1. He is married to you. He should not be "hanging out" alone with ANY female for ANY reason. If he legitimately needs to study with her, it should be done at your house with you there, or he should make plans ahead of time to bring you along. He should be with YOU on your birthday.

Thank you for weighing in. I appreciate the feedback a lot.

He is going to be with me on my birthday. He intended to tell her that, in general, Wednesdays are good days. This Wednesday happens to be my birthday and she misunderstood him. He booked the day off work and intended to spend it with me. He intends to study with her other Wednesdays.

2. I admire you for your trust that he was not aware that you did not have any food in the house, but in my opinion, he should have known. He lives there too and his main concern should be taking care of his family (you).

This has been an ongoing issue for our whole relationship. His brother is similar. His brother has been with his wife for 8+ years and they've had some big issues with his lack of follow-through or lack of responsibility. I'm not sure how to phrase it.

They grew up without much structure and didn't learn certain kinds of management. In my husband's defence, it has improved 10-fold. He's much more responsible with money and pays more attention to things. He has become much more reliable.

I also agree with you completely that his main concern should be taking care of his family. And that he should have been aware of the food situation.

He has a tendency to be short-sighted. He sees what's in front of him, especially when it comes to helping others. He has the habit of neglecting his own needs or priorities in favour of helping others.

The day he didn't come home with food, his study friend had also asked him to help him move a mattress. It's happened time and time again that he neglects his duties at home to go help someone else. In some ways it's endearing and in other ways, it's easy to feel insecure with him as a partner.

I really appreciate your perspective. I have shared my concerns on forums before and often receive this feedback - that my husband is immature. I feel worried about that. I had a neglectful father and my husband's behaviour scares me sometimes.

The thing I don't feel clear about is how to respond. I fly off the handle. I've talked about it calmly and then things don't change right away. I know that it takes time to change habits and I see how much he's learning, so I want to have patience for his learning curve.

I also don't want to be naive. And I don't help the situation by reacting so strongly. Because I have such strong reactions, he can tend towards attributing my upset solely to my own issues instead of understanding how he's contributing. In other words, if I'm upset often, then he will think that I just get upset. Not that he's doing things to warrant me feeling upset.

3. If he does need to make an unplanned trip and leaves you stranded, and your only mode of communication is through Facebook, he should be making sure you got the message... checking more than once to make sure.

I wholeheartedly agree. This is our new agreement. One good thing about us is that when a big upset happens, we make new agreements and then things improve. Him checking in at all was an agreement we set after he would just not show up. Now he checks in. As far as he knew, he was following our agreement. Since he didn't know about the food situation, now our agreement is that he makes sure to talk to me and see if it's ok.

I feel like a ball and chain having to go through this process. It's like making him want to be dedicated to our family and that doesn't feel good.

My step-mom is a narc so I know how they work and it sounds to me like your husband has picked up on some of her tricks, or may have NPD himself if he wants to say all of your problems are on your emotions. To be honest, it sounds like he may be baiting you in order to get you to react so then he can put all the blame on you and make you feel crazy/guilty.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that he has NPD. He was certainly affected by his mother. Primarily, I would say what I've observed is that because she constantly used to nag him to do an unreasonable amount of chores for her with very little appreciation, he doesn't know how to distinguish a real need from a narcissistic need. He's a pleaser who doesn't always know himself. He has poor boundary setting skills and tends to just go along with what others want. (Case in point with the woman who tried to seduce him. He passively let it happen and didn't stop it).

Since I've known his mother, she's always in some kind of crisis, needing help, needing attention. She attributes feeling loved with being doted on. She doesn't step up and do things for herself. So, when I get upset about needing something, I can see how it's easy for him to think my needs aren't as important as I make them out to be. He'd have to have been that way with his mother or else he would have been under constant stress mode, jumping to her every command that she said was "important".

My advice would be to continue to lay down the ground rules, stay calm when he violates them and then address HIS behavior. I hope this helps.

This is very helpful advice. It's what we're doing. What a process, sometimes!

By the way, how have you been married for 25 years without major issues? I'm impressed and congratulations!

CloudShark wrote:I think it's a bit dodgy that he insists upon hanging out with a female friend who he's admitted that he finds attractive and after he was unfaithful. Wanting to spend time with her on your birthday!!? He won't be winning the Mr Sensitive Guy Of the Year Award any time soon.

I must applaud you, as I think a lot of women without BPD would be pretty angry about all of this. t sounds like you're doing some good work on yourself with your DBT.

It's really helpful to hear that women without BPD would be angry. And I always point out that I don't have BPD, technically. I was assessed and at most, my diagnosis was "recovered from BPD". That was when I was single and being in a relationship has brought out my extreme reactions.

To clarify, he doesn't want to spend time with her on my birthday. She misunderstood. He had every intention of spending it with me. He said Wednesdays in general and she thought that included this Wednesday.

I'm not clear on whether or not it's dodgy and I appreciate your perspective on that. He gains a lot of new skills from studying with her. We both talked to her and I explained why I feel insecure. She knows about the infidelity.

She invited me to go hang out with them while they're studying, to see what they do. I don't like the idea of having to chaperone him. I think it's inappropriate and if I can't trust my partner to be with a woman in a professional/friend capacity, then that's the bigger issue.

It's not realistic for her to come here because we live in the boonies. She lives across the street from his work, so it's much more convenient for him to study with her there.

There are many articles on the internet about husbands hanging out with female friends. Some people strongly feel that friendships outside the relationship are very healthy. Others feel that a husband should never hang out alone with a woman.

I know deep down that when he's secure with me, fidelity is not an issue at all. I also see how my volatility causes him to feel insecure in our relationship. So, it puts an enormous amount of pressure on me to get my emotions under control or fear his infidelity. I know how unhealthy this is. I know he should promise fidelity either way. If he wants to leave me because he can't handle my emotionality, then he should leave me before blurring the boundaries with other women while still with me.

-- Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:36 pm --

StevieGirl wrote:Your husband sounds like he isn't ready for a marriage.

You deserve so much better.

I feel really sad and scared reading this. If it's true, then what do I do? Leave? Continue pointing out his behaviours and be patient while they improve?

I don't want to leave him. There are so, so, so many ways he treats me with respect, dignity, care, love, consideration. And then some significant ways where he's clueless. I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

His friends and family could say the same about me. "Your wife sounds extreme. You deserve so much better".

-- Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:40 pm --

Echinacea wrote:

CloudShark wrote:I must applaud you, as I think a lot of women without BPD would be pretty angry about all of this. t sounds like you're doing some good work on yourself with your DBT.

I'd like to echo cloud
well said

Thank you so much. My friend phoned me this morning because she just broke up with her partner of 5 years. I tried to help and encourage her and she told me how helpful my language was. A lot of my language was from DBT skills. It's a slow process, but it helps.

Thank you so, so, so much for your encouragement and kudos, everyone.