Doomed to repeat same unhealthy patterns or remain a hermit

NotSince67 wrote:Dee,

In your OP you specifically talk at length about "relationships" but the context seems to suggest intimate or romantic ones. The reason I suggested friends is because it seems like your idea is that by finding a great guy to save you from yourself you'll be freed of your misery.

But the reality is we all know we don't get saved, we just drag them down and drown together.

So, I suggest friends as a more constant and dependable, less instense be equally supportive way for you to shar in your human existence with, and to fulfill you need for human interaction that we all have. You don't need lots or friends, or the best ######6 friends ever, just people you can meet up or chat with and share a laugh and ideas with over something you have a mutual interest in.

So for me, every now and then I just need to meet up with a friend to watch a game and have a (many?) beer(s) or to go see his show and talk music, or go to a friends and smoke a joint and play XBox, or someone to go golf with, whatever.

No one is going to carry you if you insist on being dead weight. But as long as you have to desire to wake up and try to make your day a good one, someone with a mutual interest will want to partake in that shared interest.

I will make note here though, as SOON as you begin to depend on them for your well-being you've lost. You need to depend in you, get your value from you, and all that. Then you get to share in life with others to enrichen the quality of life. I feel you make the mistake many of us here make which is deriving our value from others and our value to them rather than our value to ourselves.

You seem to have missed the point though. I have said that I cannot avoid situations where there are men that are interested in me physically and my desire for a relationship is fuelled more. I cannot stop wanting a relationship and that's where my problem is. I'm not going out trying to meet men. I go out trying to make friends! I purposely try avoid meeting men because I feel to broken to have a healthy relationship. None of what you have said is news to me or actually helps me I'm afraid to say. It's like telling someone with bulimia to stop vomiting because they're harming their health when they know exactly what it's doing to them they're just unable to stop.

And you know, if I had any friends who gave a $#%^ about me I probably wouldn't need to come here. I would say that the very fact I am still alive should bloody well count for something as far as "being a deadweight" goes. People have their own lives and there's not much space for me in it. I don't depend on anyone for my well being. Does that mean that being treated like crap doesn't affect my well being though? No. Of course not. I feel no value in myself and I'm sick of having people tell me I must get value from myself. Yes thanks very much, SO helpful. I cannot just magically develop self worth when I see nothing about myself that is worth a damn.

Look, I hate to say it, but at sometime you do have to take ownership of it. Sure, I can understand how your analogy to bulimia would make sense, but the other side of the coin is ultimately the bulimic is the once who has to correct their behaviour, no one else can do it for them.

How would that apply? Well, there is no law which states going out with friends, or to meet friends, must result in an intimate encounter. That is completely up to you. And regardless of how vulnerable you are to that, you have to find a way to persevere over it.

What about putting yourself in a setting where there are no males?

You think I DON'T take ownership of my behaviour? Why do you think I get so down on myself. I cannot always control it in the moment and so because of that the only way I can control it is to not go out! THAT is how I'm controlling it!! I cannot go out without drinking alcohol. I don't want to. Simple as that. Alcohol makes that deep down pain go away, it lets me enjoy my night out and just have fun in the moment and not care what others think. But unfortunately it also leaves me open to bad experiences and behaviours that are unlike me. When I don't drink and I'm out I feel miserable and see no point in being there. So no, I'm sorry, there is just no solution to that situation.

there is no law to many things...does that mean things still don't happen?? There is no law that says people must knock me about and spill red wine on my clothes, does that stop them from doing it? I'm sorry but trying to use that as a reason for why I can prevent intimate encounters is silly. Even without alcohol I have ALWAYS had a deep rooted problem telling guys no. This may have something to do with being raped when I was 15 but I am now 30 so you think having lived with it for this long I can suddenly just change that?? And anyway, using online dating WAS the method I was trying to use to avoid random encounters but yet despite being complimented and asked for my number no one in the past year has followed through and made an effort to meet me or really get to know me.

As for putting myself in a situation where there are no males, please enlighten me. How would one go about doing this exactly?? And even if this were possible, I've already stated that men are only half the problem. the women I try to make friends with have their own lives and very little space for me in them. They don't want to form close friendships, they just want people to go out with and have fun. Recently I had 2 friends I had known for years...one of them just kept drifting further and further away from me and the other I haven't heard from in a month even after emailing her and asking her what she's doing for Easter. Sure I told her I was having a tough time too and she just said nothing. So sorry, what good are friends again??

It sounds like you have trouble making close friends. Since getting out of college I've had pretty much the same experience. It's kind of disturbing but I notice that a ton of people don't have any real friends other than their spouse. They have people they get together with once a month or less, or drinking buddies from work. It's always about "having fun" doing things that aren't really "fun" for me. These days when I do go out I usually regret it and can't wait for it to be over. Have you tried depression/bi-polar support groups on meetup.com? My only meaningful connections with others are through support groups. Otherwise I just have online friends who are long-distance. People tell me to find new hobbies, but it's hard when suggested activities don't interest me, or the loneliness follows me everywhere I go preventing me from really getting into anything. It's almost easier to go out to get away from people. I like to go hiking by myself. I love being in nature and just being able to reflect without being interrupted by other people's annoying babble. Oddly I feel less alone at those times. I enjoy photography too, but I prefer to do that alone as well. Maybe it's hard to just go out and wonder if you have fears for your safety. I don't know about laws in the UK but many places in US you can pack heat so nobody will mess with you.

frostfern wrote:It sounds like you have trouble making close friends. Since getting out of college I've had pretty much the same experience. It's kind of disturbing but I notice that a ton of people don't have any real friends other than their spouse. They have people they get together with once a month or less, or drinking buddies from work. It's always about "having fun" doing things that aren't really "fun" for me. These days when I do go out I usually regret it and can't wait for it to be over. Have you tried depression/bi-polar support groups on meetup.com? My only meaningful connections with others are through support groups. Otherwise I just have online friends who are long-distance. People tell me to find new hobbies, but it's hard when suggested activities don't interest me, or the loneliness follows me everywhere I go preventing me from really getting into anything. It's almost easier to go out to get away from people. I like to go hiking by myself. I love being in nature and just being able to reflect without being interrupted by other people's annoying babble. Oddly I feel less alone at those times. I enjoy photography too, but I prefer to do that alone as well. Maybe it's hard to just go out and wonder if you have fears for your safety. I don't know about laws in the UK but many places in US you can pack heat so nobody will mess with you.

Well, the close friends I do make end up drifting away from me. I guess maybe that's natural...that as people get older they change and drift towards different people. And because of this I actually don't even see the point in trying to make close friends. If all I can get is some drinking buddies and an occasional night out to forget my worries then maybe I should just take it and try to enjoy the temporary good feelings and accept that this is just the way life is for me. I often regret going out afterwards too because of things that may happen, but at the time I'm enjoying myself. I figure that if I'm going to feel like $#%^ either way I may as well have a good night out in between...

I am really not sure what a support group would do for me...I don't really want to sit around and talk about how crap life is. I become a bit self conscious of talking about my feelings in person and I don't think I'd be able to completely open up anyway, but I can get there when I feel safe and I'm with someone who will offer helpful advice. I don't think that would be the case in a support group. Often being around people who are just as miserable as you makes things worse and brings me down further but then people who are upbeat and happy don't understand you so I don't know anymore. I think I'm just finding it hard not knowing why I'm alive at all and that's a very dark place to be. I don't understand why everyone I meet treats me as I'm of such low value and I don't want to hear people talking crap about, "How can you expect others to value you if you don't value yourself?". I think that's a cop out. People have the ability to be decent or to be disrespectful. Sensing that someone doesn't value themselves does not need to mean that you should just automatically treat them that way. Not all decisions are subconscious and no one goes through life letting their subconscious take over. People are consciously making the decision to treat me with disrespect and that is not normal. I'm tired and I don't see why I should be guilted into just putting up with this crap over and over just so I don't upset anyone by causing them grief.

i am going through this myself. i am considerably older,however, so i feel that i lived it up, with superficial people, and i should just accept this phase or whatever you want to call it. i actually feel it is more than a phase, and that it's permanent. you are young, though, and you must try not to let this happen to you, for if you do, you may be in for some other things that go with it, which i am experiencing. i have now let myself almost completely go, physically speaking, and that makes me hate my self even more. you are intelligent, i can see that, anyone can. maybe that is what is adding to your problems. i wish i had something smart to say, except please, please try in your own way to find a way toward what you want. i am tired myself of women's company, as i have been let down by them, equally, and miss men's perspectives, but i am afraid of how things might go if i do get involved, as i am prone to making fast,intense connections, which blindside me when they end up being fool's gold

joeyandvladdy wrote:i am going through this myself. i am considerably older,however, so i feel that i lived it up, with superficial people, and i should just accept this phase or whatever you want to call it. i actually feel it is more than a phase, and that it's permanent. you are young, though, and you must try not to let this happen to you, for if you do, you may be in for some other things that go with it, which i am experiencing. i have now let myself almost completely go, physically speaking, and that makes me hate my self even more. you are intelligent, i can see that, anyone can. maybe that is what is adding to your problems. i wish i had something smart to say, except please, please try in your own way to find a way toward what you want. i am tired myself of women's company, as i have been let down by them, equally, and miss men's perspectives, but i am afraid of how things might go if i do get involved, as i am prone to making fast,intense connections, which blindside me when they end up being fool's gold

Yes it's been going on for me for so long that it also feels permanent to me. I am having a particularly tough time with someone I met online and have felt a connection with and I couldn't just let go and move on. My anxiety and depression an crying has been crazy and somehow I have managed to re-establish contact with this person when it felt like it was fizzling out and he's asked me to meet him tomorrow eve. I was so pleased at first but I have asked him about 4 times for a time to meet...he has established WHERE but not WHEN. And it's less than 24 hours until we're supposed to meet. I'm going crazy thinking I'm going to go all the way there and he's not going to show up, or he will never confirm a time and I have prepared myself to meet him. I am having difficulty accepting that maybe he doesn't see the need to confirm a time just yet and maybe he will do so in the morning...I just cannot trust him...at ALL. He has said he won't be online again tonight and I have been checking the dating site to make sure he's told me the truth and hasn't logged in and it's becoming obsessive. I am sitting here thinking that even if he does meet me he will think I am disgusting because I think I look good in my photo's but I look in the mirror and I see this fat elephant. And I can't get it out of my mind that he's some sadistic person who just wants to get my hopes up and then crush me...I just cannot feel like anything he said is real. Why would he like me? Why would ANYONE like me? And how can I ever carry out a relationship if I'm freaking out so much?

I know I will still go and meet him if he confirms a time, but it doesn't feel good and I can't relax having all these terrible thoughts. I just...hate this and there's a voice telling me to cancel! I have been trying to lose weight and I have been succeeding but I have not reached my goal weight and I couldn't stand this guy to see me as I really am. I can't accept that a decent person could be on that site amongst so many idiots all just looking for sex and that he would like me...he has said things that should make him trustworthy, but I have learned that what someone says isn't necessarily how they really feel. And like you, I am scared because this feels like one of those dangerous instant connections and I just want to scream and cry ((((

i don't know about those sites. i don't want to be negative either, but i had to stay away from that sort of method. i think even for nons, it is so nerve racking. what is so great about this person, that you feel so pressured to lose weight so fast? or is it because your pic is not a good show of how you are now? is it bc he is a god? i don't like it when people dangle things in front of me or others. it's mean. sometimes it's not intentional, but watch out for it, because it's hard to bounce back. also be aware of your deep feelings you seem to have before even seeing or knowing the real him. i wish i had something smarter to say,but all i can do is issue warnings which may sound like i don't trust anyone, it's really just about taking care of yourself. you just sound like so insecure that some people might be able to use that to their advantage,too. at 47, i am trying to love myself. if i ever get there, then i'll get out there, but first things first. i never want to put myself through the stuff i put myself through again. mind you, when someone hurt me i was awfully good at "fixing their wagon" where possible! that's what one of my exes said,anyway! the thing is, the stories are funny, but they're also remarkably sad, and each time i got further from fixing myself. really, though, i don't want to sound like a downer, but i also don't want to be all like saying all this positive mumbo jumbo either. hope you figure it out for the best!

joeyandvladdy wrote:i don't know about those sites. i don't want to be negative either, but i had to stay away from that sort of method. i think even for nons, it is so nerve racking. what is so great about this person, that you feel so pressured to lose weight so fast? or is it because your pic is not a good show of how you are now? is it bc he is a god? i don't like it when people dangle things in front of me or others. it's mean. sometimes it's not intentional, but watch out for it, because it's hard to bounce back. also be aware of your deep feelings you seem to have before even seeing or knowing the real him. i wish i had something smarter to say,but all i can do is issue warnings which may sound like i don't trust anyone, it's really just about taking care of yourself. you just sound like so insecure that some people might be able to use that to their advantage,too. at 47, i am trying to love myself. if i ever get there, then i'll get out there, but first things first. i never want to put myself through the stuff i put myself through again. mind you, when someone hurt me i was awfully good at "fixing their wagon" where possible! that's what one of my exes said,anyway! the thing is, the stories are funny, but they're also remarkably sad, and each time i got further from fixing myself. really, though, i don't want to sound like a downer, but i also don't want to be all like saying all this positive mumbo jumbo either. hope you figure it out for the best!

No sorry it's not him that's making me want to lose weight...I just want to lose weight and have more confidence. The idea of meeting him lowers my confidence a lot and it might have been the fact that he mentioned he was engaged to a penthouse model which sounded unreal in itself but the way he said it I didn't doubt it. I tried to put up "selfies" of myself without make up as they were the only recent ones I had but I didn't get enough views, but he still messaged me. They are accurate but you can't see how big my thighs are and I just look generally nicer than I do in real life in the others. Some pics I have now put up are really stunning shots along with the no make up ones as a kind of way of saying, I can look really nice...but this is what I really look like. So I've tried very hard not to deceive anyone. I just don't see the person in the pics in the mirror. I know I am at the same weight when those pics were taken years ago yet I feel fatter.

I guess he has a way of talking and intriguing me and things that suggest he would want a relationship with me, which should maybe be a red flag,,,or not, I don't know! And I to try to keep away from getting too intensely involved before I've met someone but sometimes it just happens and there;s nothing you can do about it, you know? Certain people have this effect on me. He's only the 2nd person I've met online to make me feel these things and suggests that he's feeling something similar. But it could all be lies...he did spend a lot of time online talking to me today so perhaps that's a good thing. But it begs the question of why he asked me to email him outside of the site anyway...

And yes I am very worried of being taken advantage of...of have him kiss me and say all these lovely sweet things and then just disappearing after going through all of this. And the sad part is sorta that if he really is as lovely as he sounds, then perhaps having him around will build my confidence and faith again and I know I should not expect that from anyone but I am just getting worse alone and a confidence boost would help so much. I honestly thought the guy looked fairly average in his pics, so how did he manage to snag a model?? Maybe when he was younger, but that is something that is always going to make me feel inadequate. Thinking to myself that he was fairly average looking but now he's gotta be hot in person if he can get a hot model. How am I supposed to be good enough when compared against that? But he seemed too like something in my profile he liked and I just hope he is a decent as he sounds because I might actualy get the urge to g home and slit my throat if he rejects me, or doesn't confirm plans or doesn't show up.... I wish someone would "fix" me if possible, but all I think is how he's going to start thinking what a psycho I am when he sees the scars on my arms from when I cut them up with a razor at age 15. I really want him to be different and be able to look past my emotionally difficulties and I've been basing that on his current communication but then I suppose I shouldn't do that until we've met....If we ever meet.

wow. you are super-tense. i am pretty sure though, and i know i hate being told to cool it, but really try and look at this rationally. you look fine,very fine from the sounds of it, but yet you are criticising yourself and letting your mind go in all these places it ought not go. my question is, what was his agenda in specifying his ex-fiancee's profession or whatever? i am pretty sure he's already picked up on some of your insecurities if he's been so intimately messaging,etc. anyway, maybe just see if you do indeed get a date with mr wonderful-who's-ex-was-a-penthouse-model, and try and have fun if you go(and by that i mean, how much fun can you have if you're obsessing about your thighs?),and just use it as a chance to practise getting back out on a date. keeping your eyes wide open, you will see that you are putting him on a pedestal. just pretend you are watching him or listening to him talking to another girl, and see if you would be telling that girl that he is so great, he is worth picking herself apart molecule by molecule