New girl (to this section at least)

Hi,

I'm new to the AvPD section but not so new (well, one week) to these forums in general. Up until now I've been mostly hanging out in the Sexual Abuse and Incest forums because that issue started seeming relevant lately… and seeing as there is a nice AvPD forum here I figured I may as well join cuz I'm pretty sure I have that (only "pretty sure" because 9 years ago my shrink only told me I had "some kind of PD" but wouldn't specify. I gathered that this is it only based on what I read about it).

It's weird but even though I had no problem spilling my guts in the other forum, I'm rather terrified about posting here right now… and have always been terrified of AvPD forums for some unknown reason even though I've been doing everything else I can to overcome it in the past several years…

Maybe it's just a matter of not wanting to poke a hole in the dam or something…

Anyway, right now I feel so very stupid, selfish, narcissistic and disgusting (and anxious) for writing so damn much about myself just now… is that what AvPD really feels like?

Is it normal (for an AvPD that is) to want to start apologizing right now?

Hello again, TooMuch. Welcoe to the AvPD forum.

Yes, that sounds a lot like what AvPD. Feeling like your somehow less important, and that we probably won't really care. That's just the feelings of self worth that really sums AvPD up, really. Along with avoiding talking to others for fear of fear of confirming this. But you have come to the right place!

There's no need to be afraid of spilling in here, everyone needs to sometime. If you feel as though talking here would break the dam, then you have probably been holding onto to far too much.

Thanks Rixus

You're probably right about this being a sign that I've been holding it in for too long... although it just occurred to me that what really scares me is especially talking to equally sensitive people... No matter what I say, or am about to say, I feel like apologizing for it knowing I might have somehow hurt someone that way.

Well, I guess I may as well start with the gut spilling now - I feel like anything I touch might turn to ash (my mother always either crumbled or exploded if I so much as said everything "right" but with the "wrong" tone of voice) so I'm afraid of touching anything unless it's in order to nurture it in some way (which might be codependent behavior and thus -destructive too...)... Well... I guess that wasn't too hard to spill out :-/ and it only took one paragraph somehow...

btw, even though I'm fully aware that I have no sane/rational reason to say this - I'm sorry

Toomuch wrote:Anyway, right now I feel so very stupid, selfish, narcissistic and disgusting (and anxious) for writing so damn much about myself just now… is that what AvPD really feels like?

Is it normal (for an AvPD that is) to want to start apologizing right now?

Yes to both. At least that's what my experience has been. At least this is a relatively safe place to talk about such feelings.

Every post I write, I waffle about and hesitate to submit. It also takes me a long time to write the simplest responses. And I get heart palpitations when I log in again after posting because I'm convinced whatever I said will be torn apart. It doesn't matter how much evidence I have that it probably won't happen. It's ridiculous. Other posters have talked about how they replay recent experiences over again in their head and obsess over what they perceive they did wrong. That's definitely what it is. I try to keep posting (when not overwhelmed by classes) to try and get over that impulse, but it doesn't go away! All the positive reinforcement in the world won't stop that stupid cycle.

And I also feel like I'm being a disgusting narcissist every time I make a post. Often I agonize over whether I've used the words "I" and "me" too often in a post. It leads to censoring myself a lot and deleting huge chunks of what I've written or deciding not to post after all.

The urge to apologize for what I've just written has become less intense over time, thankfully. There are times I want to go and delete all my old posts, but I've somehow resisted the urge so far.

You're definitely not alone. Welcome to this part of the board!

Thank you ShadowTerra

A. For the reply itself - which helped me because I really wanted and needed that, of course… not that I'm saying I demand it from anyone and - I'd better stop this trend of thought now before it turns into obsessive compulsive babble…

B. For posting the reply despite the emotions you described (I really appreciate that).

If I'm not adding much to this reply it's because of certain conflicting emotions (which aren't your fault!) over what exactly to say or not say so I'll just stick to – thank you again.

Toomuch wrote:Thanks Rixus
Thanks Rixus

You're probably right about this being a sign that I've been holding it in for too long... although it just occurred to me that what really scares me is especially talking to equally sensitive people... No matter what I say, or am about to say, I feel like apologizing for it knowing I might have somehow hurt someone that way.

Well, I guess I may as well start with the gut spilling now - I feel like anything I touch might turn to ash (my mother always either crumbled or exploded if I so much as said everything "right" but with the "wrong" tone of voice) so I'm afraid of touching anything unless it's in order to nurture it in some way (which might be codependent behavior and thus -destructive too...)... Well... I guess that wasn't too hard to spill out :-/ and it only took one paragraph somehow...

btw, even though I'm fully aware that I have no sane/rational reason to say this - I'm sorry

I feel silly saying this, but there's no need to apologise

Sensitive doesn't always mean we'll be hurt by the slightest thing - which sounds like what you were used to growing up. I can really simpathise with how your mother made you feel. It feels like your thinking about someone else's feelings that you think your own don't matter to anyone.

Yes, feeling as if you're doing something wrong or feeling as though your posts will ripped to shreds sounds normal. When I first decided to post on here, I spent two days repeating what I was going to say to myself, and then half an hour in front of a blank screen before I started.

Thanks again [if this starts to sound compulsive that's because it is (not fake though)… please don’t mind].

And you're right about my mother except that what scares me isn't so much being ripped to shreds (I got over that thanks to ordinary forums full of extra-ordinary insensitive and mean people whom I learned to have fun with ) but that my feelings might somehow be destructive to others (stupid and megalomaniac-like – I know…).

As for my feelings… I'm not even really past the point of resenting them yet. I only analyze them and seek therapy in order to improve my life (and even then the soul purpose of that was always just in order to someday help others, until recently) and for that matter the ability to "kick them around" has even made therapy easier in some way…

OK, I need to finish writing this post now before spilling over or looking (feeling) even more stupid (sorry and thanks again).

You can say thank you as much or as little as you want. Whatever makes you feel comfortable

It's not exactly a meglamanic attitude, just a fear that's been forced onto you. What you need to realise is that if anyone's feelings were destructive to others, it was your mother's. Has anyone else reinforced this ideal that you are in some way destructive to others? So far I've seen nothing that I can picture any person having just cause to be offended by.

I don't know if there's a word for it, but I would say that your main problem seems to be that you can't stop thinking about how other people are feeling, and have almost lost the ability to think of yourself. You said you couldn't even go to therapy unless it was for somone elses benefit. What has changed recently that has made you look past this?

I'm not completely sure I know what you mean by "kicking them around", but it sounds quite detached. If so, then I do that too. Detaching from your emotions, almost like being able to step outside and look in on them (or maybe I'm just crazy), is a good way to stop and analise things sometimes, but not a good way to live.

To finish, no, you don't in any way sound stupid, meglamanic, destructive, narcisistic or any other horrid thing you believe of yourself. You sound like a lovely, caring person who just needs to believe that people can talk to them without the need to explode in any way.

Thanks again (hehe )

Rixus wrote:What you need to realise is that if anyone's feelings were destructive to others, it was your mother's.

Funny you should mention that about my mother's feelings… I've realized it for a long time now but it only really hit me now that you mention it.

Rixus wrote:Has anyone else reinforced this ideal that you are in some way destructive to others? So far I've seen nothing that I can picture any person having just cause to be offended by.

Hummm well… I dunno… believe it or not, back when I was little, my mother seemed to be the most "positive" character in my life because in the outside world there was just: my first and second grade teacher who, for some reason, singled me out and used to dedicate about 10 minutes of every lesson to screaming at me for either not paying attention or whatever… then there were all other kids who would either bully, laugh at or ignore me and there was a female friend of my mother's who seemed to hate everything about every child… and then again there was her daughter who was my only friend back then even though she mostly just tried to manipulate me and my mother would spend hours upon hours screaming at me to drop her as a friend because she was "being a bad influence on me"… but if I had to pin point what mostly made me feel like a destructive person it would probably have to do with the fact that when I was 7 she tried to kill herself and I was the one who found her and had to call for an ambulance (we live alone together ya'see)… up until then I used to be more self absorbed: I would allow myself to resent the grownups who treated me badly, I enjoyed trapping, experimenting on and at times even killing ants… and in the back of my mind I might have wished my mother would just drop dead… but after that incident I stopped killing ants (for many years I even tried to watch where I was stepping in order to avoid stepping on any and felt that I'd probably go to hell someday just for the ones I missed because I couldn’t avoid stepping on them always). I even started thinking that my teacher was right in constantly screaming at me (even though I still wasn't able to force myself to pay attention or do my homework) and started "being a good girl" with my mother by doing anything she wanted including dropping my childhood friend... and avoiding all other people for many years because my mother didn’t like me having friends even if she didn't say it explicitly… oh btw, she also often told me that she's "afraid of me"

Rixus wrote: You said you couldn't even go to therapy unless it was for somone elses benefit. What has changed recently that has made you look past this?

Er, kind of a long story ( :p ) but to cut it short: A) I was always terrified of ruining my life, B) I spent two years doing a degree which I though would both bring me respect and enable me to help others, C) after realizing that subject in question doesn't satisfy me, wears me out and worst of all – will probably land me nowhere but the poorhouse because most people in this field can't get a job in my country – I decided to drop it and started forcing myself to think practical and look for a field of study that would enable me to find any job (even a "selfish" one where I'd be giving little help to anyone and "only" making money for my own "selfish" needs)… D) Realizing that I'll never be of any real help to anyone of I end up a homeless person.

Rixus wrote: I'm not completely sure I know what you mean by "kicking them around", but it sounds quite detached. If so, then I do that too. Detaching from your emotions, almost like being able to step outside and look in on them (or maybe I'm just crazy), is a good way to stop and analise things sometimes, but not a good way to live.

You don't sound at all crazy and yes that's exactly what I mean… even my therapists have marvelled at my ability to look at my issues without any apparent pain and break down one emotional barrier after another quickly and easily… I'd simply ignore the pain as it arouse and that ironically worked even against psychological barriers… however, in the past few weeks I've been dealing with issues that "kick back" and the pain is sometimes very hard to control – but that's probably a good thing

Rixus wrote: To finish, no, you don't in any way sound stupid, meglamanic, destructive, narcisistic or any other horrid thing you believe of yourself. You sound like a lovely, caring person who just needs to believe that people can talk to them without the need to explode in any way.

Thank you, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty, ty *blushes and runs to hide under a rock*

(Heaves rock out of way)

Hi again. Having read you're other posts, I'll second the advice again that you need to move on. Do you mind if I ask what subject it was? You may just be imagining it. And what country you're in? I might be able to offer some advice. You're finding it hard to leave, that's understandable and in no way "sick" as you put it on the other thread. You are afraid to leave you're mother because she has more or less beaten the idea that she cannot live without you into you. That's terrible for a parent to do. She needs a full time carer, but you know that.

It will be easier if you take smaller steps. Try getting ajob first, mnaking friends and staying out. Maybe even a weekend away would do you good. How did you're interview go, on that note? And what kind of jobs are looking at? You don't have to get a seemingly "noble" job in order to help people. When I did a simple bar job while I was in Uni, you'd be surprised at how many people needed advice with their problems. And even in the job I do now (which is purely to make as much money as possible), people ask for help and advice all the time.

I wonder, how strong is this emotional detachment you speak of? I've yet to meet anyone else who actually does this. It started out as "hiding" my emotions from others, and "projecting" them onto an imaginery person inside. That is totally crazy, I know. But it's always worked. I thought I was going to go DID at one point, but now I can actually shut them off if I need to. I'm trying not to do that these days because it's really not healthy. And it's very tiring to do for long periods of time.

The reason I bring that up is because it sounds to me like you learned to do the same thing because of you're mother erruptive nature, and became afraid that everyone who saw your feelings would be afraid or hurt. But as you can see, no one here has been hurt or reacted badley.