Narcissism Hijacked - SLC interviews Vaknin

I saw this new video today and it's interesting. SLC (Richard Grannon) interviews Sam Vaknin about the "anti-narcissist" community.



Interesting concepts about how "group think" which arises from the "victim" community, how they end up painting themselves all white, Ns all black (demons, monsters, etc.). I thought it was interesting how Grannon says he gets *heaps* of abuse when he tries to depict Ns as humans. He refers to it as a "mob" mentality. (He's probably going to take a hit from his watchers for that.).

I don't normally care much about these intermural contests. I don't care much how NPD is portrayed because, it really does suck. But, it caught my eye that these two particular guys are having this discussion. Sam isn't well liked by either side. Grannon (SLC) isn't liked by those with disorders.

Politics are getting weird lately.

Politics are getting weird lately.

Nah....but I like Vaknin , he doesn't pull any punches...

28:00 - Sam talks about empathy.

He seems to say Ns have empathy, but it's "cold empathy." An ability to understand what it's like to be someone else, identify with their experiences, etc. But, emotionally deficient. Used only to get supply (or used with our own kind, in a so-called "invert" relationship.). That's about 35:00. (At the same point, Richard said Ns have empathy.).

38:00 - Sam says narcissism on the internet is 99% mythology, not science (says it serves as emotional p0rn).

39:30 - Gets into alloplastic defense. ("I wasn't ripped off by a smooth talking man. I didn't use poor judgement. It was a MONSTER!"). Magnets.

One connection I made at this point is how the victim (strident "anti-N") community seems to be people who share the same defense. It's like they're "infected" by the transcendent force they were subjected to (the narcissist). In so doing, they objectify themselves (as defenseless to this other-worldly "evil").

47:00 - Anti-Ns are in a permanent state of "victimhood."

Ends with discussion of how narcissism is "adulterated" by those popularizing it as common everywhere (movies, cultures). Suggests the word may stop being used due to its overuse.

It sounds like we have a dubious distinction like psychopaths did when the word was overused, and real psychopaths can pop up at parties and freak everyone out being "the real deal."

Can't view the video at work, but Truth too late's description mirrors my own general thoughts.
Psychopathy, sociopathy and narcissism are increasingly used as moralistic labels to attack people one doesn't like. Rendering the relationship black and white is a very apt description. Someone who made a bad choice of friend or boyfriend\girlfriend? They're not responsible for that choice, because the other person is a narcissist and we all know manipulation is narcissists' superpower. It's not that the victim was influenced towards a choice that they themselves then made. It's as if narcissists COMPEL others and always necessarily towards something malicious.

The attitude is honestly disgusting. It's a combination of witch hunting, responsibility shifting and finding acceptable targets to hate.

InSpiritus wrote:

Politics are getting weird lately.

Nah....but I like Vaknin , he doesn't pull any punches...

I like him too. But, there's gotta be some heads exploding around here. It seems like a definitive video. They're drawing a bright line to distance themselves from the "anti-n" mob. SLC said he gets reamed when he depicts an N as a person.

Vaknin says something in the beginning which I thought was interesting. He admitted he gets something from "pushing buttons." That probably explains the sharpened vocabulary I've said can be a little painful at times for a newly self-aware. Pushing buttons is a good way to describe it. Makes it simpler to convey the warning.

I liked the description of empathy. That could be similar to the way I've described it for myself. (I feel like I wasn't fully in the moment, viewing the moment through a different frame of reference. I felt like there was less of me in the present to devote to that activity.). He says it's an emotional deficiency. A cold empathy. I would say "prioritized empathy." Selective empathy.

I'm blown away by this. I PM'd you about it and I commented under his video. What they said needed to be said. I'd write more but I have to get to work now.

Vaknin gets far too much hate, IMHO. From both sides.
I don't care if he's in in for the supply, what he's doing is a good thing and he has helped more than he's harmed, so do any selfish motives on his part really matter? I don't think so.

Narcissists aren't human. Therefore, we don't break wind! Mine diffuses out of me by the process of osmosis.

http://youtu.be/Xy7bJzsJQ9o

Shy (self aware) narcissist Patsy partners up with extravert narcissist Cami Li. I'd regard Patsy as one of the most exciting of Englishwomen. I think most other middle aged English male narcissists do also!

Yeah, the vilifying of narcs often raises my eyebrows. I realise abuse isn't excusable but the rabid demonising of narcs and the labelling of anyone who has then acted in a way that triggers victims as narcissists or sociopaths is pretty ridiculous. There needs to be a middle ground and this victim culture removes any responsibility from the individual - even when manipulation is involved, there are two people playing a role. It's hilarious that victims dehumanise the abuser. It achieves nothing except segregation and an unwillingness to look for ways of finding solutions to a serious issue. I'm not saying they should stick around to be abused, but labelling people monsters without seeking to understand the mechanisms of behaviour is akin to sticking your head in the sand and acting like you've been abducted by aliens.

I've noticed there's this enduring idea that everything narcs do is premeditated and malignant. I watched one video where this woman outright stated that everything [the victim] does or says is filed away by the narc, that we are always five steps ahead and we are always thinking about how we're going to utilise our narc superpowers to manipulate and destroy. Paranoid much? I'm sure there are a few AsPDs and high narcs who actively do this but I really don't believe that we are all stalking around clocking every tiny little thing and assimilating it into the ultra-complex chess game of our lives in order to reduce our SOs to a quivering sack of meat... not in any conscious, kind of shrivelled supervillain fashion that nons have cobbled together in their imaginations. Being self-aware, I feel like I could, but I think that there must be some antisocial elements involved in those who know what they're capable of and choose to act on it, rather than it being an ignorant dysfunction of the way we relate to the people around us.

Loved the video, watched the whole thing when I woke up with a cup of coffee and a bunch of cigarettes, lol.

I agree wholeheartedly with what they're talking about in the video, and I've mentioned quite often on these boards that the vilification of narcissists on the internet is out-of-hand. I also thought that a lot of the anti-narcissism crowd on the internet were relying too heavily on Splitting, and it made me wonder if many in this crowd had a PD themselves?

I also LOVED it when he said that "n-magnets" are not victims. THANK YOU! Getting your needs met by trying to fix others, caretake them against their will, and impose your wares on them is just as manipulative as anything a narcissist can do. I've been saying for months that co-dependents are not "victims" and to stop portraying them as such. I know this is narcissistic of me, but it feels good to have a well-known person like Vaknin to finally say what I've been saying about Rosenberg.

Great share, truth.

NimplyDinply wrote: and it made me wonder if many in this crowd had a PD themselves?

I'm fairly sure many of them do.