Figuring out Personal Boundaries

Because of some recent issues with my parents that have caused a lot of upheaval in our system, my T says I need to start working on my boundaries. For me, I don't feel like I have any boundaries, any right to boundaries. This toxic belief I know is related to my family of origin and the abuse I suffered. I really don't recognize where I start/end with most people. My focus is to please, make others happy and don't rock the boat (Co-dependency). Others in my system have boundaries and they can come roaring out when they are crossed. But those boundaries seem vague and undefined to me, and some parts have boundaries that work at cross-purposes.

I've been spending some time reading about making personal boundaries. I keep getting stuck at the first step - defining who you are, knowing yourself. Myself was toxically defined by my parents, the abuse. I became an adult who has allowed herself to be defined somewhat by her husband and her kids...all in an attempt to not be hurt too much again. I live my life in "have to's", "shoulds", and "make it easier by just giving in". The protectors step in when things become too much, when the littles are feeling threatened by the outside world. By that time the personal/emotional boundaries have been crossed and more damage is done.

So, with all the thoughts and the voices, without a true sense of ME how do I begin to define my personal boundaries? How can I learn what it feels like to have them crossed before the system is so upset?

One of the most useful things I've ever read about boundaries that is really starting to help me is about noticing your feelings. You might not actually know what your boundaries are, but your feelings can give you some clues. If you start to feel anxious or angry or something, that can give you a clue that your boundaries are being crossed, even though you don't actually feel like you have boundaries. You probably do actually have at least some boundaries already, you just may be so used to ignoring the feelings of people crossing those boundaries because you feel they have a right to, that you think you don't notice so much when those negative feelings arise.

For example, if someone was touching you and you might start to feel uncomfortable. You might feel uncomfortable at the actual touching or you might feel uncomfortable at the thought of disagreeing with what they want to do, but either way, that uncomfortable feeling can tell you that you have a boundary there. Then you have to work out how to enforce that boundary by taking an action. Maybe that action would be to first say something and if someone doesn't respect your boundary after you've said something, then you might have to take a more drastic action like leaving the room etc. A boundary with an effective consequence if the boundary isn't being respected is the most effective boundary of all.

Can you think of any situations that may have happened that have made you feel uncomfortable/angry/upset/other emotion? Perhaps some of these things were caused by people doing wrong by you and are areas where someone crossed a boundary for you that you weren't really aware you had?

salted lipstick wrote:One of the most useful things I've ever read about boundaries that is really starting to help me is about noticing your feelings.

Exactly.

My favorite author on boundaries is Henry Cloud. I think I have read all his books. However, they are heavily Christian-oriented. If that is triggering for you, then try Anne Katherine's book Boundaries: Where You End and I Begin. She has a new book, about boundaries and social media, that I do not recommend.

salted lipstick wrote:One of the most useful things I've ever read about boundaries that is really starting to help me is about noticing your feelings. You might not actually know what your boundaries are, but your feelings can give you some clues. If you start to feel anxious or angry or something, that can give you a clue that your boundaries are being crossed, even though you don't actually feel like you have boundaries. You probably do actually have at least some boundaries already, you just may be so used to ignoring the feelings of people crossing those boundaries because you feel they have a right to, that you think you don't notice so much when those negative feelings arise.

That is part of my problem. I am so use to dissociating away from those feelings. I'm still working on trying to stay present and actually feel. My last appointment we started a conversation about my mother and I almost immediately switched. My T had an hour-and-a-half appointment with two other alters discussing my mother. When I came back my T was like you have got to work on boundaries with your mother. But, I don't have a problem with my mother and we really do get along well most of the time.

Una+ wrote:My favorite author on boundaries is Henry Cloud. I think I have read all his books. However, they are heavily Christian-oriented. If that is triggering for you, then try Anne Katherine's book Boundaries: Where You End and I Begin. She has a new book, about boundaries and social media, that I do not recommend.

I'm looking up these books now for some rainy weekend reading material. Thanks for the suggestions.

Hi Amy,

What Salted Lipstick mentioned is so important, to listen to how your feeling. You do make a very important remark about dissociating at those moments, so it's difficult to listen to what you're feeling.

How about if you talk to what could be good boundaries to others in your system, and you set them for yourself? Or at least the most important and crucial ones. Listen to what upset them, and draw the lines at things that upset them, even if you do it for a while.

So for example, if Melissa is upset because you daily dress the children, and you don't mind doing it; then talk to your husband about you doing it sometimes, and him doing it the other times. And see how do you and Melissa respond to that.

For me, I've identify that I'm very good at setting boundaries, however, when it comes to romantic relationships, I'm not that good at it. So, I've been looking at why does that happen and how to put them. I basically use what Salted Lipstick said. If I'm upset, or hurt, is a boundary that's been crossed, and I don't have to put up with it, I can talk about it in order to have a healthy relationship.

Could dissociating be a sign that a boundary is being crossed? How do you feel right before you go away? Maybe if you start to pay attention to what happens both physically and emotionally before going away, you might identify when the boundary is crossed.

Sea

Analyzing what I can actually remember of my personal history, I strongly suspect that every member of my system has a very different idea of their personal boundaries. It can cause quite a bit of turmoil and ruckus sometimes. Especially when I have one part lamenting about how dreadfully lonely they are, one part tripping ballz at the idea of anyone getting close, and yet another part who feels neither lonely nor fearful regardless. I've lost track of the number of times we've had this push-pull crisis with outsiders when trying to navigate bonding with other people. For this reason (likely among others) I think boundaries could be extremely challenging with something like D.I.D. I have a part in my system who will blab our heart and soul to just about anyone, and then I will be left feeling totally shocked, angry and terrified.

In my family of origin boundary violations were rampant. My mother would search my room in front of me, tossing my things and screaming verbal abuse, exposing all my little secrets and shaming me for them. It was clear she had already searched secretly, had worked herself up into a rage, and the whole incident was staged. When I was in my late teens she would burst into my room in the middle of the night to scream at me; apparently she wasn't sleeping well and in her mind that was my fault. My father would without any preamble launch into personal disclosures that were both highly inappropriate and triggering for me. It was only decades later, as an adult, that I learned other people do not all behave this way.

I also learned that I could require my father to ask for permission before launching into his story telling. That, if he did not ask or did not respect my negative answer, I could still maintain my boundary by telling him to leave or by leaving myself. And if my mother disregarded my request that she not share my personal affairs with the entire world on the Internet, I could protect my privacy by not sharing with her or anyone else who would share with her.

I learned that some of my own behaviors constituted boundary violations of others, and I try not to do that anymore.

am4kds wrote:My focus is to please, make others happy and don't rock the boat (Co-dependency).

This is almost me all the time since I was young. I just wanted to be the very best friend so I would never argue or disagree.

am4kds wrote:That is part of my problem. I am so use to dissociating away from those feelings. I'm still working on trying to stay present and actually feel.

Almost certain this is what I do as well.

Una+ wrote:My mother would search my room in front of me, tossing my things and screaming verbal abuse, exposing all my little secrets and shaming me for them. It was clear she had already searched secretly, had worked herself up into a rage, and the whole incident was staged. When I was in my late teens she would burst into my room in the middle of the night to scream at me; apparently she wasn't sleeping well and in her mind that was my fault.

And this is just all too familiar, very similar. Not really about boundaries, just letting you know that I at least somewhat know how it feels. I know no one really knows how you feel, but I get what you are saying through my own experiences.

Thanks Uns+ for sharing this thread with me. I guess now that I think about it, I do have a problem with certain bounderies. Interesting, that's why this forum is so useful.

Attending DBT therapy is most helpful with the establishment of boundaries and getting to know oneself. DBT stand for Dialectical Behavioral Therapy invented by Marhsa Linehan. I would look for a therapist who specializes in DBT and treats Borderlines (who have the same problems with boundaries).

I wish you luck-help is out there.

Gruss Boris

am4kds wrote: I really don't recognize where I start/end with most people. My focus is to please, make others happy and don't rock the boat

I really relate to this, too. Less-than-healthy boundaries are definitely something I need to work on, especially in romantic relationships (since getting old enough to move out of an abusive home with awful boundaries I've put such thick walls between me and my parents that I guess you could call them boundaries but idk I doubt they're the healthiest). It took me a while to realise that 'having poor boundaries' doesn't just mean you walking all over someone's needs, but can also mean letting others do that to you. I thought that being a 'people pleaser' was just a trait I had, rather than a sign of poor boundaries and sense of self, so it really opened my eyes.

I'm still working on being able to say 'no'. How can such a small word be so difficult to say? (Morgen - protector of course - would just like to add that it is one of their favourite words)

I don't have a lot to add right now except to agree that yes, feelings are important markers of boundaries being pushed or crossed, and yes DBT might be helpful (especially the 'interpersonal effectiveness' part; it's about learning assertiveness whilst keeping respect for yourself etc, all handy stuff).

Oh actually, one thing that I've found helpful, or at least worthwhile to think about, is to identify if you have any relationships (family, friend, partner, colleague...) that DO feel like they have good, strong, well communicated, rewarding boundaries in both directions, and then see what ways you could make any relationships that are less good in that respect be a bit more like that one. E.g. a romantic attachment could actually benefit a great deal if some boundaries were approached more like you would with a good platonic friend, or perhaps some sort of assertiveness you have with a boss or colleague could be translated to a family member.

It's never a walk in the park though, especially with DID stuff making having a solid sense of 'myself' so hard! This thread has given me so much to think about, thanks all