what is the abuser thinking?

I have recently left a verbally abusive longterm relationship. He used lies and the distortion and withholding of information to control my thoughts and emotions, made degrading jokes about my body even when I asked him to stop repeatedly, took out his emotions on me by yelling at me for trivial things that i was supposed to have done wrong like walking too slow, accused me of flirting with people when I was just being friendly, attacked my dreams in life, asked me to justify money that I spent on personal things that he knew were important to me yet had no problem spending my money on him, always required me to be more committed to him and make more effort to be better to him no matter how hard i tried, disregarded my opinions and cast doubt on the accuracy of my knowledge, told me I was forgetful, told me I was lazy, infantilised my emotions, could never ever apologise or take responsibility and be accountable for his actions and always found some new way to retract or void his apologies, etc. On my birthday he asked me to justify the price of my favourite ice cream when there was another ice cream that was sixty cents cheaper, and we ended up getting the cheaper ice cream because he insisted that the one that I wanted was too expensive. But there were a lot of positive things about the relationship too. He did a lot of very thoughtful things for me, listened to me patiently when I was talking about my problems that were not related to him, and did a lot of things that I loved too. I loved him very dearly and the emotions now are difficult.

The reason that I finally left the relationship, is because he controlled my thoughts with lies in such a way that required me to doubt myself, to question my memories and perceptions, in order that he could get something for himself, which was really only the knowledge that I would change all my plans according to his wishes. This was very hard for me because I have suffered from depression in the past, and when my depression has been more severe it has had psychotic symptoms and I have become uncertain of reality. He was aware of this. He was also aware of the difficulties that I have had in the past when other people have treated me in this way, when they lied about reality in order to make me question myself, so that they could get something that they wanted for themselves. I felt like he used my trust, which was perfect, as a weapon against me, rather than respecting it as the important gift to him that it was. All of this was too much for me to take and I actually did lose touch with reality, my Dr hospitalised me. He has apologised for what he did since we broke up.

The first question I have relates to his feelings. I know that I was not perfect in the relationship but I know what I felt for him and I know that the love that I had for him would never have allowed me to do to him what he did to me. If I had considered doing it I would have thought "I would never hurt him like that." During the relationship he said that he loved me all the time and did many things to indicate to me that he did in fact love me. Is it likely that he really loved me? Or was it something other than love that he felt about me, or love mixed with something else?

The second question that i have is about his thoughts. I wonder what he was thinking when he decided to sabotage my mind. Maybe he just did not understand properly what he was doing? But then, when I confronted him about it, he kept denying what he had done. He said he didn't remember it, then when I described it in detail he said that what he meant was just that he didn't remember it with the precision that I did, which is rubbish because before I described it he couldn't have known how vividly I remembered it. He made comments that indicated that the idea that he manipulated and controlled me was just something that I made up. He wouldn't admit to it even though i confronted him with it repeatedly, he kept coming up with all these other stories and lies and then basically just the denial that what I had experienced was real, even though it was at a point at which it couldn't be denied. He said that there was nothing productive that he could say, but for me, continuing to lie about what happened, failing to take responsibility, was the least productive thing he could have done. When he was continuing to lie, and I was indicating to him that I was becoming increasingly distressed, what kind of thing was he thinking? Did he really convince himself that he hadn't controlled me or lied to me? Was he afraid that if he admitted it, since he had done it before and I had caught him out and told him not to, that he would lose me? Or was he doing it because he knew I wouldn't be able to take it and wanted to get rid of me?

I realise I am making a big deal out of this but I would really like to understand what was happening in his head so I can try and move on with my life. If there are any people in this forum who have been verbally abusive in the past I would really appreciate any perspectives you might have about this. Sorry if I have not been clear enough in my description of events please ask any questions. Thanks for any contributions.

Hi, bluegrey! Welcome to the forum. I think I've been through something a bit similar. When people try to mess with your mind like that, they do it for power and even if they're not thinking about it all the time, they know what they're doing to you. They're not confused and they are responsible for their actions.
I don't know if he really loved you. It could be that it was all about him. He sounds very selfish and cruel and you're lucky that it's over. I don't think it's possible to have any kind of relationship with a person like this, becouse they'd always use you for their needs. Maybe you should take a look through the NPD forum.

Thanks Jasmin

You're welcome! Please talk and vent here when you fell like it.

Good grief, my child - YOU are packing all this baggage around for HIM? Drop a bundle of sticks and get them later, you are more than half-way to the village!

It sounds like a "mild" or "temporay" or "under great stess" verbal abuser (that no one has a reasonable excuse for, btw), I can tell you from a man's point of view. Irrespectitive that we (men) sometimes lash out at those that are most close - both in a physical and emotional sense (although I have never raised a hand to any woman, ever - but words can cut just as deep) We just seem to hurt the ones that we love the most, and don't ask me why - I can't understand it, never mind explain it.

But it is always wrong to do that.... always. Take heart in the prayers being thought about for you, I'm sure there are more than a few, and mine will be on the list.

A quote that may help:
" Every day is a birthday. Wake up each day and celebrate."
~ Jonlyn H. in Georgia




My wife and I get along pretty well (for the most part, but I will be caustious in that regard).
But sh*t seems to happen, and usually at the worst time - men CAN be selfish pigs, who only care about their own wounds.

But over the 35 years she has told me, and I could not deny that my intellect, small as it may be, was like knives, to her.


I have felt bad about that for a long timne, but I get told every so often (by her, as well as a few close friends) - that I'm coming along substantionally.



Just as a light moment for anyone reading this thread, check this

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Hello bluegrey. I have to say the relationship you described sounds A LOT like the relationship between my father and mother. My dad did a lot of the same $#%^, he verbally tore apart my mom for the littlest of things and he even talked a lot of crap about her family. He would disregard her emotions and any knowledge she had and treated her like she was to be seen and not heard. And sometimes he would act completely different, further confusing everything. But no nice deeds he did can take back all the other $#%^.

He did the same thing with my siblings and I. He would totally destroy our self-esteems with words and saying crap like we are useless worthless people and would never amount to anything. Of course when he wasn't mad or in his bad moods, he would tell us how he loved us, how he would give his life for us, how we are destined to be great people, .......almost like that other side didn't exist.

And never did he ever apologize directly for anything and to this day he will say everything he did was correct and just. He would never admit he was wrong, even if his god said so!

My mom is still technically with him, though they live separately. Leaving the man you were with was a good idea, if you stayed any longer he would have probably driven you completely crazy like my dad nearly did with my mom and us. None of us would ever spend more than a couple days with him now.

Hey countryview, I totally agree that men can be such selfish pigs. Many lack the empathy women have towards others and instead direct that empathy towards themselves. This has of course been scientifically shown statistically speaking.

i think it's as though he really did love me, but that the love was toxic or contaminated in some way, and it was impossible to separate the contaminated parts out without destroying the whole love. it's as if he can only experience love in a way that is controlling and acquisitive. the way that he lied to me to sabotage my mind, you just can't do that to someone who you love in a pure way, because you want the best for them, you wouldn't deliberately do anything to tear them down or destroy them, because your caring emotions for them would stop you. that is the only way i can understand it.

i'm sorry if i'm being difficult but i really want to add at this point is that this is not about men and women. it is not true that men just hurt the one they love the most. the reason that i know this is because i am a man! i would never hurt anyone i loved in the way that my partner hurt me. the love that i had, was pure, and the kind of thing he did to me would never have even occurred to me as something to do to him. and i've been close to a woman before who has lied to me and treated me in these ways. people don't do this because of their gender, they do it because of something else. it's really hard for me to accept that love that allows one person to deliberately hurt another person can really be called love. the reason that i have found it so hard to understand is because it has not been my experience of love at all. i want only the best for the person that i love. it is either love that is compromised by something, or it is not real love, that's the only way i can make sense of it. but i would really like to understand it better.

It's true that not only men do this. Women can treat people this way too and they are just a cruel.
You're right, bluegrey. When you love someone you want what's best for them and you do what you can to make them happy. Some people just have a poisoned part to their feelings and they can't love in a healthy way.

I'm certainly not defending people who or verbally and mentally abusive, or use perceptual tactics to make another person believe they are going crazy (this is sometimes called "Gaslighting" -- after the 1944 film "Gaslight". But I have spent a lot of time trying to understand this bizarre set of behavior because my mother has a lot of these traits and so did a few of my boyfriends.

This type of behavior is evidenced strongly in people with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD). For the NPD, it's likely that they don't love (as you and I know "love") the target of thier abuse because that would require them to see that person as unique and individual, which is something NPDs have a hard time doing (everything in life is related to them). BPDs can actually love the target of their abuse, but loving someone leads to a terrible fear of losing them and/or being rejected and abandoned, which causes them to do anything possible to control the fear - including controlling the person.

In both cases, the only way they can feel ok with the other person in their life is to completely control the other person by any means possible. In many cases, this drive is completely subconscious and they aren't aware of what they are doing. They just aren't thinking about anyone else's feelings or needs, they are only neurotically driven by their own needs to be in control, to be superior, to not be rejected or abandoned. So, by preying on any previous fear or mental illness you have had in the past, they can ensure total control over you as you rely more and more on them for "reality" as they destroy your ability to trust your own perceptions. They make you completely dependent on them, they control your thoughts and actions, and can abuse you however they wish so that they can feel better about themselves and secure in their environment.

The random pattern of Nice then Mean are actually brainwashing techniques. They are nice when you do what they want (positive reinforcement) then punish you when you aren't compliant so you do what they want (negative reinforcement). And they keep the pattern random, and slightly off-balance (variable ratio schedule) because this has the highest likelihood of acheiving the "correct" behavior from you and reducing the likelihood of you rebelling. (This is the same schedule used for gambling and slot machines, etc). They are nice to you just enough to you keep coming back, and they use this pattern to control you even further. You get trapped within your own thinking "If I could just do <whatever he wants> better/more, or not do <whatever he complains about> he'd love me and be nice again".

It is horrible that you went through a relationship like this. Unfortunately, for many people, once you go through a relationship like this you become predisposed to being abused in another similar relationship. It's not your fault or anything, you're not looking for someone like this, but you were brainwashed by that type of behavior and it has altered the way you experience things. I strongly advise anyone who has grown up with a parent like this, or had a spouse/partner like this to seek professional counseling for "battered person's syndrome" as soon as they can so they can get themselves deprogrammed and out of future destructive relationships.