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Feeling sick

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Re: Feeling sick

Postby Inferior_Force » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:03 pm

I think whether or not I can handle crowds strongly depends on the level of anxiety I have on that specific day. Also, it depends on my level of aggression. Crowds always tend to annoy me because they slow me down. For some reason I cannot walk slowly. I´m always running around like I´m in a hurry. I guess I´m a bit of an adrenaline junkie. But it´s interesting that I can be sort of addicted to stress (doing everything super-fast, listening to metal, daydreaming of situations that would be very distressing in real life, like getting into a shoot-out), and at the same time stress can overwhelm me and cause me so much anxiety.

There are times, though, when I feel like being in a crowd is becoming objectively dangerous, like when it gets too crowded and I realize there is potential for a stampede. I am very sensitive to this since 2008 when I got into a near-stampede on a metal festival. The organizers denied that there was ever any danger, but I was in the middle of it and I felt how things were getting out of control. Others realized it as well, there were screams and fights and all. I try to stay away from such situations since then, but if I get into a potentially dangerous crowd nonetheless, I don´t feel much fear. I think I start to dissociate to some extent, and I tell myself very calmly: "Okay, you must be patient now and just wait for everyone to move on. Don´t push anyone, don´t snap at anyone, don´t start to scream. If everybody stays really calm, nothing is going to happen. Work on that."

It´s funny, but certainly no coincident, that when there is no real danger, I start to get a panic reaction and I feel like I need to get out of the situation; but when I realize that there is an actual danger, I start to feel completely calm, and like nothing can happen to me, even if I am in the middle of things. It´s like the fear only comes out when it is safe for it to come out. That has me thinking, of course...

I am fairly sure that my nausea is really just suppressed emotions, mainly fear, but also despair and the feeling that I will never be safe again, or like there is nothing good and soothing in the entire world. Maybe all these emotions were suppressed as long as whatever caused them was present, and I tried to react in a rational or self-protective way (like with the crowds: it is important to stay calm), and then, once the real danger is over, the emotions make themselves known. I remember that I had one period of feeling constantly sick a while after my father moved out. I always thought I was emotionally impacted by him moving out, but that I was unable to show it or process it normally. This collided with my own memory of me being glad and relieved when he left. It´s not just my imagination, this has been confirmed by others. It´s just a theory, but given that I was often scared of him as a child, maybe once he had gone the danger was gone and the associated emotions came to the surface. Then again, I also felt sick in situations when I had any reason to be emotional, like when I was little and my mum was not at home because she had to attend to my grandma. Well, theories... :|

I wanted to say, by the way, that I really appreciate that you reply to every post that I write, even though they are so lengthy. I know I should be seeing a doctor over these issues, but I simply don´t feel ready for that yet. So thank you very much for your support and your patience over the last few months!
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby jasmin » Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:01 pm

You are very welcome and I'm glad to talk, it makes me feel good too. Sorry it took me a few days to reply by the way.
Maybe the anxiety/sickness comes from a fear of abandonment? You said you felt it when your dad left and then when you were alone without your mom.
What do you think might happen if you were to share this stuff with a doctor? You could print what you posted here and show them, you could wait a bit and take things slowly, find someone you like.
There's no rush.
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby Inferior_Force » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:01 am

I´m glad to hear you enjoy our conversations! :)

I think that a fear of abandonment is definitely something that can trigger my sickness. When I worry that someone I`m waiting for might not show up, for example, I get slightly panicky straight away. I feel sick in so many (as far as I can tell) unrelated situations, though, that fear of abandonment is probably not the only aspect.

The last few days have been really strange. First of all, the good news is that I made some progress focusing not on my nausea, but on the accompanying feelings, and that this tends to alleviate the nausea symptoms. Those feelings, however, are causing some disruption. Thursday night I was out with my SO and her mum. At some point I felt a sense of danger, like knowing I was on the brink of another nausea attack. "Okay, what´s really going on?" I asked, and as I dwelt on that I realized that I was feeling really, really low and depressed. These feelings were almost unreal. I had and have no idea how they are connected to my life. They did not refer to anything that I could think of. It was different from the kind of depression which I can easily feel, like "Meh. I don´t want to go to college. I´ll never get a job anyway. I hate my life." Part of me wanted to hide alone in my bed at home, and part of me dreaded going home alone. My mum is on holiday, so I´d be really alone, and I get awfully paranoid and anxious when I´m alone at home at night. Yes, and the third part thought that I was probably just being a drama queen, or drunk, or that at least for some reason these feelings weren´t real or significant.
I did go home alone, though. And when I had almost reached my house, suddenly everything seemed creepy, but in a way like: I stare at a wall, or a bike, and just freeze, like a deer caught in the headlights. The thing I stare at seems to be really scary, for no reason at all. I´m barely even seeing it, it´s more like my eyes are glued to something. There are shivers going down my back, and my neck and shoulders are tense, and something strange is happening in my head. It´s like a rapid, random cascade of fragments. I couldn´t even tell if these fragments are thoughts, feelings, pictures, voices or memories. Often this is accompanied by a distinct sense of familiarity, like it all pointed to something I knew all too well, but I can´t access it. At the same time, I feel silly, like I´m allowing this to happen, like it wanted it to happen. Nonetheless, though, it takes a lot of effort to tear myself loose and make myself move again.
Being in this state of mind, it took me ages to unlock my door. Even though I was so absorbed, I jumped at every sound. I felt like I was about to be attacked, like something was going to jump at me. I was starting to feel weepy. Then I finally entered our flat and I closed the door behind me, and immediately I froze again. I stared down the hall into the living room, my eyes glued to the window frame. I felt absolute terror, for no reason at all. It wasn´t even the fear that somebody could attack me. I was at a point where I would have welcomed another human being as company, no matter who. I was clinging to the door frame, and I heard myself wailing and crying. It is not like I couldn´t help it, it was more like I was signaling something, like I was pleading. On some level I still felt like I was in control and like I could have stopped at any time. Not the fear, but me acting "stupid". It´s like some part of me is bent on making me feel bad about myself. I was detached from my little nervous breakdown, though, at least to some degree, because there was still a voice in my head analyzing what was happening to me and formulating this post. Thank goodness crisis doesn´t impact my ability to think in foreign languages! :roll: Another reason why my crisis seems fake to me. Even though I know it isn´t fake.
I staggered into the kitchen at some point, and, trying to calm myself down, I looked out of the window. In a lot of other houses, the lights were still on. I decided to say that to myself aloud, as an attempt to ground myself a little. "Look, so many lights!" I heard myself say, and it came out in the voice of a sad, tired child. I managed to climb into bed, lock the door to my room, get on the Internet, phone my SO - and say nothing about what had happened. I wouldn´t have known how to describe it. These activities calmed me down, though. I went to sleep like it was a completely normal night.

The next evening I was alone at home again. I could sense the freezing and the fragment thing starting to happen again (though without the terror), but after a while I managed to snap out of it. I was starting to feel unreal, scared and lonely, so I had the brilliant idea to turn on the radio. It was nothing like a normal evening, though. Most of the time I did not even feel scared, but I acted scared. After dinner I sat in my room, trying to get something done, not getting anything done, and at some point I realized I was 1) all the time bracing myself for the possibility that at any moment someone might grab my neck and 2) listening intently for any kind of noise that suggested somebody might be sneaking up the stairs. The stairs are right across from my room. Often I spend minutes staring at the stairs without even realizing it, in this same deer in the headlights fashion. I wouldn´t have dared turn on the radio now. Any kind of distraction might have led to me missing the decisive moment when the "intruder" would come out of his hiding place. On a detached, unconcerned level I wondered what use would be the three seconds warning this would give me. What would I do, after all? I only want those three seconds in order to curl up into a ball and close my eyes.

Right now everything seems mostly back to normal. And what happened? Exactly. This evening I felt sick again.

You asked what I think might happen if I went to a doctor. Many of the things I described above I described the first time today. In order to profit from seeing a doctor, I must be able to describe these things to him, and make it very clear to him that they did happen and that they are not a one time thing and that they are important. But these are things I myself am heavily conflicted about, or you could also say: in denial. Now from my experience doctors tend to side with that denial, maybe because they want to reassure me ("It´s nothing uncommon, nothing deep and serious, you can get it under control."). But I don´t want to be reassured. I feel like I´ve never been able to make it clear to anybody that there is something fundamentally not okay with me. And fighting this fight isn´t easy when not even all of your self is on your own side.

It is one of those moments when I realize once again how important it is to write here, and practice describing what happens to me, and making it real. It is very different from just writing in my diary, so thank you for listening!
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby jasmin » Wed Dec 14, 2011 7:39 pm

Hmmm, have you looked through the generalized anxiety disorder forum or have you looked into the anxiety disorders in general? It doesn't have to be on our forum, you could just look up articles on the internet or something. I am in no position to tell you it's what you have though.
I am very happy to listen and talk.
So, you can think in a detached way about what is going on when you have one of these episodes?
I wonder what that's all about.
The fear of not being taken seriously is really strong, it is for me too. But if you were to find a nice psych, someone who takes you seriously and listens, you would get much further with your self search and maybe eventually getting better.
Please don't think that I don't want you to post here, though!
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby marinated » Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:44 pm

I am 20 years old, and this is the first time in my entire life that I've come across someone matching what I suffer from.

I haven't read through this thread but I knew from reading your first post Jasmin that I could relate.

Let me just quickly introduce myself and issue:
I'm a 20 year old guy living in Norway, since the age of 14 I've been seeking psychiatric help. I was initially diagnosed with panic disorder (don't remember which one) then unspecific phobia, later on general anxiety disorder which is still my diagnosis, however just recently I came across somatoform disorder, reading the symptoms I knew this had to be in my yard, I've told my psychiatrist about it and she said she'd have a look at it. Eitherway, wrongly diagnosed or not, the psychiatry has helped me alot, it's been key to defining my life.

I have a phobia of vomit, atleast that's what we initially believed after a year of gastrointestinal tests came out all clear. Having pondered long on why, I've come to the conclusion that my irrational fear of vomit stems from a near death experience at the age of 4-5 I almost choked to death on a sucker. There's been many other fears throughout life after that even but, the fear of vomit stuck. It stuck for good when I was 14, in the gym at school after the summer holidays, I wasn't in shape and pushed myself, which caused me to vomit, that is when something clicked in my brain "what if i can't stop this? what if i can't get it out of my head", a week or so later i would throw up again, though this time for no apparent physical reason, I wasn't feeling ill or sick in any form or shape, however one thing was different, i was picturing how i threw up at the gym class earlier in the week, from that day on my life changed forever.

I never finished my high school, I stayed mostly at home, attempting to deal with the panic attacks that i would have. In many periods I would also struggle with deep depression, it was very hard.

I don't vomit very often, but when I do, it's very vicious, it's never ending until I can get my head around. I will be so scared that I soil myself, it's just beyond comprehension just how painful it is. But I live daily feeling nauseous, and there are several times I'm close to vomiting.

I've been afraid to search for help or similar cases, and to open up, i didn't want to accept that it was something purely somatic, although I am fairly sure it is, still though that denial keeps me going at the worst of times. It's been a bumpy ride, and much like you, when I actually do get physically nauseous it's a severe problem, I cannot actually distinguish it from somatic episodes other than trying to trace back what could possibly been the cause.

I'm now looking into taking up high school at a special school for people with or past mental disorders. I've begun to move outside again, I jog for 30 minutes everyday, and while I never go too far from my house, I can travel to the city which is 20minutes away with car if someone drives me (I dont have a drivers license, and a bus isn't an option since I'm afraid i'll throw up in crowded closed spaces). Things are looking brighter, I've somehow managed to get a girl who I love dearly, she is much motivation and gives me determination to do better, to not just sit at home and soak up the pain. I can only wish you the best of luck, perhaps, we should keep in contact? It is truly a blessing, for the first time I do not feel alone in this world in regards to my health.
Last edited by marinated on Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby marinated » Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:45 pm

I'm sorry, didn't mean Jasmin. I meant Inferior_Force *
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby Inferior_Force » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:44 am

Hi marinated,

I´m sorry for the late reply, I didn´t look into this thread for some time! I´m really glad you posted!

Did I understand this right, you got something like intrusive memories from the situation in the gym, and then you had to vomit for psychosomatic reasons? My somatoform nausea came back after I vomited as well. It is weird, because the vomiting itself was not so terrible. It did hurt to some extent, and I thought stuff like "Oh god, oh no", but I wasn´t even that scared in the moment it happened. My body simply knew what to do. It was not even as disgusting as I had feared it would be (I had not eaten anything, though, I´d just had some tea). Afterwards I felt alright, and I even thought that I was okay with this issue now. But then, in the evening, there was dread of something I cannot name. If you should read through this thread, you will find a lot about my weird episodes of panic and confusion. Interestingly, it is also intrusive memories which I fear most about vomiting. "If I vomit after eating X, I will never be able to eat X again, because I´ll always have to think about how I vomited."

The situation with the sucker sounds pretty traumatic. Has that been addressed in therapy? So do you fear that you might choke if you vomit?

I´m glad to hear you´re working on improving your situation. Do you have special coping techniques in order to deal with the nausea? I realized a while ago that I need to stop fighting the nausea and start fighting the fear. I also realized that my whole body tenses up when I feel nauseous and so I try to relax my muscles. Often that helps. At least it gives me something to do while I wait for the nausea to pass.

@jasmin:
I think what bugs me most is that I am never sure if my sense of there being something familiar and forgotten at the brink of my consciousness is justified, or if it is some neurotic idea I should not dwell on. Maybe it is because of my obsession with finally getting a grip on this "thing" that often I even allow myself to slip into these episodes. It´s like free association at the speed of light. It is not always accompanied by that much fear, though. That detached thinking is really weird, yeah. It makes everything even more surreal.
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby jasmin » Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:34 pm

Weird, it makes me think of depersonalization or derealization but I have no idea if that's what it really is. I had problems with anxiety attacks like I already said I think. It's weird because it's like I'm sucked into a hole of emotions and thoughts and I'm not sure anxiety attacks are always like that... Sometimes they could be really odd and other times it's just anxiety :|
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby marinated » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:22 pm

Inferior_Force wrote:Hi marinated,

I´m sorry for the late reply, I didn´t look into this thread for some time! I´m really glad you posted!

Did I understand this right, you got something like intrusive memories from the situation in the gym, and then you had to vomit for psychosomatic reasons? My somatoform nausea came back after I vomited as well. It is weird, because the vomiting itself was not so terrible. It did hurt to some extent, and I thought stuff like "Oh god, oh no", but I wasn´t even that scared in the moment it happened. My body simply knew what to do. It was not even as disgusting as I had feared it would be (I had not eaten anything, though, I´d just had some tea). Afterwards I felt alright, and I even thought that I was okay with this issue now. But then, in the evening, there was dread of something I cannot name. If you should read through this thread, you will find a lot about my weird episodes of panic and confusion. Interestingly, it is also intrusive memories which I fear most about vomiting. "If I vomit after eating X, I will never be able to eat X again, because I´ll always have to think about how I vomited."


The episode at the gym was most likely physical, from the age of 3-4 when i choked on that candy, I've largely been plagued with a disgust and fear of vomit, though this wore of through the years, i became occupied with other phobias, like claustrophobia I remember was during one period.
I'm also familiar with the intrusive thoughts you mentioned, though food is leading, I'll also associate actions, places, objects and dates with the vomiting, I'm aware that it's merely superstition, but it's a defense mechanism I believe, it gives the notion of being able to control the outcome (i.e by avoiding certain foods or moving objects that is associated with an episode of vomiting, granted it's merely the sense of control, but looking at it from a rational standpoint it's probably the exact opposite).

Inferior_Force wrote:The situation with the sucker sounds pretty traumatic. Has that been addressed in therapy? So do you fear that you might choke if you vomit?


Yea we did address it. I fear that I might become so dehydrated and malnourished to the point that inevitable hospital visits will lead to a almost vegetable state of life, relying on third party equipment for nutrition. I have never consulted anyone about what actually would happen, I asked my psychiatrist not to go in details about what could possibly happen, I'm in fear that what I said about actually is a truth, although my psychiatrist did reassure me that it didn't have to be like that, I wonder if she said it to comfort me or if it actually is true.

Inferior_Force wrote:I´m glad to hear you´re working on improving your situation. Do you have special coping techniques in order to deal with the nausea? I realized a while ago that I need to stop fighting the nausea and start fighting the fear. I also realized that my whole body tenses up when I feel nauseous and so I try to relax my muscles. Often that helps. At least it gives me something to do while I wait for the nausea to pass.


I've been working on focusing on my surroundings when it get's really bad (i saw you had too) lately and it's been very helpful. I used to avoid situations that would give me an incent to be nauseous like public places, this is probably the worst thing you could do, to lock yourself at home. I've also been working on moving out again, and I feel like the more I push my limits the more comfortable (and less nauseous) i am with distances away from home (or non-public).
I'll also play games sometimes if I'm home and it gets bad, especially online games that interacts with others, it occupies my mind and gives me a sense of normality I guess (though this is hardly fool proof). I realize that I've always been fighting the nausea too much, I personally need to work on feeling more comfortable actually throwing up (thus decreasing my fear of vomiting now). The few times I actually do vomit, it's incredibly traumatic, the entire world around me goes unnoticed like I'm locked in myself almost, it helps to have someone who understands your situation and doesn't freak out.

At the end of the day, I urge you to stay active, it was sadly one of the things I did wrong, I closed up completely, and that made it only 10 times worse than it already was. But brighter times ahead, I wish you good luck also. :)
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Re: Feeling sick

Postby Inferior_Force » Sat Dec 31, 2011 2:08 am

@marinated
Being superstitious of dates and places is something I know so well! I am very, very prone to magical thinking. Not just with regards to vomiting, but also break-ups, fights... I recently read somewhere that anxiety disorders often result in or develop towards OCD, maybe this is related.

Did you ever work with any special techniques in therapy to help deal with the after-effects of your trauma? I don´t know how extensively the two of you talked this through, but maybe talking alone cannot resolve the impact it has/had on you.

It´s a good thing you´re going out again. I managed to not have any chewing gum for about two weeks now, even though I frequently felt sick. The amazing result is that all of a sudden I often forget to take any gum with me when I leave the house, at least if I only leave for a short time. A while ago it was always the first thing on my mind when I was packing my bag. I do hope that I develop some confidence this way. When I feel sick now, I try this: I search for things I can say about myself, so I get in touch with my feelings and bodily sensations, like: "I´m freezing. No surprise, it´s quite cold at the moment. I´m actually shaking, which is why my body is cramping. This is very uncomfortable. I feel pressure on my stomach..." If the situation allows for it, I might even whisper it instead of just thinking it. I think I need to feel like I´m in control of something, but nausea is not a good choice (not that I had signed up for it...). Being able to reliably control my fear might make me feel a lot more secure. Right now my progress is still very unstable. I think I still (half-consciously) believe that if I manage to control the fear, I will never feel sick again. Never having to vomit again is still the goal my unconscious mind wants to achieve, and as long as this is the case, I am always at peril. One incident and the fear is out of control again. I don´t say this to be negative, it´s more like I´m preparing myself mentally for what is likely going to happen if I have to vomit. That way, maybe, I can avert a backlash.

Oh, another thing: I think I know the feeling of complete isolation or being locked in myself, not while throwing up (which thankfully hasn´t happened since that one incident that triggered the phobia again), but when feeling sick. It happens almost automatically, that´s why it is so important for me to get into touch with myself again. Getting in touch with my environment is almost impossible anyway. There was one time when I felt sick but I didn´t feel like I was locked in some other world, and I knew that if I had to throw up my SO would be there and take care of me. All of a sudden, feeling sick wasn´t so scary after all.

@jasmin
I´ve looked at Generalized Anxiety, and I guess I easily match the criteria. I constantly worry about things, like something happening to my SO, or my house burning down etc., and I have a whole lot of mental rituals or summoning charms to prevent that from happening (so I might qualify for OCD as well). Even derealization is part of the deal. I haven´t found anything about the strange fragment thing, though. People say that before you die, your life passes before your eyes. I imagine it to be similar to my experience.

Yesterday I managed to dig a little deeper into the feelings behind my nausea, and I realized that they are very similar to what I experience when I feel homesick. I feel like I need to distract myself and kill time until...well, until when? In the case of feeling homesick it is easy, you need to distract yourself until you go home again. But what if you are already at home? And now I even see a strange connection: So often I start to feel sick when I´m out with someone! And the result? I want to go home! Often the nausea sets in when I start to feel like "it is time to go home". But who determines that? Why is it time to go home? Do I sense some kind of danger in staying? Almost certainly, but what is it?

When you felt like you were sucked into a hole, did you feel like you were not really "in the world" anymore? Did you have trouble connecting to your environment?
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