A mother with guilt

Ok here it goes last week was very busy for me. It started with my son going to the beach with his father and his fathers girlfriend after dinner. I was at work at the time. They were walking around and came upon an area where the baby foxes were playing so they went to look. While they were looking around there was a group of people also looking around. Sean was taking pictures of the animals and then all of a sudden he heard a familiar voice and laughter. So he looked around the crowd of people and then he saw a very obese lady who sounded like Carolyn but did not see her face yet. So at first he thought maybe it was mind playing tricks. Carolyn was always a heavy set woman for her height but apparently according to Sean she had put on more weight since we have seen her. He thought maybe it wasn't her. But then she became louder and turned around to talk to a man and a blond haired girl. Sean said the girl appeared to be about 10 years old. She was holding the mans hand the whole time. After he processed all of this he felt panicked and turned around to go back to the car. Seans father then called out to him to see what was wrong and to ask him where he was going. Sean then turned around and told his father that he was going back to the car. While Sean turned around he noticed that Carolyn saw him. Carolyn then took off with the man and the blond girl in a hurry and left the area. Sean then turned around and got into the car. Seans father caught up with him and asked him what was wrong. He knew something was wrong because Sean does not normally act this way. Sean replied to his father with simply this "Dad I saw Carolyn, Johns wife, I didn't want to be there. I am only going to say this and then I don't want to talk about it. Carolyn is not a nice lady and that's it." His father then said that's ok Sean we'll go now no problem. He respected Seans wishes. They got home to his fathers house and then called me immediately. I heard it in his voice the anxiety and unsure of what had happened and why he acted this way. All he kept saying to me was I just did not feel right about Carolyn, Ma. She knows and is not doing anything for her daughters. It was then I realized the impact this whole situation had on him. Thank God I have him seeing a psychologist as well. I told him sorry that I was at work but I'm sure that you could talk to your father about this especially now after he realized how upset you were. So he had a talk with his father and ever since he has been remembering things and is opening up more to me. Hopefully there will be some good that comes of this for Sean. I hope so.

Getting back to the guilt there is still more I have not told. Its about my son. John would shave Sean's hair about every three weeks. When he would shave his head he would close the bathroom door. I would be sitting at the computer in the dining area. Then I would hear John start to get loud with Sean and call him names. Then he would say I'm not going to cut your hair unless you do it. So then Sean would come out of the bathroom visibly upset with tears coming down his face. I would then ask him what was wrong. Sean stated "John wants me to take my pants off". John remained in the bathroom. I called to John and asked him why does Sean have to take his pants off. John would give the excuse that hair would get caught in his pants pockets. I had to tell John to please let him wear his pants and just cut his hair. This happened on more than one occasion. Then one time John told him to get naked while he was shaving his head. Sean was so upset that time that he couldn't speak clearly. I finally got it out of him. I asked John why would Sean have to get naked. His reply was "well his hair gets in everything. Hell, I get naked when I shave my head". I asked John what is it with you and asking Sean to get undressed when you do his hair? John said lets not make a big thing about it. Then he called Sean to the bathroom and acted as if he was just going to cut his hair. Instead he demanded that Sean take his clothes off. Sean then asked him if could leave his underwear on. John said no take it all off. I listened in this time and opened the bathroom door and yelled at John and said just cut the kids hair I have to clean the mess up anyway! Things quieted down after that. Sean took his shower and went to bed. He didn't talk about it after that. Until recently. What I would like to know is this a form of abuse? There have been other times John did some weird things like this to my son. Was I wrong for staying as long as I did? I would appreciate it if someone could shed some light on this. Is this a form of sex abuse?

I woke up thinking about Sean and John. I guess in a way I am grateful Emily moved in permanently. I am realizing that she took some of the attention away from Sean. Maybe that was a good thing. Maybe it could have gotten a lot worse for Sean. I definitely think it could have gotten worse for him. It is sad that this had to happen. I wish I could take it all back for the sake of the kids.

Judging by what you said about John and Sean, I would personally see it as a form of abuse or harrassment, unnecessarily sexual-based, because Sean didn't strip and there's nothing really indicating sexual intentions. Forcing someone to do something against their own will can be considered as abuse, because they are robbing the victim of their basic rights to a freedom of choice in the matter. But what really cements it as an abuse matter is the impact it has on Sean. It seems like he has walked away with some sort of trauma from these incidents, though I'm unsure as to the extent of the trauma. I believe it's good that you have managed to get some counselling aid for him. It should help him a lot. You mentioned that there have been other times. I cannot tell you if you were right or wrong for staying as long as you did, after all I'm not someone who's been there and witnessed everything. However, in the interests of Sean, I would recommend you to get away from John, or keep Sean strictly away from John. Ultimately John is someone you know for sure to be a sexual predator. Who knows if his preference is for boys and/or girls?

Thank you Moonie for your input on the situation with my son. You seem to have a lot of wisdom for someone your age. I hope all is well for you. I wrote earlier on about me and my son leaving and thanking the police dept. for getting us out of there safely. We did stay too long. At the time me, my son and daughter thought we could get John help and in turn then get help for his daughters. I was too emotionally distraught at the time. I was not thinking clearly. Since I've been seeing a psychologist, he has helped me to realize it is not that simple. It is very complicated with someone like John. I can say this I have dealt with many people like John but when it is in your own backyard it is definitely different.

I really don't understand how trying to force a child to take all their clothes off for a haircut could be usual practice.. or could result in anything less than making the child feel vulnerable and intimidated..

I've cut childrens hair myself and while it would certainly be easier for them to take their tops off for the job, it's only something i'd ask of a child that is comfortable with it.. I would usually wrap a towel round the childs shoulders instead.
But.. stripping a child completely naked isn't acceptable imo. and given the fact that the child was refusing and was being shouted at to comply - this is emotional abuse..

Thank you seabreezeblue for your insight on this issue with my son. I now think back on it and I apologize to my son for what he has been through. I'm sorry for the way he was treated by John. John was constantly on Sean about something. He was very mean to him at times. Who knows where it could have gone if Emily hadn't moved in. I am so sorry that this all had to happen to these kids. John did more than I have said on this site. A lot of it is hard to find the right words. Some of it is so horrific I don't know where to begin. I am getting stronger by the day which is a good thing but some of the things me and my son and daughter have seen are very very bad and hard to describe. I am finding that my writing on this site does allow for me to release these dark secrets and is aiding me to get it out there.

Since the retirement party where John sat at my table, I have some questions as to why he would that. My first impression was the arrogance of this man. When I left him I am sure he knows why I left him. Even though I never got to tell him what I know and what I saw or even what my kids know and saw. I'm quite sure he knows why we left. So I asked my psychologist some questions, hoping that maybe he can enlighten me. My first question to him was "What was he thinking?" and before he could answer then I asked a second question "Why would he do that?" and before he could answer those questions I asked a third (my mind was racing) " Is he that arrogant?". Then I finally let him answer. Obviously no one will ever know what is in a persons head and thoughts. So his answers were "You have to remember John is sick, he doesn't think of others. It wasn't about you it's about him. Just like with the daughters its not the sex its the control. He was trying to control the situation with you. He is going to be arrogant because he gets away with things and never really gets caught and there maybe suspicions of what he has done, but he has been at this before you and while you were with him and he will continue to do this to others." I've been thinking about what he said, there was more he said but too much to put here. I keep hoping that his daughters speak of what happened to them and is happening. I am worried. I have more to say on this but I need a break, it is emotionally draining.

After the retirement party and after I spoke with my psychologist, John's arrogance shined through again. John apparently went to someone in the department and complained about me. I want to make it clear I am not a vindictive ex-girlfriend. There is no domestic dispute going on because there is no domestic here. I am upset at the things I discovered about this man and what he has done. The things I have seen and know will never leave my mind nor my sons and daughters minds. Not to mention what he has done to his daughters. This has nothing to do with John being the ex-boyfriend, this has to do with what is right and what is wrong and that someone like him has the power to do what he wishes, when he wishes and has no consequences. It doesn't have anything to do with me at all. I only wish it were that simple. I would have preferred him cheating with three women and beaten me over what I saw and know. If I could I would take all the pain, abuse and lies, that John has afflicted on anyone. I feel guilty that I didn't see what clues the older daughter was dishing out and how angry she was all the time. I feel guilty that I didn't know what could happen to the younger daughter and that I couldn't get him to stop. I feel guilty that my son went through a lot because he wanted my relationship to work with John. I feel guilty that I put my daughter in a position that could have been potentially harmful to her as well. I feel guilty that he has been aloud to continue. I forgot to mention how John has also treated other people at work. For all of this and more I am very sorry. I wish I could take it all back. What he has done is wrong.

I'm sorry if I seem to be putting a lot out there but I have been busy with work and other things. I have been having an issue with my internet connection as well. I will not post anything while I am at work. Getting back to Johns complaint...He is not stupid he is actually quite intelligent. John knows that if he makes a complaint first the department will have to act on it. That is how John works anyway even with telling me things in the past first before I find out elsewhere. That's what he does to cover himself. I realized this when I began to question things or mention things. Most of the time I knew what happened but still asked to see where he would take it and how far. Like I had suspected he would lie and put the blame on others. For example after I had asked him about his older daughter and showed my concern for her he stated "Well she is seeing a new psychologist now. She will eventually be in a mental institution anyway, if they don't put her in I will. Who knows what this psychologist will do. Now I'm sure the psychologists have ways of putting false memories in their patients heads." I then said to him "I don't think a psychologist can do that to a person who in my opinion has at some point in her life been sexually assaulted. It is obvious she has suffered from some traumatic experience in her life, its like she has been betrayed and sexually assaulted. I would tend to think that she can't be manipulated at this point." John tried to convince me of other ideas. But no matter what, he will see to it that she will be the one to blame and that he will not be the one harmed. That's when I knew he would put his own daughters in harms way before he would ever have to answer to this. He deflects and manipulates his stories to suit his needs. That's just one example I have, there is more, but in time.