Problems regarding relationships with women

You know, I think we often create our own stories about people, then pin that story to the person.
We really want him/her to be who it is we imagine, and then vwalla....we find out that s/he isn't who we thought at all. This is a very complicated subject actually, which requires quite a bit of time to really thrash out some sort of conclusion.

Sounds like you had chemistry with this girl and that's (I think) incredibly hard to get over, if in fact you ever really do get over it. I've wanted the same person for 20 years, and whilst I manage to periodically "get over him", I only do so far as I don't see him. Once I do see him...bang..."there I go again". The only times it doesn't work is when he's been horrible to me. Then I see him differently. I'm not drawn to him at all. However, with time...he slowly creeps back into my psyche.

Who knows how to explain these things, I don't think you can. The problem lies in the "meaning we assign" to a person. As for the looks....they are a part of the chemistry and part of that meaning. I don't think that changes. I know that the guy I want is now 20 yrs older than when I first saw him. He was only 23 when I first met him. He was hot when he was 23 and you know what? Even though he has changed, he is still hot (to me). We all look different in our 40s to our 20s, but the physical is only part of a much bigger picture. I also think that "looks" are tied to familiarity. In other words - for you, the other girl is better looking, but I think it's the familiarity attached to "your story" of her that makes her better looking. There are heaps of good looking people, but it doesn't mean we are attracted to them all. I've had a guy chasing me for the last 5 years, who is almost 14 years younger and very good looking, and funny and many things...BUT...there is no chemistry. He says the loveliest things but he can't move me emotionally at all.

Good on you for recognising what you will and won't put up with. I've heard a few stories where good looking people tend to be assholes or just plain bitches. You don't need that. Having said that...if you're still not over "her" in 4 or 5 years then go see her again. She's probably very young and needs time to mature. There's no point in closing the door completely, because it will never close no matter how many times you slam it.

Well I don't have much experience on people's behavior but from what I have seen, people don't really change much. I seriously don't think she is going to stop complaining about everything and telling me how life sucks and all her problems and blah blah blah.... if anything it would get worst. To be honest I don't really need all that crap... the girl I am with now is a really positive girl, she would say yes to anything I say... but sex... (shes goes like: it's only been two weeks) btw is that a bad sign that we are not having sex yet? she always jumps when I touch her "inappropriately"... but back to what I was saying... if I meet with this other girl I'll just have to tough it out and try to control myself the best I can.

Well, looks like you're into the new girl. Good for you.

I think "having sex" after two weeks is a totally personal opinion that works differently for different people.
If she isn't comfortable yet, then DON'T PUSH her. At your age, I'd say wait. My personal opinion about this....wait! She'll let you know when she's ready. There's really no hurry. In fact, at your age...I'd be concentrating on "getting to know you first". Crap, at any age actually.

In fact I have a friend that I've known since school, so that makes it 36 years now (met her when I was 13 at school, and we're still friends). She met her husband when she was (I think from memory) 16 or 17 - somewhere there. He wanted her from the moment he saw her. She, on the other hand, said NO intimate relationship. She told him that she wanted to get to know him first and just be friends for 12 months. So, he respected that and stayed her "friend" for a year. In fact, she said it was just over a year that they became intimate, and naturally - ending up marrying. She is my age now, 49 and still married to him. She STILL loves him and says that she couldn't imagine being with anyone else. It's a true love story. The reason it is, is simply because he respected her wishes and GOT TO KNOW HER FIRST

That's the way it should be. Unfortunately - ALL MEN that I meet want sex by the second date, so I've grown used to the fact that this is the way it is (over here), which is why I don't get very far with anyone. I don't sleep with anyone that quickly, despite the harassment (not all but almost). Mind you...I'm the one who ALWAYS ends it because of X. I too think it's important to "get to know you first"...otherwise too much pressure and to be honest - you don't know what you're doing if you haven't reached some level of intimacy with the person. Trust is a very big issue that creeps into the bedroom.

Don't feel pressured by this, and if YOU'RE not ready - then she should respect that equally. Don't be impatient!

Musta, How are you? I see that you haven't posted for a while? Have things improved for you?
I hope you are doing ok.
With Care,
One

Well ya I guess you are right, today she told me she is not ready yet but... isn't she taking a big risk by doing this? I would totally get laid with the first girl who comes along if I can't do it with her. I know I sound like a jerk and you will probably think that if I sleep with another girl I don't deserve her in the first place but lets be real... if I am not getting my needs satisfied what exactly is attaching me to her?
btw, I think I just passed my 3 weeks mark and we do not seem to be annoyed yet... *cheers for me*

Hmmm....I get more confused as I read your posts. Do I think you're a jerk? If I was 18, the answer would've been "YES", but I'm not. I'm 49 and the answer is "NO". What your answer does tell me is that this girl is clearly NOT your soul mate. If she was, then "getting your needs met"...wouldn't enter your head. You'd be far more consumed with "her" and "her needs". Trust me, I know! A relationship based on using "fear" to get what you want means that this is all about you and overcoming issues you may have (e.g. getting past the two week deadline for example). In other words - it's all about you first and her second. This is NOT what a meaningful relationship is all about. A meaningful relationship is about "mutual needs"...it's about learning each other's idiosyncrasies, making adjustments and learning to enjoy each other's "differences". It's these differences that makes a whole relationship.

AND...if you do go off and sleep with someone else because you can't wait, then let her go. BTW...didn't you talk about "jerking off", thus alleviating the need for any girl at one point? If so, then what's the problem?

You know, I think you should just enjoy what you have with this girl, and acknowledge the fact that she isn't long term. You also need to be mindful of her emotions if this is the case. I actually don't think you're over the last girl (the one who is immature). You know, we all have defences to justify reality. In other words - you've convinced yourself that the last girl won't change, in fact, you seem to think she'll get worse. I think the only reason you're saying this is to justify the fact you can't be with her. The reasons why you can't be with her don't matter - it still doesn't change the fact. I bet if she came to you and said she wanted you and that she had changed, you'd be back in a flash. What happens is, we down play and make "the other" look bad because it's a coping mechanism. I know for me, I've talked myself into believing that the guy I want is a woman beater, even potential murderer - all in the name of making it easier to come to grips with the fact that he just won't come near me. He isn't any of these things, but I go through these phases to protect myself from emotional pain. Everyone does it. Think about it. Again - this takes honesty.

Ciao

You know I just realized that you are right, I have mostly focused on what I want but how am I to focus on what she wants? All I know she wants is that she does not want sex yet... and I have sort of unhappily pleased her on that field. And I mostly do whatever she wants in order to please her; I go and hang around with her parents, I go out with her brother and all that uncool stuff but I try to have fun so that she is happy. Heck! I even totally ridiculed myself trying to dance, which I cannot do to save my life, in front of everyone just to please her.
I am not saying that I will just go around looking for another girl because I won't. I am just saying that if the opportunity presents itself I would not let it slide.
You see I am a very logical person and I do not understand much about soul mates and all that good stuff so I mostly weight the pros and cons of everything and I do not pay much attention to my "heart". This is the way I see it; I spend time and money on this girl and what I am getting back is hugs and kisses, which I enjoy much, but I can mostly get that from my mom for free. I know that sounds horrible but that's the way it is. And that could be enough for a women but I will take a risk speaking for all men and say that is not the case for us.
About the other girl, if she actually comes back to me I would again have to weight the pros and cons and the only thing that could probably make a difference at this moment is sex but if that would be covered by my current girlfriend there would be no way of me going back with her. And what she has is not immaturity, that is just the way she is and that won't change now or in a hundred years; not talking with the broken heart but with the logical mind.

I hear what you're saying, and I think most men listen to their heads instead of their hearts. That's why so many end up hurting themselves, and their partners. Logic and Love do NOT mix. They are world's apart. You can not expect to use logic and have love at the same time. Logic only applies in certain circumstances but it often kills before it mends.

You know, when I was 28 and first met X, it was a year later that the attraction surfaced. He put out the bait, and I responded. When he phoned me a week later, much to my surprise (and devastation) - he didn't even know who I was. I STILL don't know whether this was his "logic" that kicked in, or "fear". Which ever one it was...it killed everything. He did end up phoning me back and admitting that he knew who I was and that he was attracted to me. However, the fact he didn't know me straight away was then further reinforced by him saying that he was too busy to get together. He never phoned me back to say that he wasn't busy. So, as far as I was concerned - he wasn't anywhere NEAR into me like I was into him. However, I was so taken with him, that I stayed single for about a year and half until I ended up having a casual relationship with someone else, who really did want me. I never wanted the guy with whom I had the relationship and he knew about X too. Even though I suspected that X was still interested because he kept putting out bait, he NEVER reeled in the fish. I came to the conclusion that he just wasn't that into me, regardless of the bait. So, I went with someone who DID want me. My heart was never with this guy, but the relationship ended and he has been a friend up to now.

Men who are truly interested WILL make a move. X never did, so I spent years living in major upset despite he kept putting out bait. My point is, that if you really want someone - you will be faithful to that person because s/he is the only one you want. I kept faithful to someone who I wanted so much, but wasn't in my life, and showed no visible intention of ever being so. Only then (after 1.5 yrs) I made the decision to go elsewhere, and as it turned out - X married someone else anyway. So, my instinct and the evidence that was right in front of me the whole time was correct. He wasn't that into me. I still have no idea whether I'm someone that he is actually interested in, or just entertainment value. Until (if ever) he makes a move - I'll never know. I can't assume anything. There is absolutely not a shred of evidence that he is actually interested at all, only a cryptic possibility (not even sure of that actually).

So, in a nutshell - listen to your heart, not your mind. That's my whole point here. Sorry - I know I keep banging on about X, but I'm sure there are many lessons within my story. I'm still trying to work some of them out myself.

For what it's worth..."she" probably doesn't want sex because she instinctively feels you're not into her perhaps in the full sense. You've said that you're still not over the last girl, and this one would be sensing it on some level. Women are incredibly intuitive, make no mistake about that. The more attuned and honest you are with your own feelings, the more intuitive you are with others. I know it scares a lot of men. Only because so many are not in tune with their own feelings the way women are. I'm not judging here but stating a fact based on heaps of experience. I used to be a counsellor in the 90s and have spoken to hundreds of guys about this.

The girl you're with now is probably waiting for a very good reason. You need to respect that if you think she is worth it, AND you're genuinely into her. Women can SMELL A MILE away, guys that aren't that into them. Even when it may seem obvious - without evidence/proof - nothing can ever be assumed.

Be patient, it may well be the best thing in the end.

Well I do not really think she can figure out that I am still sort of into the other, I mean, even I don't ever think about her but I know that if I we meet again it will come back to me. What I am saying is that I have not really given her any reason to think that girl was even in my life. That I may not be that into her... maybe but I have tried really hard to make her feel that my life moves around her.
And well thinking with my heart... easier said than done. You see your mind, contrary to your heart, is usually right. I do not know what love is and I am not sure if anyone actually knows for certain but I will have a hard time if I cannot find some logic to it.
Anyways I keep wondering if I feel good when I am around her and I can be myself, if she makes me happy and I try my best to do the same for her... I mean for the first time I feel that I am actually getting something back from my effort... perhaps not all I want back but it is something and I don't even have to worry about doing anything wrong because I know it wont matter to her... it doesn't matter if I can't dance or I can't do this or I suck at doing that, there is always a smile on her face saying that it's OK. How am I to know if it could be love or not? It feels right.