Confused about what happened to me - assault or stupidity?

Hi all,

Firstly, having read some of the horrible things that have happened to some of the people on here I can only feel grateful that I have been spared them. I feel rather pathetic coming on here and sharing my own experience, which feels like it pales in comparison to every thing else. I am so ashamed of myself and I can't separate that out to look logically at what happened to me and decide what the truth is.

The first thing that you need to know is that I have a boyfriend, H. About two years ago, one of my best friends, P kissed me when we were both drunk and I kissed him back. After a very short moment, I realised what we were doing and put a stop to it, which he accepted. I explained that I loved my boyfriend and we were both drunk and had made a mistake. Important to mention that this was consensual. I was drunk but was aware of my surroundings and in control of my actions. I'm just setting up the background and this is important.

P and I continued to be friends. We never told my partner or spoke of it again. When I thought of it, I considered it to be a daft mistake that two very good friends made together when drunk and thankfully stopped before anyone could get hurt. I felt guilt but this lessened as P and I never approached that again. I felt nothing but regret and was sure he felt the same.

About two weeks ago my boyfriend and I were visiting family in our home town. We caught up with some friends, including P. We went out drinking. At one point my boyfriend and another mate went to one pub and P and I went to a club to dance. My boyfriend came and said goodbye as he was going home but told me he was happy for me to stay out. When the club kicked us all out, P and I went back to his to carry on drinking. Reading this now makes me feel so stupid because logically, of course it was a dumb thing to do. But you must understand that this man was someone I considered a best friend.

At his house, he told me he loved me. I was surprised of course and said I was flattered but was very firm that nothing would every happen as I loved my boyfriend. He was very philosophical about this and didn't seem to mind at all. The conversation moved on and after a couple of hours I was so drunk I couldn't stand unaided. Again, I'm aware of how stupid I sound here. Trust me, I've called myself all the names in the book. As I couldn't function I agreed to stay at his. Called boyfriend and told him, he was again fine with it. P told me he had no sheets for his spare bed. I said I'd sleep there anyway (maybe I was feeling uneasy? I remember feeling that it was somehow not quite right to share a bed) but he acted so hurt and made me feel quite guilty for assuming the worst of him. He kept saying 'there's really no need for that'. I was so dizzy and felt so bad that I crashed out in his bed. Again, yes, dumb.

After that it's a massive blur because not only was I hammered but also in and out of sleep. Semi conscious is perhaps the best word to describe it - it was like I was dreaming. I kept rising back to consciousness and finding him touching me intimately. I have no sense of chronology but I do recall saying 'no' at several points. I also remember occasionally batting his hands away. At each time he said 'sorry' and stopped but then would start again.

Why I didn't hit him and jump out of bed, I have no idea. This is exactly what I always thought I would do in this position. Normally I would - I'm known as being quite fiesty. Sometimes I couldn't move - my arms and legs felt like lead. I remember lying there as he touched me, and staring at the ceiling but I couldn't focus my eyes and they kept sliding closed. Often I would feel myself falling asleep during it. I did say 'no' though, a lot, although it was like I was sleep talking. I did not participate at any point. I didn't touch him or kiss him back, although he kept slobbering on me. I remember turning my face away which he took as an invitation to kiss my neck. It was disgusting but I couldn't stop him - I couldn't keep my eyes open.

Eventually he launched himself over me and lay across me, pinning me down with his body. He fingered me quite roughly. I think this is what woke me up properly because it was like I was me again - I burst into tears. He hugged me and kept saying how sorry he was. He said 'I thought it was what you wanted'. I got up and when I came out of the bathroom he was talking about it like it was something we had deliberately done together - like we had cheated on my boyfriend together. All stuff like 'well we need to treat this as a cautionary tale that we shouldn't get drunk together' etc. I went along with it - I think, to be honest, that I was in shock.

I don't know if it was assault or not. I know I said 'no' but I certainly wasn't assertive about it. As I say most of the time I mumbled about it - it sounded like sleeptalking which is partially what it was, I guess. I moved his hands when I could but I didn't jump out of bed and leave. But I didn't want it - I wished he would stop. I think he thought it was ok because we had shared that stupid drunken kiss years before and because I agreed to sleep in his bed. But I had said before that nothing would ever happen between us and I certainly hadn't relaxed that position. I can barely believe how stupid I was, reading this back. I know about protecting myself but I never thought for a second that he would try anything when I had said I wanted nothing to happen. I thought he was my friend. I don't think he believes that he's done anything wrong. Maybe he hasn't. I still, even now, can't work out if I am a stupid, drunken whore who cheated or someone who had something done to her. I have no intention of telling anyone about this or taking it any further because of that element of doubt. But, for my own sanity: was this assault? Am I to blame?

I read your post and I just have to say that he definitely assaulted you. You were not only incapacitated and semiconcious, but you said 'no' and you should have only had to say it ONCE for him to stop (and given the past and your state of mind, he shouldn't have even tried anything -- he was obviously taking advantage of the situation and your trusting nature).

You did NOT cheat, he assaulted you. I know it's hard to understand, because this person has been there for you and has been a friend for a long time, you can't understand how he could do that, that somehow you must be wrong. But you're not. You can't trust him, he broke your friendship when he did that to you. Do not accept his excuses of drunken mistakes and he thought that was what you wanted -- it was what he wanted so he took advantage of the situation massively.

What you describe as being unable to move, unable to stop him physically or to say much, it happens to a lot of us. Your mind just can't process it, it's like you're in shock; you also may have dissociated somewhat. It's not your fault. That you managed to say no and push his hands away is good -- from what you wrote, he had no excuse to believe 'it was what you wanted', it clearly was not.

It's not your fault. It's his.

I hope what I wrote helps some.

Thank you for that. Yes, your reply has helped enormously.

I'm still having a very hard time calling it assault. I think part of what is blocking this is the fact that every time I said no (except for the last time) he apologised ("Right! Yes, sorry, forgot!") and backed off for some time. I don't know exactly how long because I was in and out of consciousness. When he started again there would sometimes be a delayed reaction - it would take me a bit of time (and again I can't categorically say how long it was) before I came back to myself and said no again. It was like I was dimly aware of what he was doing but felt disconnected from my body.

I guess what I'm asking is, was it wrong of him to continue after I had said no even though some time had elapsed since he had backed off? Or was it fair enough - was he justifiably just 'giving it another shot'? Is this something that any man is justified in doing? He tried again 3 times that I can remember, after a no from me each time. Was it assault even though time had passed since the last 'no' earlier in the night?

I know that the last incident was definitely assault because I said "no" and "please" and he didn't even slow down, let alone stop. But I'm struggling to define the earlier touching as assault because he left such long gaps between stopping and starting again. I should have left in one of these 'in-between' times but I was in and out of sleep. It had a surreal dream like quality and I couldn't pull myself together.

Sorry to bother you with a follow up question. I'm trying to wrap my head around it all!

Each time, after you said no, it was assault, whether time passed or not. it sounds like he was merely waiting for you to pass out so much that you couldn't say no, so that he could justify to himself taking it further -- which would be unjustifiable anyway, because you were in and out of consciousness and already said NO to him.

I think I get what you're trying to say, was he doing what any man would do, and therefore maybe it's not such a betrayal, maybe he's not so bad as his actions seem to indicate -- but he is. Whether or not another man would do the same doesn't matter (and no, not all of them would) -- what matters is that he did this to YOU, that he has so little respect for YOU that he would hurt you like that, and that if you hadn't managed to say no again and again, it would have gone much further. Imagine if he had done that to one of your friends, what would you tell her? I know it is tempting to dismiss when it happens to you, whether because you don't want it to have happened, or you don't want to lose someone you considered a close friend, but please don't dismiss it or excuse it or accept any blame for it, because it was NOT your fault. You said no and he didn't listen, and how you reacted in the situation was normal.

Your delayed reaction you described-

'it would take me a bit of time (and again I can't categorically say how long it was) before I came back to myself and said no again. It was like I was dimly aware of what he was doing but felt disconnected from my body'

-- sounds like dissociation, which has happened to me before. Kind of like the mind's way of protecting you from experiencing what was happening to you, which unfortunately makes it harder to react quickly. What's important is that you said no, and that he continued to take advantage of your semiconscious state, no matter if a few minutes or an hour passed, NO means NO, you should have only had to say it once. Don't dismiss it or let him say it was a mutual mistake, because it was HIS.

Again, Gael, thank you so much for your reply. You're certainly helping me to battle the confusion and guilt I'm feeling. I really appreciate it.

I think you're certainly right that it could have gone much further. I'm finding it helpful to explore why he did it, although I know that I may never know for sure. Note that I'm certainly not planning on forgiving him or being friends with him again. It just helps me to understand it.

I know that he heard my protests but dismissed them. I believe that because I wasn't beating my fists against his chest, becoming outraged or screaming 'get off, no' repeatedly, he felt he had the green light to dismiss my refusals as being half hearted and not seriously what I wanted. I think that he convinced himself that I wanted it really. I was barely conscious and (and this is a huge source of my guilt) I did moan sometimes when he touched me, despite saying no. However, I knew that I didn't want it to happen which is why I said no. I wonder whether he thought that I wanted to cheat on my partner but was saying no to alleviate my guilt. It's my feeling that I said 'no' and he heard 'yes, but you need to earn it'. He thought I needed persuading and convincing to sleep with him and that he could do that by 'giving me a happy'. Hence, every time I stopped him he tried again later in an attempt to coax me into it.
Eventually, I think he became frustrated with what he saw as me 'not giving him a chance'. In his head, I think he was certain that once he had made me 'feel good' I would agree to sleep with him and he became angry that I wasn't letting him do this. I think that these feelings are what led to the final assault, which was noticeably more frantic and violent than the others (he pinned me down with his body, he didn't stop or slow down when I said no, he was quite rough and single minded). I believe that he was thinking 'well she's not giving me a chance to show her what I can do so - I know this will convince her so I'll just have to be assertive and take matters into my own hands.' Then, when this led to hysterical tears from me, he could no longer delude himself in this way and this is what led to him stopping. I have no doubt that if I had not cried he would have rationalised his way into raping me, whether I said no or not.

Important to mention that none of the above excuses what he did. I'm not making excuses for him - I hate him. I am furious that he felt he had the right to make the decision for me. I'm furious that he kept trying to coerce me after I said no. I'm furious that he lied to me saying there was no need to sleep in the spare bed. I'm not protecting or defending him, because I believe that even if he deluded himself into thinking his attacks were welcomed he is still detestable.

I've been thinking a lot about signs. Not saying it's my fault or I should have seen it coming, because I'm moving away from that belief fairly rapidly. But I'm now remembering stuff which is slotting into place to paint quite a horrible picture. He's very arrogant about his intelligence and sexual prowess. He's very prone to extreme mood swings - he doesn't ever get violent but instead sulks for evenings at a time. He talks about women in an objectifying way although he's very adept at passing this off as 'risque', ''edgy' jokes. He prides himself on going 'sharking' as he calls it, when he cruises the bars and pubs downtown looking for 'drunken slags' (again, his words). He scoffed when I tried to explain how awful street harassment can be ('oh yes, i'm sure it must be TERRIBLE to have members of the opposite sex propositioning you all day - what a cross to bear!'). A workmate of mine was once so drunk she couldn't stand or keep her eyes open and fooled around with him - when I put her in a cab home he was genuinely annoyed that I had 'ruined his chances' ("come on, she was massaging my balls through my trousers, of course she wanted it"). He once openly leered at a woman with large breasts in a supermarket and followed her around. But he always managed to pass it off as an act, a cheeky edgy sense of humour. Amazing to believe I know. Boy do I feel stupid.

Finally, and most tellingly, I have told my best friend about the assault. She has informed me that she had heard rumours from women we know who he has tried it on with. Apparently, and unbeknownst to me, he has a definite reputation for being 'rapey'. More than once he has tried it on with girls we know (including my sister!) while they were hammered and it has been (her words) 'extremely difficult to get him to stop'. No-one mentioned anything to me because they knew how highly I regarded him - who wants to be rude to someone about their best friend? Now that I think of it, he has always projected the suggestion that women somehow owe him something. He feels entitled to sex and cheated if he doesn't get it.

How could I have not seen this coming????