***MAY TRIGGER*** What is normal/natural?

I can't really change other people's views when they are based on religion.

I will however point out once again that holding each and every homosexual personally responsible for innocent children dead due to HIV, is irrational and hatefull.

You have issues, Moses.
And I think it would help you to consider that.

Since I'm a sucker for youtube videos, I'll just leave this here as an attempt to remind religious people that when there is so much love and kindness in both this world and the Bible, one simply shouldn't focus on petty, senseless condemnation, but rather, on LOVE: Celtic Woman - Jesu Joy of Man's Desiring (live).

EDIT: Might as well add the lyrics too.

Jesu, joy of man's desiring,
Holy wisdom, love most bright.
Drawn by Thee, our souls aspiring ,
Soar to uncreated light.
Word of God, our flesh that fashioned
With the fire of life impassioned,
Striving still to Truth unknown,
Soaring, dying 'round Thy throne.

Alevi wrote:You have issues, Moses.
And I think it would help you to consider that.

LOL! I actually laughed out loud when I read this. Like I don't know I have issues. Is this really the first you came to that conclusion? If you think about it, what person in their right mind would take a stand for what they believe, on a website where only one of us is using his real name and all the others are totally anonymous, and all the other people on the website have blindly accepted what scientists tell them as "fact"? When all the other people are anti-religion, this guy sticks up for his beliefs and puts them out there in spite of their disdain. Tell me what person in their right mind would do that?

Yeah, and it is a pity that religion has such an undeserved, privileged status that shields it from any and all criticism.

It's a pity, because that means that mentally ill people having religious delusions won't be offered help that they could have benefited enormously from.

People just don't consider religion to be a mental illness, and I think that is a shame.

But also, people who do have issues that are connected to, and perhaps magnified by, their religious delusions, feel a strong sense of entitlement to their illness.

Standing up for the fact that their thinking is insane then becomes, by convention, akin to religious persecution - in their eyes.
As if you think I want to take your little candyfloss-heaven away from you, and just listening to me is going to condemn you to hell.

So I don't think I'm going to make any further attempts to talk sense with you.

I'm going to tell you this though, which you really should try and get into your head:
There is a difference between having problems and causing problems.

When you spout hatred, you cause problems and my sympathy for you falls like a rock.

Alevi wrote:Yeah, and it is a pity that religion has such an undeserved, privileged status that shields it from any and all criticism.

It's a pity, because that means that mentally ill people having religious delusions won't be offered help that they could have benefited enormously from.

People just don't consider religion to be a mental illness, and I think that is a shame..

I think the Catholic church criticised the Protestants pretty heavily at one time. Ever heard of "Fox's Book of Martyrs?" The Catholics burnt many Christians at the stake. I wouldn't call say that religion has a privileged status. The time will soon be here again when people like you will be killing true believers, probably with guillotines. I think all except 144,000 of the true believers will be eliminated.

Alevi wrote:I'm going to tell you this though, which you really should try and get into your head:
There is a difference between having problems and causing problems.

When you spout hatred, you cause problems and my sympathy for you falls like a rock.

So was Jesus the Christ insane? He certainly caused a lot of problems. If I remember correctly, my Bible says He was crucified, which in my book would be close to the ultimate problem. But I suppose you have no sympathy for Him because of the problems he caused. He even said that for His sake a brother would turn in his own family to the authorities. We are coming upon the age of problems, and those of us who are true believers are getting ready for it.

I have nothing against homosexuals, and in fact I love them as brothers and sisters. But I cannot condone the practice of homosexual sex because of what my Bible says in Romans chapter 1. Other people of course are free to follow a completely different moral code. I am not going to burn them at the stake for it. If someone could respond to me and explain Romans chapter 1 out of the Holy Bible is such a way that it says it is okay to practice homosexual sex, I would be able to not only condone homosexual sex but approve of gay and lesbian marriage.

Moses wrote:I have nothing against homosexuals, and in fact I love them as brothers and sisters. But I cannot condone the practice of homosexual sex because of what my Bible says in Romans chapter 1. Other people of course are free to follow a completely different moral code. I am not going to burn them at the stake for it. If someone could respond to me and explain Romans chapter 1 out of the Holy Bible is such a way that it says it is okay to practice homosexual sex, I would be able to not only condone homosexual sex but approve of gay and lesbian marriage.

I think a lot of Christians have a problem with worrying about others' salvation before their own salvation. Jesus says we should only "cast stones" if we are "without sin" (John 8.7). Are you free from sin, Moses? If not, may I suggest worrying about changing yourself first before worrying about others' "lifestyle?" I think a lot of Christians give Jesus a bad name because of their holier than thou attitude, especially when they deflect their own sins onto someone else. Personally I find the "love the sinner, hate the sin" attitude condescending and worse than just straight-up hating me. I don't know how many people I've seen leave Christendom because they couldn't deal with the Pharisees within the church's walls calling out everyone else's sins (their interpretation of sin, that is) while not acknowledging their own or changing themselves to be more Jesus-like.

Argh...

AnonymousAndy wrote:I think a lot of Christians have a problem

You could help me out tremendously by doing a short essay on Romans chapter one out of the Holy Bible, explaining what it really means. That is what I asked for. Or as an alternative, you could write a short essay on the section in the Bible where Jesus does tell the crowd that those without sin can throw stones, and then tells the woman caught in adultery "Go and sin no more". I am especially interested in the part where He tells her to sin no more.

I do apreciate your insight which is so obviously free from any prejudice against Christians. It is always valuable to have good insight from people who know you well, have had intimate talks with, and are good friends.