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Taking pictures of kids

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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby BlackStrat » Mon Aug 25, 2014 5:05 pm

rainbowstar wrote:
airwolffan wrote:
skeleton-countess wrote:I think it's wrong to get pictures of anyone without their consent, regardless of age. If you have the kid's (or parent's) permission, then go ahead.

Besides, if you get caught secretly taking pictures of kids in public, there will probably be consequences.


This exactly no one should take pictures intentionally with someone in them without their consent regardless of age.

"A person who appears in public cannot reasonably expect privacy".

By appearing in public a person therefore consents to be photographed.


I'm sorry, but that is probably the most ridiculous thing I've ever read on this site. Skeleton-countess nailed it.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby ElKahn » Tue Aug 26, 2014 8:20 am

cop this wrote:It doesn't surprise me that many - ctithe, rainbowstar, and probably YRR amongst others - will express such views. They all seem to have an attraction to children but fail to express that in any sort of care, that is, in taking into account the feelings of any child subjected to such voyeurism - for that is what it is. These people are hardly helping break down attitudes to paedophilia - which perhaps is a good thing - but they are possibly not concerned with that, probably just interested in their own little worlds.

It's wrong because young children are generally not in any position to defend their interests, or to know where such images might end up, or to be used for what purpose. That is why parents will protect their children from the intrusive behaviour of others, especially if they appear to be paedophiles. Legal or not, there is a moral question, and it doesn't surprise me that many paedophiles fail to see this. Expecting children to have just the same rights, and to behave just as adults is the typical nonsensical stuff that many paedophiles will promote.

Most likely there will be some adults around to smash your camera and/or you if you do think it is appropriate, especially those thinking of taking covert pictures. Those people who do take such pictures of children are the ones contributing to the hatred often felt towards paedophiles, not making things any better.

Carry On Regardless!

:| :evil: :D


This, one million times THIS! I agree with every single word you wrote here.

There are people promoting harmful behavior towards children here, not giving a damn about children's safety. This makes me extremely ashamed to see how some pedophiles here claim to respect and love children when in reality, they promote what actually would harm them and nullify their persona and take away their rights to be protected in a world that is full of malicious people. You people claim to promote children's rights but you just act in disguise, promoting your own harmful personal agenda. What you disguise as children's rights in reality is an aberration and an attempt to normalize sexual abuse of children. You're aiming at undermining what the developed world has built over the centuries: children's rights and human rights, in general. Another example is rainbowstar's ridiculous statement. How can you claim that just by appearing in public someone consents to being photographed?? In what kind of planet do you live??
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby Endymion » Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:14 pm

cop this wrote:It doesn't surprise me that many - ctithe, rainbowstar, and probably YRR amongst others - will express such views.


Quite surprised I qualify for inclusion here, given that I haven't expressed a view but merely questioned a term.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby cop this » Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:09 am

ctithe wrote:
cop this wrote:It doesn't surprise me that many - ctithe, rainbowstar, and probably YRR amongst others - will express such views.


Quite surprised I qualify for inclusion here, given that I haven't expressed a view but merely questioned a term.


If you had come out with any supporting statements for criticising such picture-taking then it might have been obvious as to where your thinking lay. However, it hardly requires pedo-recognition software to know those here on the site who are rather more sympathetic to pro-paedophilic activism, and who generally subscribe to their concensus view, than those with a more neutral position. Spreading the 'message', wherever that may be, is what it is all about. Do you suggest I trawl through your past posts for some evidence?

PS. I'm not going to bother.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby Endymion » Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:20 am

cop this wrote:Do you suggest I trawl through your past posts for some evidence?

PS. I'm not going to bother.


No, I'd rather you took my post at face value and didn't make assumptions about it. If someone asks 'is x y?' and someone's response is 'define y', that isn't indicative of a specific agenda.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby cop this » Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:35 pm

ctithe wrote:
cop this wrote:Do you suggest I trawl through your past posts for some evidence?

PS. I'm not going to bother.


No, I'd rather you took my post at face value and didn't make assumptions about it. If someone asks 'is x y?' and someone's response is 'define y', that isn't indicative of a specific agenda.


I am so sorry you seem to feel offended. I am sure all of us will be more than pleased to hear your reasons for NOT taking such pictures - that is NOT taking them. Otherwise we can assume, as I mistakenly perhaps did, but based on your previous posts, that you are indeed of the mind that there are no reasons not to take such pictures, apart from avoiding a good thrashing perhaps.

I'm sure a person of your ability can come up with plenty of good reasons NOT to take pictures of children, so let us have them.

PS. It is illegal to take pictures of children in public in the UK if they could be deemed to be indecent, but I am sure you know this.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby Endymion » Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:41 pm

cop this wrote:I am so sorry you seem to feel offended.


I said surprised, not offended. You're making assumptions again.

cop this wrote:I am sure all of us will be more than pleased to hear your reasons for NOT taking such pictures - that is NOT taking them. Otherwise we can assume, as I mistakenly perhaps did, but based on your previous posts, that you are indeed of the mind that there are no reasons not to take such pictures, apart from avoiding a good thrashing perhaps.

I'm sure a person of your ability can come up with plenty of good reasons NOT to take pictures of children, so let us have them.


I haven't taken a position on the issue so far, and don't currently wish to. Particularly as the matter is complex. To discuss it with any genuine acuity, one would have to define 'wrong'. Without doing so, the discussion is little more than people couching their feelings in quasi-philosophical language.

cop this wrote:PS. It is illegal to take pictures of children in public in the UK if they could be deemed to be indecent, but I am sure you know this.


Yes, I do know this. However, candids are not generally indecent. Incidentally, I know this from first-hand experience, as a man took a candid of my daughter on his phone, I reported it to the police and they couldn't do anything because non-indecent candids are perfectly legal. The worst they could have charged him with would have been breach of the peace, but as they said, that's barely worth the paperwork.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby ElKahn » Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:42 pm

Let me launch an open attack against the laws in the UK, then. Deciding to take pictures of people without their consent or parents' consent if underage individuals are involved should be illegal and therefore, whoever makes the decision aforementioned should be legally prosecuted.
Because when you take a picture of someone without their consent, you're inevitably violating their privacy, which should be a basic human right. An example would be taking a picture of someone in an intimate situation and threatening to make such picture public, thus putting the victim in a position of submission.

ctithe, by not clearly stating that you're in favor of taking pictures of children, you can't be subjected to the kind of criticism cop this is directing towards you.
However, by admitting that you reported the man who took a candid of your daughter you're automatically admitting that you were hostile to such action, therefore my conclusion would be that you're not in favor of taking nonconsensual pictures of children. Or is it that you only consider it wrong when it's done to your daughter, but it's ok for other children not related to you?

Looking forward to an honest opinon.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby Endymion » Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:33 pm

ElKahn wrote:when you take a picture of someone without their consent, you're inevitably violating their privacy, which should be a basic human right. An example would be taking a picture of someone in an intimate situation and threatening to make such picture public, thus putting the victim in a position of submission.


It's tricky, because if you're in public, people can take pictures of their friends and family and you (or your daughter, for example) happen to be in the background. Perhaps the law should allow for clear attempts to snap someone. Obviously intimate photos could qualify as 'indecent', and therefore be potentially illegal under existing legislation. And I'm sure existing legislation somehow covers threatening to make intimate pictures public.

ElKahn wrote:ctithe, by not clearly stating that you're in favor of taking pictures of children, you can't be subjected to the kind of criticism cop this is directing towards you.


Quite. That was my feeling.

ElKahn wrote:However, by admitting that you reported the man who took a candid of your daughter you're automatically admitting that you were hostile to such action, therefore my conclusion would be that you're not in favor of taking nonconsensual pictures of children. Or is it that you only consider it wrong when it's done to your daughter, but it's ok for other children not related to you?

Looking forward to an honest opinon.


What he did riled me. I would expect that if I took photos of someone's children it would rile them. Whether it's 'wrong' depends on your framework. If we're talking morally wrong, then I'd have to highlight that my position on morality is closest to emotivism, i.e. I believe that moral utterances are merely expressions of people's feelings and that there is no such thing as objective right and wrong (as a deontological position, for example, would assert). If I say 'it's morally wrong', therefore, I'd believe that all I'm really saying is 'it riled me', or 'I don't feel that people should do such things', etc. So I find it easier to say that it riled me.

That's maybe not a clear-cut answer, but it is an honest one.
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Re: Taking pictures of kids

Postby YouthRightsRadical » Thu Aug 28, 2014 12:00 am

cop this wrote:It doesn't surprise me that many - ctithe, rainbowstar, and probably YRR amongst others - will express such views.

Since I'm being called out explicitly with this straw-man...
cop this wrote:They all seem to have an attraction to children but fail to express that in any sort of care, that is, in taking into account the feelings of any child subjected to such voyeurism - for that is what it is.

Once again, ignoring the feelings of children is the entire point of the current system. I'm the one advocating that we listen to them and let them make their own choices, remember?
cop this wrote:These people are hardly helping break down attitudes to paedophilia - which perhaps is a good thing - but they are possibly not concerned with that, probably just interested in their own little worlds.

That's right. Pretend that advocates like me haven't been succeeding everywhere we go. Keep pretending that you don't need the constant threat of violence to keep us from changing everything with our mere words. It must be comforting to you to believe that.
cop this wrote:It's wrong because young children are generally not in any position to defend their interests, or to know where such images might end up, or to be used for what purpose. That is why parents will protect their children from the intrusive behaviour of others, especially if they appear to be paedophiles. Legal or not, there is a moral question, and it doesn't surprise me that many paedophiles fail to see this. Expecting children to have just the same rights, and to behave just as adults is the typical nonsensical stuff that many paedophiles will promote.

So, again, you were lying when you were accusing my side of the debate of not caring what children think, when your entire position relies on treating them as subhuman and unworthy of self-determination.
cop this wrote:Most likely there will be some adults around to smash your camera and/or you if you do think it is appropriate, especially those thinking of taking covert pictures.

Yep, violence is all you can rely on in defence of your position, since you lost the moral high ground a long time ago.
cop this wrote:Those people who do take such pictures of children are the ones contributing to the hatred often felt towards paedophiles, not making things any better.

Carry On Regardless!

:| :evil: :D

Tell me, how do you feel about pictures being taken of adults in public spaces?
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