Med students - more prone to narcissim? Who has NPD?

Okay so based on around 2-3hrs of google research on NPD, I've come to the conclusion that I or a "friend" may have NPD.

I have 2 questions, No.1 - Is it likely that I or my friend have NPD from the story behind outlined below? No.2 What's the best way to manage NPD without a therapist?


The long winded story, feel free to skim read...

A Friend I met at med school lets call her Rose, lived together and went on hospital rotations together. I felt on these rotations she took advantage of me and only drew attention to herself when it made her look good in front of Drs and patients. i.e. I would deal with "difficult" patients and doctors and she would deal with the "nice" ones. I would solely organize times and clinic venues for both of us etc

She lost a lot of weight recently, which seemed to make her more confident but then that same yr also needed emergency surgery for a cyst, her family lived far away so I was the only person who helped her out and visited her in hospital.

In the last yr of friendship before I stopped talking to her, her behavior towards me totally changed she started to compete with me about looks, boys and even how well our brothers' were doing at school lol. It got to the point where I would just avoid those topics. She also started to dress inappropriately to hospital rotations to the point where a Dr asked her who she was going on a date with later - I swear to God I didn't laugh then .

She also started talking to me rudely and snapping, when I wouldn't agree with her on pointless things. I'm a stickler for speaking to people how you would like to be spoken to yourself, so I basically gave her silent treatment for a while till she apologized. It was at this point I lost a lot of my respect for her and started to distance myself.

It seemed to me she had become more insecure after her weight loss and surgery as she wasn't getting the things she expected and somehow blamed me for it.

The real kick in the guts was when she started to arrange get togethers in OUR flat with people who were my friends and hers and in some cases she met them through me. They would ask why i didn't come, like I was being anti-social and avoiding them. The most awkward situation was when I didn't tell her what day I was moving out so she arranged a dinner at our flat with some very good friends of mine, when I walked in to get my stuff they thought I knew about it and asked why I wasn't staying and I told them Rose hadn't told me about the dinner, she gave me the nastiest look that day - that was the last time we spoke properly.

What I don't understand is how Rose went from being a very close friend to an enemy almost. Was it my behaviour? Was I being narcissistic in assuming that she would always be the same and support me?

We were very close friends, and its the first friend or person that I've had a proper falling out with and it was hurtful as from my opinion we were very close friends.
I've met her a few times briefly since then and she goes out of her way to tell me how many people she meets up with and who she speaks to a lot - i really want to say to her, where were these people when you were in hospital? And I have a feeling she exaggerates her friendship with some of these people, as 2 guys she mentioned she's only known them for like 3 months as I introduced her to one of them but calls them "close friends" When I see her now I get a horrible feeling in the pit of my stomach, I can't explain it like anxiety and anger mixed together...

What do you guys think is the best course of action? Keeping in mind that I have to meet with this person occasionally as we share social circles.

If you made it to here thank you for taking the time to read it. I hope its in the correct section.

I can't address your specific situation, but I can address your subject line.

I have a lot of experience with med students and I think medical schools end up unwittingly selecting for narcissistic traits and indeed instilling them.

It's very hard to get into med school, so you have to be a high achiever. Narcissists are often high achievers. Often people go to med school to "prove something" - many times they are the first kid in their family to go to college, etc. Once they get in, however, they feel like they have made it and can relax. (This is, of course, bad for their training and their patients.) The worst aspect of this is people who complete their training only to not practice and raise kids. Their medical degree acts as nothing more than a status symbol to make them feel better about being a full time parent. I have seen this happen many times, sadly.

And there are so many other narcissistic traps in medicine: the god complex, lionizing of doctors on TV (McDreamy anyone?) etc. etc.

Today's over-parented, self-esteem addled (as opposed to self-confidence) generation is even more prone to this syndrome.

pumpkinpositive wrote:Was I being narcissistic in assuming that she would always be the same and support me?

no, just naive.

pumpkinpositive wrote:We were very close friends, and its the first friend or person that I've had a proper falling out with and it was hurtful as from my opinion we were very close friends.

you were wrong about her being your friend. no point looking back, just learn and move on.

pumpkinpositive wrote:i really want to say to her, where were these people when you were in hospital?

if you are looking for the scalpel, try this: 'wow, i really like that dress/pants/outfit, and i like your new curvy look! you look great.' and smile sincerely. seed planted, the surgery is complete.

lovemynarc wrote:I can't address your specific situation, but I can address your subject line.

I have a lot of experience with med students and I think medical schools end up unwittingly selecting for narcissistic traits and indeed instilling them.

It's very hard to get into med school, so you have to be a high achiever. Narcissists are often high achievers. Often people go to med school to "prove something" - many times they are the first kid in their family to go to college, etc. Once they get in, however, they feel like they have made it and can relax. (This is, of course, bad for their training and their patients.) The worst aspect of this is people who complete their training only to not practice and raise kids. Their medical degree acts as nothing more than a status symbol to make them feel better about being a full time parent. I have seen this happen many times, sadly.

This is totally me, its kinda scary, I was the firstborn to go to college, nevermind med school in my family, I did slack off in the first few years but it was actually the breakdown in this friendship that motivated me to go further and I'm now one of the more higher ranking students in my year.

marycarterpaint wrote:if you are looking for the scalpel, try this: 'wow, i really like that dress/pants/outfit, and i like your new curvy look! you look great.' and smile sincerely. seed planted, the surgery is complete.

That's just mean and petty I'm not stooping to her level - but it made me giggle!

I know I should move on from this friendship, the only annoying thing is that we share many friends, and I know she makes out to be some kind of victim and also impedes arrangements I make.

For example I am supposed to move in with another friend for a few months next year but, she has also weedled a way in, I'm refusing to give up the room offer but I will most probably end up living with her again - nightmare. She doesn't speak to me directly but takes advantage of the fact we share friends.

I think she does have some kind of image of herself where she is indispensable to others and I was one of the first people to rip her new one.

I don't know, its just a big annoying mess and I would be so happy if she moved to another city and I never had to hear from her or about her again, but sadly that's 2 years away!

Sorry this is such a short answer after your long post... but I'd say that it's important to remember that narcissism as a personality trait is distict from narcissism as a patholoical disorder. Med students probably have a lot to feel narcissistic about - they're smart, they're gonna make good money, they're going to be helping the world, etc.

From what I know of NPD, it's a lot more likely for a NPD person to take a single college semester and fail out due to seeming laziness, and then spend years snorting condescendingly at doctors because they "could have done that". (I say this because this is what I did.)

undenied:

I'm interested in your point, since I don't have a good apprehension of the line between strong traits associated with a personality disorder and the full blown disorder. Of course a lot of this sort of thing is a somewhat arbitrary exercise in taxonomy, so I do recognize there is a big gray area.

You seem to imply that in order for someone to have NPD it has to cripple their ability to function in some way, such as not being able to stay in college. I can see that that might be true, but is it possible it could cripple them in one area of life (ie their personal relationships) while being neutral or even helpful towards another area (ie their career/education)?

I have a close relationship with a psychiatrist who is convinced that some sociopaths, for example, are able to achieve very highly in the business world, even though conventional psychiatric wisdom about sociopaths says ending up in prison is practically a requirement for the diagnosis.

I know this is a bit off-topic, so if there is a thread where this sort of thing has been discussed previously I'd be curious to read it.