Narcissism & Substance Abuse

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I just thought that any experiment with morphine could be a bad idea? But you know better than me:- I've only seen the repercussions of someone having 20 years of opiate abuse, I don't know anything different to that extreme.

I read once that opiate abuse can actually be a 'cure' (as it were) for schizophrenia too:- in adolescents heroin can keep this kind of psychological trauma at bay - until they have matured enough to deal better with the pressures of the world. This could also be why a lot of heroin addicts give up almost spontaneously in their early 30s - when those pressure have lessened.

Does the cutting have the same (emotional) affect as the opiate? Kinda?

Normal? wrote:Username

I just thought that any experiment with morphine could be a bad idea? But you know better than me:- I've only seen the repercussions of someone having 20 years of opiate abuse, I don't know anything different to that extreme.

I think my ex had exactly the same experience of opiates as yourself:- they calmed him down and took away all of his worry (i.e. shame, rage, anxiety). I think even the Methadone has a similar affect now - it doesn't give him a high but it keeps him from imploding and means he can have a 'steady' life, work and run a household (well to some degree - he's not so successful at that). However it is a half-life if you know what I mean. Then again that may be better for him than any of his other options?

I read once that opiate abuse can actually be a 'cure' (as it were) for schizophrenia too:- in adolescents heroin can keep this kind of psychological trauma at bay - until they have matured enough to deal better with the pressures of the world. This could also be why a lot of heroin addicts give up almost spontaneously in their early 30s - when those pressure have lessened.

Does the cutting have the same (emotional) affect as the opiate? Kinda?

To that last comment, I don't know.
I get the feeling that "I need to destroy something beautiful"
But I also know "I need to keep it hidden, so no one can no".

Therefore that was my only option. Because I know I have a far way to go in the world, and having people
know of my problems will hamper that, and they may want to distance themselves from me. (Department chairs, Directer Generals of National Research Institutes). And for all that I cannot have anything on the record.

It's a way of me destroying something beautiful, because you know the whole NPD thing... We love ourself.


Opiate use IN CONTROL has been shown to be beneficial for depression, anxiety and many forms of personality disorders.
Problem is that it can get out of control (Right, like benzo's aren't used out of control too?).

Another thing, Opiates do not harm your system, you've liver easily deals with almost all forms of Opiates with GST.

So in moderation, and in control, i believe that it may help.

And just for the record,

400 mg snack of codeine last night (too bad the 1000mg of caffeine ruins the nod, can't wait till i get my sep. funnel to chloroform out the caffeine).

And I do feel better.

But still bored, and still the sense of not wanting to be sober.
No TV shows or movies to drown the sound out.

So I will drown it out with 1.5L of white wine.

Good night to all.

Hey UserName

Thanks for your honesty: - much appreciated. I hope you enjoyed the wine?

If opiates can take away the anxiety, rage, loneliness of NPD (or any other personality disorder) then I can see why they might be beneficial, especially in adolescence.
As for hurting something beautiful – what do you think is your motivation behind that? Is it envy or something a bit more complex? Is it a kind of self-destructive thing?

Normal? wrote:If opiates can take away the anxiety, rage, loneliness of NPD (or any other personality disorder)... The argument is that the drug user reaches a stage in life where they are better equipped to deal with these feelings and they then become ready to give up the drug itself (usually in their mid-30’s, they call it Maturing out of Addiction).

I haven't heard the phrase 'maturing out of addiction' as yet. I do know that there is a principle in recovery circles that a person stops maturing at the point at which they start using, so, when you stop using in recovery, a person will need to go through the various stages of maturity that they've missed by drug use. In other words, a 35 year old man could stop using and find himself with the maturity level of the 16 year old kid he was when he started using fairly heavily. That's a lot of work to make up that lost ground. People wonder why a guy who stops using still acts like an idiot... usually it's because he's just started to feel his feelings again and he doesn't have the emotional capacity as yet to know how to deal with the feelings because he's still "a kid" inside.

Hi Lifesong.

I think it's a trend they've spotted? These users do not choose to have any therapy to speak of (in the case of my ex he flat out refuses):- they just kind of spontaneously give up in their early 30s. The scientist (I'll try to find the study for you if I can) suggests that these users initially began taking heroin because of a personality disorder that they couldn't deal with - in many cases schizophrenia. The heroin allows the adolescent to become older without trauma and by their 30s they are less anxious or full of rage and hence the propensity towards mental illness has abated? Does that sound possible to you?

Normal? wrote:Hey UserName

Thanks for your honesty: - much appreciated. I hope you enjoyed the wine?

If opiates can take away the anxiety, rage, loneliness of NPD (or any other personality disorder) then I can see why they might be beneficial, especially in adolescence. The argument is that the drug user reaches a stage in life where they are better equipped to deal with these feelings and they then become ready to give up the drug itself (usually in their mid-30’s, they call it Maturing out of Addiction). Makes sense to me?

I suppose though that dependency is inevitable if opiates take these feelings away? Because once you have begun to use the problem of the rage, anxiety etc surely gets bigger. I am brilliant myself at avoidance tactics but in the case of my ex he used them for the best part of 20 years. I’m assuming that when you stop (and he hasn’t really) there is a whole world of crap to deal with.

As for hurting something beautiful – what do you think is your motivation behind that? Is it envy or something a bit more complex? Is it a kind of self-destructive thing?

Actually don't mind the wine. Never used to like it. But red is much better then white.

I see your point, however, the opiate use I'm referring to is not as regular as you may think. I speak of mid range doses, and although it may spiral out of control, nothing stronger then oxycodone or morphine (ie not heroin). I'm talking about a range of 4-5 times a month, maybe 3 times every 2 weeks or so. Not really to the point where there is a physical addiction, but a mental one could occur.

I find opiates work for my anxiety and rage in the long term, not just in the recreational stage (ie the nod).

However, I do fully agree with your statement of addiction and constant use not being beneficial, but the exact opposite. There have been some studies (mostly in the 20's-50's) on the long term effects (as long term as a study could get back then) of opiates and they were highly successful as anti-depressants and anti-anxiety but the addiction potential was way to high. I don't know how often or how high the dosage was.

EDIT: For the 2nd question that I realized I neglected to answer.


Must be something complex, I don't think (key word, think, because sometimes I'm not aware of the why) I am ever really envious of other people. I used to be of people who could be academically and athletically gifted, but I have achieve a very high level that less then .1% of the population of my university has gained. The number may even be lower then that (yes I'm bragging, sorry, can't help it).

It's not self-destructive, it is just destructive, I tend to let it out at little spurts on other people, but I manage to direct it at myself or inanimate objects or drinking occasionally. Only reason though is what I've accomplished at school, otherwise without that, I'm not sure of the limit of my destructive ability.

I took that quote from Fight Club (the author really is a genius), and i recently looked up the quote, and a psychologist analysed it as a creation of the Oedipus complex. Which I found kind of funny because I sort of do hate my father.
But I believe it's just a reaction to a lack of supply. Or something much more complexed.

Normal? wrote:I think it's a trend they've spotted? These users do not choose to have any therapy to speak of (in the case of my ex he flat out refuses):- they just kind of spontaneously give up in their early 30s. The scientist (I'll try to find the study for you if I can) suggests that these users initially began taking heroin because of a personality disorder that they couldn't deal with - in many cases schizophrenia. The heroin allows the adolescent to become older without trauma and by their 30s they are less anxious or full of rage and hence the propensity towards mental illness has abated? Does that sound possible to you?

If you do find the study. Article name or author or what journal it may be published, I'd be interested in having a read as well. Cheers

Hey UserName

Some people have been known (Coleridge was one of them) to just use opiates recreationally - some of them for their whole life - and never get addicted. Apparently Aldous Huxley had a 'Saturday night' Opium habit? It's a shame that those with personality disorders can't be given non-addictive opiates that may help them:- I'm sure my ex was happier, less stressed and less prone to bouts of rage whilst on heroin. And I understand the heroin itself (if pure and prescribed by a dr) would have caused far less harm than the red wine!

Shivers and Lovesong - here's a ref to the Maturing out of Addiction idea. It's not where I originally read it but I'll try to find that too as it made direct links between Personality Disorders and opiates:

The term "maturing out" has long been applied to heroin addicts who outgrow their habits. An important social researcher in New York City, Charles Winick, was the first to use this "street" term. In exploring public health records of known heroin addicts, he noted that those who first became addicts in their late teens ceased to appear on these lists between their mid-twenties and mid-thirties. Only a few died; the others, he discovered, eventually assumed the adult roles they had avoided while they were immersed in their drug habits and environments. (See Charles Winick, 1962, "Maturing Out of Narcotic Addiction," Bulletin on Narcotics, 14, 1-7.)
Alternate terms for this process are "natural recovery" or "spontaneous remission."

Thanks for the link normal, i had a quick read of the first 2 or 3 pages, but i'll give that thing a full read through when i have time.

His best book i think (of the ones i've read thus far) is survivor, i'm just about to read invisible monsters.

And, not only would heroin be better in terms of health for red wine, it would just be better.
I just hate not having a source for opiates where i'm from, gotta rely on my own
organic chemistry skills.