Closet/covert narcissism

^except the pd you can look only about your attachment.
This actually made more sense to me than finding the pd.

Does cnpd means you are more angry or you have more envy? Or you can have cnpd without it? ?
I check more about the 2 selves and the one should feel grandiose but the other knows he isn't at the same time.
Do you feel that?

Akuma and others will judge me again for the source. LOL and that is not official
but just practically the inverted narcissist makes more sense for shazneek to be. Than covert.

Quoth wrote: I meant it more in the sense of his reaction to other people's grandstanding or high self-esteem. For instance if someone was saying how well they were doing, even when it was quite clear at least to me that they were full of sh*t, it seemed to have a negative effect on him. He would get depressed or anxious or angry about his own performance. I mean we all get a little insecure if someone is saying how well they are doing and it is clearly a lot better than we are doing, I think under those circumstances it is normal to re-evaluate their performance.

My lack of self-esteem is usualyl connected to my poor performance, not other people's success. But it does remind of my ex a lot. With art it's very hard to separate your work from yourself, submitting any form of artistic work can occasionally feel like spilling your soul out on paper for everyone to see and criticize..I'd say it's partially hypersensitivity and partially normal human reaction.

Based on everything you told me about him, I can relate to at least 50-60% of it, just in a milder dose.

This one's a bit of an odd question, no I am not blaming him.

This one's a bit poorly phrased, I didn't mean it in a literal way..

I have to say throughout this whole discussion I have been kind of wishing that Kimira was still here. She probably could have given you a better idea of covert narcissism from a successful (or at least striving) woman's perspective

It was my first thought while opening this topic too. There's a hope she might still have the occasional habit of checking this place. I still remember most of her posts and could identify with a decent percentage of it, even then, but couldn't relate to much of what she was saying regarding her emotional responses, empathy and attitudes towards people/human relationships in general.

Also just one more thought, one of the things I did like about him was that he didn't judge too much on appearance, like pwBPD have in my experience. He was far more "concerned" with other metrics like professional success.

I can't say appearance and professional success are irrelevant to me, but I wouldn't say it's what I judge others on, even in this place I've run into some highly intelligent and curious people that seem to have been working on places like gas stations, this info has imo no relevance in comparison to their intellectual, moral and other qualities. I prefer curiosity-driven rather than success-driven people even if both often end up reaching similar goals, but their driving force makes a lot of difference in how I perceive them.

-- Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:30 pm --

dazn153 wrote:What I have learned from dating a ton is that like attracts like. People with the same wavelengths are attracted. Somebody who is very secure with themselves usually will not align with somebody who is insecure - they repel very quickly.

What exactly falls into the category of "having a same wavelength"?

Camber wrote: But what ive noticed is i have this dynamic in my head where if a person has interest in me especially a mentor that would make me estatic but they have to come to me, im not going to go out of my way for their attention. When i was young i was really good at something and got a lot of attention for it so that may have engrained in me that i dont have to seek out attention.

I wouldn't say I seek out attention, I'm just highly motivated to be good at whatever it is they're mentoring me on and I highly enjoy the opportunity to ask or discuss one billion philosophical and other questions that I never before found answers to.

Also, the in the link is stated cNPD is obsessed with his/her failures. In the past i could say this applied to me. In the past when i made a mistake at work it use to dog me a lot, to the point where it would be a domino effect and i would make several in a row because once i made one i was all flustered. But i noticed the pattern and have gotten better at putting mistakes behind me. Its like my knee jerk reaction is cNPD then the grounded side of me kicks in and i think more level headed.

I relate to your last sentence a lot, it's not my modus operandi but I'm not immune to it completely I guess..

-- Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:43 pm --

Camber wrote:I would think these symptoms would have to cause re occuring set back in ones career and or relationship.
My career hasnt had any set backs from my idiosyncracies that im aware of. When it comes to relationships, ive noticed i put a wall up with some people. If fact i think thats the main reason im looking at cNPD. Theres a really ugly side that comes out of me that i havent seem before ive been with my current partner.

This too. What made me come here and seek answers was my previous relationship, before that it never occurred to me something might be off with me. Do you think your current partner is in any way disordered themselves?

julllia wrote:^except the pd you can look only about your attachment.
This actually made more sense to me than finding the pd.

Does cnpd means you are more angry or you have more envy? Or you can have cnpd without it? ?
I check more about the 2 selves and the one should feel grandiose but the other knows he isn't at the same time.
Do you feel that?

Akuma and others will judge me again for the source. LOL and that is not official
but just practically the inverted narcissist makes more sense for shazneek to be. Than covert.

Attachment theory measures attachment-related anxiety and avoidance, and I'd say I probably score high on both, in a wanting intimacy but simultaneously fearing it sort of way.
What exactly is inverted narcissist, isn't that the same as covert? Don't worry about research papers nazis judging.

Everything seems so similar on paper that i think without experience you can't tell.i get confused about myself too.
But seriously to be a narcissist ,especially covert,don't you have to have envy or anger for others or entitlement etc do you feel that??
Do you ever take tests with various pds,out of curiosity,where do you score high?
Inverted is again closer to codependent with narcissistic traits
Random Google
http://www.narcissismfree.com/are-you-a ... arcissist/
Or
https://www.healthyplace.com/personalit ... arcissist/

-- Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:52 pm --

When i compare my attachment in relationships i can't understand either clearly,who is what.only when i read it i can see obviously what type of insecure attachment i have.
When i see it with people i interact with i get confused ,who is who

This too. What made me come here and seek answers was my previous relationship, before that it never occurred to me something might be off with me. Do you think your current partner is in any way disordered themselves?

Yes. Like attracts like. Birds of a feather flock together. It is 100% true. Just average your 5 closest friends and that is you. There is a reason why successful people only hang with successful people.

Likely you both suffered the same trauma as a child or some type of pain, which you both can relate to and really understand each other through.

julllia wrote:Everything seems so similar on paper that i think without experience you can't tell.i get confused about myself too.
But seriously to be a narcissist ,especially covert,don't you have to have envy or anger for others or entitlement etc do you feel that??

Do you ever take tests with various pds,out of curiosity,where do you score high?

I agree with you on envy/anger/entitlement part, I vividly remember it in my ex and I can't really relate to it much. I do experience anger, or better a constant buzzing irritation and headaches followed by fluctuating moods and self-esteem issues that could be perfectly explained via bipolar disorder. (I mostly did mood disorder tests, not PD-related ones) I also score extremely high on every single ADHD test I've ever done. I don't recall others (or my actions) ever suggesting my empathy is in any way impaired. (as a comparison, my ex told me he always knew he was somehow different than most people, I never experienced this feeling, I did the isolation part, though) I also seem to experience emotions more intensely than an average person, things happening to other people often get to me and influence my mood, it's very easy for me to get "infested" with other people's moods and stories, this is what I mostly mean when I say empath and this seems to be in contrast with most covert narcissists I've encountered or read about.
Basking in the glow of the idealized object is absolutely true for every rl I've had with a disordered person and it's the main reason I'm considering CNPD as a possibility.
Links you provided are not scientific, but they do seem to describe what we referred to in previous pages as - codependents, or "empathetic narcissists" and you're partially right because I can relate to it more than I can to CNPD, but I just can't seem to find the proper analogy in psychological terms, the closest one just brings me back to CNPD.
So, either it's CNPD or some mood disorder in combination with codependency when it comes to relationships.

I think this topic can now be closed, though, it has helped me a lot in terms of narrowing it down and leading me in right direction, I now need to write it all down and discuss it with my therapist.

dazn153 wrote:

This too. What made me come here and seek answers was my previous relationship, before that it never occurred to me something might be off with me. Do you think your current partner is in any way disordered themselves?

Yes. Like attracts like. Birds of a feather flock together. It is 100% true. Just average your 5 closest friends and that is you. There is a reason why successful people only hang with successful people.

Looking at one's friends when analyzing oneself is pretty good advice. Most of my friends are pretty emotional, stable and empathetic, probably nons. Most of my boyfriends were the opposite of that, it rarely happens that I fall for someone who might be described as non. I also spent most of my last year engaging with various disordered people, experimenting with drugs and "living on the edge". All this perfectly sums up my personality and its both healthy and disordered parts, different parts of me seem to engage with these groups but none of those parts are fake.

How would you describe your 5 closest friends?

dazn153 wrote:
Yes. Like attracts like. Birds of a feather flock together. It is 100% true. Just average your 5 closest friends and that is you. There is a reason why successful people only hang with successful people.

I think I'll open a topic about this, I'm interested to see how others will respond and what type of people they engage with.

As a slightly odd thought Shanz, how much does your introverted/extroverted personas relate to my twin Quoths thing? I mean for me they're almost like two (potentially more) distinct personality states, when I was young I actually invisaged my personality as two people, a boy who was basically me, sensitive and introvert and another character I thought of as "the black man" (not in an African American sense) a behemoth of rage, ambition, narcissism and raw willpower. It was almost like I had created my own internal attack dog which I could use whenever I was feeling naff.

Obviously these days I realise the "boy" is the stronger of the two and I should point out that the states are not dissociative in the memory sense.


The other question is how bad are you for telling tales, making up an anecdote or something? In a social setting, purely to be likable?