Difference between narcissism and NPD?

GettingAdvice wrote:

bitty wrote:GettingAdvice, do you think that there are any aspects of narcissism likely to be shared by the people who become close to them, such as self satisfaction with one's intellect for example, generating a sense of superiority? Or do you think that perhaps it's a case of the attraction of opposites, or complementary characteristics?

There are aspects of narcissism through the entire population generally. It's pathological when it affects the functioning of relationships and I don't think this necessarily applies to those who are initially engaged with narcissists. The nature of the attraction, whether 'opposites' or not, is a matter of chemistry and individual personality. Some people just mesh together, whether because of intellectual interests/similarities, thinking, backgrounds, sensibilities and I believe it's perfectly possible for a pwNPD to be attracted to a like-minded person just as most people are. The problem occurs AFTER that attraction - whether between friends or lovers - and a pwNPD is unlikely to be able to maintain a mature relationship because of his/her issues. I cannot imagine how painful it is to always know that something which starts so promisingly is doomed to fail - each and every time.

People used to say planes would never fly. Depends on what your gauge of "success" is , whether you will "fail".

GettingAdvice wrote:There are aspects of narcissism through the entire population generally. It's pathological when it affects the functioning of relationships and I don't think this necessarily applies to those who are initially engaged with narcissists. The nature of the attraction, whether 'opposites' or not, is a matter of chemistry and individual personality. Some people just mesh together, whether because of intellectual interests/similarities, thinking, backgrounds, sensibilities and I believe it's perfectly possible for a pwNPD to be attracted to a like-minded person just as most people are. The problem occurs AFTER that attraction - whether between friends or lovers - and a pwNPD is unlikely to be able to maintain a mature relationship because of his/her issues. I cannot imagine how painful it is to always know that something which starts so promisingly is doomed to fail - each and every time.

Do you feel pride in your intellect, or have a sense of superiority? It's a feeling I get from your posts. Sorry to ask so directly, but the more circumspect approach didn't generate a direct answer.

bitty wrote:

GettingAdvice wrote:There are aspects of narcissism through the entire population generally. It's pathological when it affects the functioning of relationships and I don't think this necessarily applies to those who are initially engaged with narcissists. The nature of the attraction, whether 'opposites' or not, is a matter of chemistry and individual personality. Some people just mesh together, whether because of intellectual interests/similarities, thinking, backgrounds, sensibilities and I believe it's perfectly possible for a pwNPD to be attracted to a like-minded person just as most people are. The problem occurs AFTER that attraction - whether between friends or lovers - and a pwNPD is unlikely to be able to maintain a mature relationship because of his/her issues. I cannot imagine how painful it is to always know that something which starts so promisingly is doomed to fail - each and every time.

Do you feel pride in your intellect, or have a sense of superiority? It's a feeling I get from your posts. Sorry to ask so directly, but the more circumspect approach didn't generate a direct answer.

Your comments are trolling and designed to derail a legitimate and interesting discussion because of your own personal 'issues'.

GettingAdvice wrote:

bitty wrote:

GettingAdvice wrote:There are aspects of narcissism through the entire population generally. It's pathological when it affects the functioning of relationships and I don't think this necessarily applies to those who are initially engaged with narcissists. The nature of the attraction, whether 'opposites' or not, is a matter of chemistry and individual personality. Some people just mesh together, whether because of intellectual interests/similarities, thinking, backgrounds, sensibilities and I believe it's perfectly possible for a pwNPD to be attracted to a like-minded person just as most people are. The problem occurs AFTER that attraction - whether between friends or lovers - and a pwNPD is unlikely to be able to maintain a mature relationship because of his/her issues. I cannot imagine how painful it is to always know that something which starts so promisingly is doomed to fail - each and every time.

Do you feel pride in your intellect, or have a sense of superiority? It's a feeling I get from your posts. Sorry to ask so directly, but the more circumspect approach didn't generate a direct answer.

Your comments are trolling and designed to derail a legitimate and interesting discussion because of your own personal 'issues'.

Nope.
She was trying to convey nicely that you are narcississtic as hell and totally blinded by who you are.

And the addition from me: IMO, and in my experience NPD is the consequence of a bad parenting. You are here to complain about your NPD son, but you don't have a clue that he got it from you.

I was reading some of your posts. The problem is, guess who -YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Go read the post about narcississtic mothers, and find yourself.

And before you shoot me with your little poisunous comment - I have been diagnozed with NPD, I don't have issues, I have a personal dissorder. And it has been develop because of bad parenting. I can recognize N mother on a mile, and guess what, the is YOU!!!!!

GettingAdvice wrote:Your comments are trolling and designed to derail a legitimate and interesting discussion because of your own personal 'issues'.

I'm sorry to have offended you, but I do stand by what I wrote. I am a narcissist, but I don't think that that makes my observations less valid.

Serves me right from trying to get the facts and lowdown from, well, headcases.

FYI, my son abused drugs from a very early age and my other 4 children are perfectly healthy and successful. And now, I feel sorry for both of you...

And the 'victim' mindset about parents being responsible is the biggest load of bull I've ever heard. Typical of the psychology profession to cling onto that one when no other plausible explanation can be found - well, that's what my Psych sister tells me too. She says narcissism is extremely complex and cannot be simplistically attributed to parenting. If you're paying a therapist to tell you this you're wasting your time and money.

Does it make you feel better, though, thinking the rest of the world is like you? That's a bad bet and a pact with the devil. Have fun.

GettingAdvice wrote:Serves me right from trying to get the facts and lowdown from, well, headcases.

FYI, my son abused drugs from a very early age and my other 4 children are perfectly healthy and successful. And now, I feel sorry for both of you...

And the 'victim' mindset about parents being responsible is the biggest load of bull I've ever heard. Typical of the psychology profession to cling onto that one when no other plausible explanation can be found - well, that's what my Psych sister tells me too. She says narcissism is extremely complex and cannot be simplistically attributed to parenting. If you're paying a therapist to tell you this you're wasting your time and money.

Does it make you feel better, though, thinking the rest of the world is like you? That's a bad bet and a pact with the devil. Have fun.

Oh my, strong words!
Headcases, pact with the devil, load of bull..no wonder poor kid reached for drugs at young age. I am waiting for the other four to wake up (unless they have already become mini you).

VioletAasA wrote:

GettingAdvice wrote:Serves me right from trying to get the facts and lowdown from, well, headcases.

FYI, my son abused drugs from a very early age and my other 4 children are perfectly healthy and successful. And now, I feel sorry for both of you...

And the 'victim' mindset about parents being responsible is the biggest load of bull I've ever heard. Typical of the psychology profession to cling onto that one when no other plausible explanation can be found - well, that's what my Psych sister tells me too. She says narcissism is extremely complex and cannot be simplistically attributed to parenting. If you're paying a therapist to tell you this you're wasting your time and money.

Does it make you feel better, though, thinking the rest of the world is like you? That's a bad bet and a pact with the devil. Have fun.

Oh my, strong words!
Headcases, pact with the devil, load of bull..no wonder poor kid reached for drugs at young age. I am waiting for the other four to wake up (unless they have already become mini you).

More of your projections? Spend less time on the internet - that MIGHT help!

GettingAdvice, in your first post, you wrote that your last best friend didn't keep in touch, and that you've alienated your children; one still speaks to you.

Look, if you are a narcissist, well, I'm one too, and I'm not judging you for that. You may criticize me for looking at your old posts; I did that initially to make sure that I wasn't overreacting to you. Anyway, try to look past that.

NPD isn't created by their parents. Although commonly you will find "encouraging" behaviors.

Remember mental illness is genetic. My family, for example, is a Cluster B fest.
But even the not "biologically" pre-disposed ones, might develop characteristic and behaviors that go in accordance with their environment. I have a cousin who suffered ABSURD abuse from his parents. He had normal affect for a long time, nothing was wrong with him.
But as he got older, his behavior changed because of the abuse. You could easily diagnose him today as ASPD. But why you can't? Because he still shows affection and responds normally to a variety of things.

Cluster B parents have a special way of f*cking up their kids, but that can't be confused with the disease in the first place.

True NPD, BPD, HPD or ASPD is exclusively-biological. As in, their brains and endocrine system are different. And they're born that way.

To diagnose one as NPD, it must follow a thorough criteria of behaviors aside from what you might think it is narcisissm. And it's more than just "looking for extremes that go for a long period", too. You have to make sure the psychopath/sociopath construct is there. You must evaluate response to medication. You must evaluate things such as capacity to feel fear, daring behavior, involuntary affect and emotional reactions, perception of self, the list goes on and on.

But most of this people are aware of all of this, so spotting all this is hard. More are unwilling to accept psychiatric diagnosis. They try to get away from the notion they're "broken" constantly.

Actually A LOT of the symptoms that fill criteria for diagnosis are more like instinctive or common reactions to cope with/hide the diseased behavior/brain. Most Cluster Bs live their lives trying to forge a new self for themselves. Like GettingAdvice said, it's a chicken and the egg thing. They dislike themselves because they are disordered, and they are disordered because they dislike themselves.

But worrying about the gamut of causs, symptoms and their domino effects is pointless. Best to invest on finding treatments that work.

Soon, at least, scanning of the brain will be more affordable and efficient and psychiatrists will be able to tell if something can be amiss. Psychopaths usually show more brain abnormalities than any other mental illness, if even so the more serious cases.

NPD, HPD, BPD and ASPD aren't merely learned behaviors. Don't be mislead by the term "personality" on the disorder. It's physicall and it affects areas more vast and complex than what AxisI disorders do.
PDs are huge syndromes, physiologically speaking, that really messes up a person's life and the society they're in. Not all sufferers will exhibit extremely bad behaviors, but it does cause unnecessary unpleasantness to the least.

Using cancer as an analogy:
A human society is like an organism. An organism is made from cells. To the society organism, each person is a cell.

A person with a Cluster B disorder, is much like a cell with cancer: it was some random mutation that makes it unable to properly do it's functions, communicate and replicate properly with the cells around it. However, it can be mistakenly seen as efficient, because it does everything so fast.

As long as this cell lives, the more damage it can do. The more it reproduces, the more mutations and aberrations it will produce. It is a very damaging thing. It must be encapsulated and removed.
Regardless of that, this cell keeps going even more ferociously to keep itself going/alive. It refuses to let go of itself, just another cell would. It insists on it's dysfunctions. It's uniqueness as an aberration gets masked as individualism and boastfulness. It will mask itself and try to reproduce to keep itself going, trying to make all cells just like her. In the end, cancer will corrupt the organism so much society just dies.

Of course, for organism cells this is more mechanical. For us, depending for perspective, it's just as mechanical I guess, but obviously we will have many feelings involved for each individual and moment in this process.