Problems with Itemizing?

Hey Pam... if you would like, well... would you like to PM me a full detailed outline of your lifestory? You've got me kinda curious now, if you don't mind sharing. ^^;

Then... maybe I could just highlight or mention any parts that sound similar or the same to mine, hahaha.

It's up to you. You don't have to if you don't want to, I was just curious. ^^; I'm just saying if you'd like to share, I would be totally willing to read it. It just might take me a while to respond because I might need time to process.

Fawnette wrote:Hey Pam... if you would like, well... would you like to PM me a full detailed outline of your lifestory? You've got me kinda curious now, if you don't mind sharing. ^^;

I'd rather not, unless you're really interested. Though I might be able to dig up some posts I've made about it. Suffice it to say that BPD and autism spectrum seem to have a lot in common.

Back on the general topic of this thread and related/similar issues, there is one more thing I was wondering if someone could help me with, because this really is helping me get past some mental blocks.

Something I still seem to get STUCK on sometimes is... well, it kinda goes back to a point that was made earlier in this thread (I'm too lazy to get a quote) where part of the problem, sometimes, is that people don't outright explain what the problem is at times, which can lead to people being clueless about WHAT the problem is, or even learning to ignore it altogether.

Soooo this kinda makes me wonder... why don't people want to talk about things at times? Why do people have to be so super-sensitive about things, or even outright defensive? Or why do they sometimes say things like, "That's in the past now" to a person who keeps bringing something up when it is obviously not in the past for the person who is trying to bring it up? I mean, that is the REASON why they keep bringing it up in the first place!

I have found that I have gotten into a very icky and annoying habit over the last decade, possibly due in part to how suppressed I was during my childhood and how no-one could ever talk about anything without being dodgy or blowing up and running away.... where basically, I want to talk about EVERYTHING in every intricate detail, and have the other person respond to each teeny tiny detail in kind, and I want to talk about it (Twenty times if I want or need to) in order to get any emotions outta my system and cover all the details. I want to revisit it as many times as I feel I need to. I also seem to have a NEED for repetitiveness until I am ready to move away from it. (And I think if someone tells me to shut up, even if they do so in a nice way, or they indicate they'd rather not hear it anymore when they are the favorite listener I have whom I have latched onto and gotten attached to... I feel rejected, dismissed, and I feel like that person has shut me off and cheated me out of a chance to talk in thorough completion.)

I can see how this would be very annoying for other people, because... if there is something stuck on repeat, especially if it's irritating, it's only natural that you would want it to stop. Because it would drive you batty otherwise. But...

I guess I'm stuck on a mental block here, sorry, like... WHY don't people really want to talk about stuff? I think about stuff I did wrong all the time, I have sometimes even enjoyed going to other people about my faults and discussed them and what I should have done different in some manner, at least... depending on who I'm talking to.

But... if someone does something that makes me mad or hurts my feelings, it seems like much of the time, (unless the person wants to co-ruminate with me), all they wanna do is clarify/defend their position once or twice, MAYBE they will give me an apology if they really feel bad or they just wanna make nice, but after that... they don't want to discuss it again. I'm sorry, but I guess I just don't get this.

Why do some people have the want or need to move on so quickly, after only discussing it once or twice or possibly even barely at all? Why don't people want to ruminate or co-ruminate at least a tad more? Why do some people find it so annoying to talk in circles or get repetitive, when to others it can be soothing or feel like the best way to connect on the planet?

If anyone has an answer that can help me get past this mental block, I'd be grateful.

Fawnette wrote:I can see how this would be very annoying for other people, because... if there is something stuck on repeat, especially if it's irritating, it's only natural that you would want it to stop. Because it would drive you batty otherwise. But...

Why do some people have the want or need to move on so quickly, after only discussing it once or twice or possibly even barely at all? Why don't people want to ruminate or co-ruminate at least a tad more? Why do some people find it so annoying to talk in circles or get repetitive, when to others it can be soothing or feel like the best way to connect on the planet?

Don't know, but we're definitely twins.

After spending some time processing everything that I, and others, have said in this thread....

I seriously think I have some entitlement issues, although this is nothing new to me anyway because I've always known deep down, for a long time, that I do. I'm probably always going to be something of a brat, at least in some areas, because nobody ever becomes perfect in their lifetime anyway.

Honestly... I think that maybe these issues where I have been ignored at times, I have also ignored any number of issues during my entire childhood, well... maybe this gives me a sense of entitlement, because I feel like I'm "owed" a lot due to opportunities I missed myself, or that the stupidity, ignorance or arrogance of others forced me to miss, sometimes out of carelessness, sometimes out of their own controlling or dismissive nature.

For a long time, I have wanted to be able to take my entire "life-story", spread it all out, and be able to go back and edit it. To make other people see the error of their ways and how it affected those around them (including me), and I want to be able to go back and edit/fix anything stupid, arrogant, embarrassing and inappropriate I did while still retaining the knowledge and experience I gained through the incidents.

Maybe in some ways, I can't stand people seeing me as anything other than a shining angel, even if I have to delude myself sometimes into thinking they don't dislike me, because the reality is too harsh to accept and I seem to get so attached to people (or the idea of them) I admire too easily at times. Plus... as I've discussed earlier in the thread, it can be hard to deal with people being upset with you for any reason because there's still that thing that goes back to my childhood of them "turning mean" seemingly without warning, and being unable to deal with the harsh judgement or rash confrontation.

I think it also doesn't help that I grew up with the desire to be a writer, and I was raised by an engineer dad who has always been a great science fiction nerd. It was he who once introduced the concept to me, when I was a teenager, of time-travel and different if's, and's and but's about time-travel and what could happen if only you could. (I also know that during his depressive moments, he has sometimes wished with all his heart that he could go back in time and basically prevent his own conception so he wouldn't have to deal with existence in the first place.)

So... take that kind of logic, and well... combine that with the writer's spirit, and can make you feel like you have the greatest desire in the world to edit reality. You wish that you could pick up your life and every single object, person, and incident that ever affected/impacted your life in any way, and go through it with a fine-tooth comb and edit it. Change other people's backstories so that they could have grown up in much better circumstances, without trauma happening, and they could have turned out to be better people and they could've even had all of their dreams come true, just as they always wanted them.

On top of that, have the power to edit other people's personalities, so that they can be more compatible with you and they won't do or say some of the things you can't stand anymore... or better yet, make it so that they never did them in the first place.

And I kinda feel like... part of me is NEVER going to be happy until and unless all of this can happen. But it's not gonna happen, and it's also awfully arrogant because it's like I want to be a god. That's just not possible, it's just not happening.

But back on the topic of ignoring/learning not to deal with things at a young age, well...

You know how I said I felt like I had an entitlement issue? Wellll... I think in some ways, when I first began to assert myself a tad more as a young adult years ago, I think I had a huge problem (and still do) with people arguing with me or telling me their side to stuff sometimes because... I guess maybe I just feel like the rest of the world OWES it to me to just shut up and let me spill all of my thoughts and emotions while they remain quiet and receive it all, because I had to be quiet, be controlled, and do what I was supposed to be told for so long. Only, that's not how humans work.

Maybe in some areas... I don't want human friends, or I don't want interaction with humans, because they are unpredictable, argumentative, prone to moodiness, and they aren't available to be there for you whenever you want or need them like turning on a computer or picking up a good book... where you can just resume from the last spot where you left your bookmark. Nice, tidy, easy....

Human beings are already filled up with their own unique experiences, their own desires, their own goals, their own motivations... unless they are partially braindead or have a severe mental problem that prevents speech and higher cognitive functions, you are never gonna find somebody who can just be the perfect machine ready to have whatever mood you want or need them to have at any given moment, or be there at a moment's notice.

The only way you'd have someone THAT obligated to you is if you are an infant, unless you want to become a narcissistic abuser trying to get someone to become completely submissive, annnnd THAT behavior can land you in prison, rightfully so. :/

Annnnyway yeah.... I'm just trying to get thoughts outta my system and finish processing, I guess.

Fawnette wrote:Honestly... I think that maybe these issues where I have been ignored at times, I have also ignored any number of issues during my entire childhood, well... maybe this gives me a sense of entitlement, because I feel like I'm "owed" a lot due to opportunities I missed myself, or that the stupidity, ignorance or arrogance of others forced me to miss, sometimes out of carelessness, sometimes out of their own controlling or dismissive nature.

Twins.

Maybe in some ways, I can't stand people seeing me as anything other than a shining angel, even if I have to delude myself sometimes into thinking they don't dislike me, because the reality is too harsh to accept and I seem to get so attached to people (or the idea of them) I admire too easily at times.

Twins.

I guess maybe I just feel like the rest of the world OWES it to me to just shut up and let me spill all of my thoughts and emotions while they remain quiet and receive it all, because I had to be quiet, be controlled, and do what I was supposed to be told for so long. Only, that's not how humans work.

Twins.

Maybe in some areas... I don't want human friends, or I don't want interaction with humans, because they are unpredictable, argumentative, prone to moodiness, and they aren't available to be there for you whenever you want or need them like turning on a computer or picking up a good book... where you can just resume from the last spot where you left your bookmark. Nice, tidy, easy....

Yes. Unfortunately there's a kind of predatory/exploitative quality about it. Seeing others as objects to be used to meet one's own needs. Vampirism. It strange how much they have in common. Your thread makes me really wonder about the genesis of each... By the way, is there a desperate or hungry quality to autism? A constant desire to escape pain/reality? If not, that may be the difference, though perhaps mine is just another form of entitlement. "I'm entitled to use people because... pain." If you are motivated by a nagging pain, do you experience pain in the present, or is it just a memory from the past that yields feelings of entitlement? Simply from resentment or the feeling of being wronged during childhood? Another question: do you remember your emotions? Like, emotionally, why you did one thing or another, why you wanted one thing or another, after the fact?

Do you have OCD qualities? Do you feel empty? How strong is your sense of self? What needs are you trying to get met through other people?

pamelaperejil wrote:Do you have OCD qualities? Do you feel empty? How strong is your sense of self? What needs are you trying to get met through other people?

I have found that I... I don't know, I'm not quite sure how to put this into words.

Ever since my youth, it has seemed like I have needed others to strongly help support/supplement a variation of reality that I feel like I want/need.

I think part of this might be because I pretty much lived in books, games, TV shows and movies as a kid, to the point where I got very, very daydreamy and concocted imaginary versions of characters to suit whatever I wanted or needed... and then I used those around me whenever I could, to help me support the fantasies and add substance to them if my own mind/imagination developed a mental block.

In a way... it's almost like I want other people to be my muse, to be my information machines to fuel my imagination, to be my... holodeck, to provide amusement and anything else I could want or need, and all I'd need is to walk in, have fun, and be pampered or entertained.

Years ago, I used to be a majorly entitled brat when I joined internet RPs, (the writing kind) because I just wanted to do whatever I wanted to do and I even drove other people away because of my attitude. I just wanted to use RPs to fulfill fantasies, and I didn't want to cooperate with other people or compromise.

The worst part is that to this day, I am ashamed of my behavior and the best I can hope for is that those people don't remember me anymore (a lot of it was about a decade ago anyway) but at the same time, the more narcissistic side of me has privately resented them for a long time for not doing things my way when I wanted them done my way.

I know we're not supposed to diagnose, but I would recommend looking into the possibility that you have BPD and/instead of autism. It may interest you to know that I believe my dad has Aspergers (he's never been diagnosed) and I think that may have led to my developing BPD. (Though I'm not diagnosed either). What is your mom like? Mine's bipolar. BTW: you might ask shock_the_monkey his opinion. He has Aspergers and might be able to explain the differences between autism and BPD better than I can.

pamelaperejil wrote:I know we're not supposed to diagnose, but I would recommend looking into the possibility that you have BPD and/instead of autism. It may interest you to know that I believe my dad has Aspergers (he's never been diagnosed) and I think that may have led to my developing BPD. (Though I'm not diagnosed either). What is your mom like? Mine's bipolar. BTW: you might ask shock_the_monkey his opinion. He has Aspergers and might be able to explain the differences between autism and BPD better than I can.

Eh I figure we're not doing any kind of diagnosis here, and there's nothing harmful about speculation, discussing and theorizing, especially since that seems to be part of the purpose of forum threads anyway....

About the only thing I can say is that I have read psychology-related articles which state that some studies have shown that children who are neglected, abused in some fashion, or even if they just have parents who are moody and/or emotionally unavailable much of the time can sometimes develop bipolar disorder, particularly if they were more needy and sensitive as young children for any reason.

I know that my Dad is strongly suspected to have Aspergers, and he went through some very serious bouts of depression during my teenage years, particularly when some of his life goals and dreams did not work out the way he'd hoped, to the point where he basically withdrew from his family and got ultra-grumpy if anybody tried to approach him, and it's like he just wanted to stay in his world of porn and computer games for a long time and forget that anyone else existed.

At the same time, Mom had also entered into depression I think, after her father passed away around the same time Dad got his hopes and dreams dashed. She pretty much withdrew into herself as well, and stuffed everything down deep inside... though in a way, she kinda had to, because she was the primary breadwinner of the family and, while Dad did do a lot of work around the house/property and had many decent skills, he never worked much until after he entered his sixties.

So I guess my point is... I pretty much had to fend for myself emotionally and otherwise, especially since my parents were excruciating private and rather controlling people during my youth.

I also think there were times when both of them lived in some kind of non-existent, alternate reality for a long time before both of them finally started to wake up. Remember when I said that my Dad had told me that God's plan or whatever was gonna unroll after I turned eighteen, where I was gonna automatically get married and whatever? I still find it a little strange that his first piece of advice to me on the matter was "If a guy shows interest in you, invite him over at a time when I'm here."

.........Even though I had never had any kind of social life whatsoever, I had never been out on my own at all, I never met people at all, and he was ALWAYS around the house since he never really went anywhere back then except for brief outings to go buy some groceries and get the paper.

Sometimes, I think the biggest mistake my family kept making for many years is that we had this delusional thing going on that somehow, even when we were just existing around the house pretty much doing nothing and not interacting with each other, SOMEHOW I guess.... stuff was still going on? :/

I've sometimes cracked smart-alecky jokes about this with my mother, about how much my homeschooling and whatever got neglected, particularly when... for a time, whenever it got revealed that I didn't know something or didn't know how to do something, Dad would act like it was all my fault and I just "should have learned that already", even though my parents were very impatient teachers, often unavailable, and while they did make sure I at least got the middleschool basics down, well... yeah.

But anyway, the smart-aleck cracks I've made in recent years to Mom has been, "I guess on the important days of my education, Miss Figment was not available and we ought to get after her or even sue her for her absence of and neglect of her responsibilities." And of course, my reference to "Miss Figment" just means "figment of our imagination", since my parents often acted like... back then, stuff was somehow getting done behind their backs even when no-one was doing it or attending to it and they weren't really doing much.

Honestly... I sometimes wonder if they were kinda like big kids who were subconsciously hoping that an invisible mom and dad would step in and take care of everything for us, Dad in particular almost seemed to act/feel that way sometimes. Though I also know he got treated like an errand boy a lot when he was a kid, and from what I understand, his mother ruled the roost and pretty much took care of everything.