HPD and fate

I definitely recognized she was using me for my perceived status. Pretty sad too, because I don't really have any. What it was is she valued me for incidental things about my person. Where I lived, the languages I spoke, the degrees I had. I understand that's pretty much how a person with HDP values themeselves. She didn't even really try to hide it. I think it's all she knew.

If that is the basis of your self-perception then I guess you better believe in fate. No sense in character building.

Had a lightbulb moment!!!! l once believed in fate as an excuse to carry on the searching for the ever elusive perfect guy....the current guy, once he fell of the pedestal, was obviously not my "soul mate"......if l met another guy, who in my disordered frame of mind appeared to meet the right criteria, then "fate" had obviously brought us together.... Fate is just an excuse for not taking responsibility.........what an @@@@hole l was, and still am as far as relationships are concerned - hence no relationships for me for a long, long time. l am dangerous. l should carry a warning. Please guys, if you reply to this, don't reassure me that l am okay, or not to be too hard on myself. l have to be hard on myself. l have to feel like a complete s@@t and let that feeling wash all over me till l drown in it if l am ever to feel true remorse. l am a total @@@@ No excuses. Please, people, reply to Principled Man's post, and not to mine. Just leave me to allow the enormity of how l have been hit me full in the face.

Hi Principled Man,

Mine certainly believed in fate in a way. She actually went so far as to say the God sent these people to her. After her mask started coming off and I confronted her about how she was treating the one guy (clearly and by her own admission - eventually - a third choice and backup), she actually told me with some conviction that she can't stop leading him on, because 'maybe God put him on her path for in case things with xxx (first choice) did not work out'. When she could not deny using him, she used this excuse.

The pattern is clear and I think Janey is right - it's a way to avoid taking responsibility. Ironically, she is now engaged to this poor guy. I've been almost 8 months of NC and when she got engaged some people were very worried about me. I'm both proud and ashamed to say the news honestly didn't bother me in the least - in fact I felt a great sense of relief. The relief came from realizing this makes it more likely she will stay out of my life and stop hurting people (she also interefered with her old boyfriend's new relationship to the point of destroying it, and then, as soon as the new girlfriend broke up with him for it, no longer had any interest in him). The guilt came from finding myself happy about some poor, innocent bloke 'taking one for the team', so to speak.

Hi Janey,

I find your posts in general very insightful. You might not have come across my handle before - I lurk a lot and post rarely. Please continue posting. As someone who has grown from hurting from to more intellectually intrigued by HPD (and what made me vulnerable), I get great insights from your 'random postings' and I do respect what you are doing. You are right in needing to face the feelings and consequences as well, though. Someone once wrote that one of the things making it difficult to 'cure' HPD is that the patient needs to be willing to face major depression over an extended period of time to be able to work through what caused (and will continue to cause) HPD in the first place. So please accept my salute to your efforts.

On the negative side, I truly do believe that more than mere realization and remorse is needed. A truly important part is to, to the best of your ability, undue the harm you have done or compensate for it somehow. Naturally, a lot of the harm done cannot be undone and in some cases attempting to do so can cause more harm. Make sure it's true in a specific case and that you're not just using it as an easy way out to not do something, though. To be more specific - the public apology to the people you hurt really is great, but do they have any knowledge of this apology? As long as they do not, in a way, it's still all about you.

I'm not sure my last paragraph makes a lot of sense - I'm battling to articulate what I'm trying to say. In short, if you can, apologize to the people you hurt and try to make up for it. If it will only cause more hurt, see if there is some way to make up for it, even anonymously. If you can't make up for it with one person, try something in the line of 'pay it forward'. Basically, the type of damage HPDs do cannot easily be undone, but in the TRYING, I believe, there may be great salvation and relief. Please understand, with all of this, that I hold you in the highest regard, but do not see that as a 'get out of jail free' ticket (I do realize that is not what you are looking for - I'm posting to some extend to clear up my own thougths about this as well).

If I may ask, how old are you? Just a range would be good. I seem to remember you talking about your grandchildren, but barring that one memory, I would have pegged you for 30's.

Hi. Thanks for your response. The reason you assume l am in my thirties has, l think, a lot to do with the fact that l still have some unresolved conflicts that relate specifically to that period in my life. l think that is why many hpds come across as younger than their actual age, both in appearance and attitude, because they remain stuck in a stage with unresolved conflicts. l am actually 48. l look a lot younger and l am telling you this, not from vanity, but because l feel that because l am "stuck" at this stage. The lines people develop on their faces reflect their experiences and charecter and their faces develop laughter lines, frown marks, smile lines etc. People grow into their faces, or should l say their faces grow with their charecter. Hpds have no charecter. They are frozen, like their faces. l wonder if hpds are terrified of aging, not just because of vanity, but because they remain stuck? l am a great believer in the theories of Erikson and the life stages. l feel that l am not as yet a proper adult and it saddens me that this is so. As for the other points that you made; My public apology was written in part to people who are either no longer living and so will never know how sorry l am, or people whose whereabouts l am unaware of as a lot of time has gone by. Where possible l have tried to make amends with the people l am in contact with today in various ways, even if some of the things l have done been minor, for instance not returning a book l borrowed. l will taqke on board what you suggest. The best way for me to make amends, l think, is to learn from my mistakes and create a new way forward. l a\lso need to make amends to myself, for l have treated myself badly too, in having little regard for my safety or my body or my emotional well being. The poignancy of some of the posts on this site really bring home to me how badly people can hurt.

janey wrote:Had a lightbulb moment!!!! Fate is just an excuse for not taking responsibility.........what an @@@@hole l was, and still am as far as relationships are concerned - hence no relationships for me for a long, long time. l am dangerous. l should carry a warning. Please guys, if you reply to this, don't reassure me that l am okay, or not to be too hard on myself. l have to be hard on myself. l have to feel like a complete s@@t and let that feeling wash all over me till l drown in it if l am ever to feel true remorse. l am a total @@@@ No excuses.

Hey Janey, I agree with AlwaysGrowing in that it IS important to sit with our feelings. When I was at my worst (emotionally) regarding my ex, I found that some of my friends tried to distract me, talk about mundane things and tried to just make me laugh or take my mind off the whole situation. These friends were trying to be helpful, I know, but it didnt help, I wasnt ready for that kind of help. I wanted to mourn, needed to mourn, needed to feel the hurt, the sorrow, the pain. It may sound sadistic but it actually felt GOOD (in both a weird and painful way) to allow myself space to really feel. Part of this was looking at my role and aspects of myself that contributed to the whole scenario. In order to learn and move forward I feel that its important, a neccesity, to stop providing ourselves with justifications, excuses, rationalisations etc and to own our actions and really feel.

janey wrote: l a\lso need to make amends to myself, for l have treated myself badly too, in having little regard for my safety or my body or my emotional well being.

Yes, this is all part of it. At the end of the day , you (Im not meaning specifically YOU)will be left with you and whatever is inside your own head so it would be ideal to feel good and at ease about the you you're left with.- Did that make sense? lol. I guess what I'm getting at is that its important to be your own best friend, know yourself, understand yourself and nurture your inner being, only when you (again, Im not meaning specifically YOU) are centred within yourself can you create equal , meaningful and giving relationships with others. The alternative is not knowing, loving and understanding yourself and attempting to gain this missing 'gap' from/through others.

Just in regards to my thoughts on fate....I truly believe in fate but I think 'fate' or the powers that be lead us to certain experiences and opportunities, most importantly though, it is our free will that determines what we make of these opportunities,how we use them and how we choose to experience them. I have a personal philosophy that if we dont make of opportunities (to learn and develop as human beings) that which was intended, that 'fate' delivers us similar circumstances over and over again untill we learn or understand the lessons/experience that was intended. I guess it is a little of a paralell to the ideas behind reincarnation. lol-this can also be used as a motivation to learn how to be a decent person and for self growth-who wants to be delivered the same $#%^ over and over again?

janey wrote:Have you noticed that the posts on this forum by the partners of histrionics are all, without exception, written by people who seem to be articulate, intelligent and fairly well educated? l used to pick such people as partners as a means of validation. l realise now that l was objectifying these guys, using them almost as accessories, as a means to promote my image. This was not conscious, for l truly believed that l had feelings for them, but they were shallow.

Janey, this reminds me of my HPD guy, when we started dating he made some weird comments that made me think something wasn't right:
at first I thought he was only joking, but later I realized he really meant it:

"I wanna be with you because you make me look good",
"I can't date younger women with crappy jobs who can't take care of themselves",
"I'm awesome, first a lawyer chick, now you (...my job...), my boss is jealous",
"I couldn't date you if you drove this (pointing at one) car",
"I have no brains for math, science etc, I'm stupid, that's why I have you",
"I love you because you're so caring",
"I need my equal or better, not a woman who is worshiping me",
"please post something on my facebook wall so everybody can see",
"I can't wait to show you off at the beach...yay!!!"....etc

It's funny to make jokes like that, but for him these were very valid reasons to be in a relationship....no word about character, heart, deeper feelings or even talents...it was all about the looks and status, and he didn't think there was anything wrong with it? Only later on he started talking a little differently, probably because I told him so...

janey wrote: The "flings" l had, with the not so attractive men, gave me a sense of power. What better narcissistic supply than to have someone in awe of you? l am concerned, as l write this, about the lack of emotion l fellt at the time.

and this is true as well, his flings were not very attractive, nor they were successful, he treated them like crap and couldn't explain why he would suddenly become cold towards these women once he was done (bored) with them...yet he would have so many of them and look for more!

My EX always spoke of fate and "how we where meant to meet" and "fate brought is together" and "destiny, fate brought us together at that time"

she claimed to read lots of books about spirituality but I never saw her read these books, she owned them but never read them

she spoke about children and what to call our children, how we would be happy, dreams she had about us.....list goes on

Janey's post rang true. I think a lot of the fate talk is to do with dodging responsibility after a break up - better to believe it wasn't destined to work out than be faced with fault - probably back to the self-protection thing: the loss stings less if it's a case of 'wasn't meant to be' than 'it could have been had the [HPD] not acted as he/she did'.