HPDs and ignoring them

If an HPD totally devalues you, will they still hate being ignored by you? I ran across my ex-HPD a few days ago. She's dating another guy and is intimate with him (She told me a few months ago!!) She greeted me in an uncharacteristically cheerful way…. “Joe!! Hey!!!” sort of like when you see an old high school chum in the mall. There was definitely a chasm of distance between us – as if she totally devalued me into a pile of doggy doo. I totally ignored her and just walked off. I really have a lot of resentment towards her for some stinky stuff she pulled after we broke it off and was dating the other guy; clearly pulled on my heart strings for her own benefit with NO regard for my feelings – just to get an attention fix from me.

So my question is…. After an HPD devalues you, can ignoring them still drive them crazy?

maverickidaho... thanks for taking time to reply. I'm getting used to the thought now of her and the other guy being intimate. I know in time, she will dutifully display the typical HPD cycles of going from pillar to post and build up a nice resume of bed partners. It's just a little early now. I've acquired a goodly amount of knowledge on HPD over the last year and I feel better equipped to deal with it. I was slow to believe at first but am now coming around to the reality. Just mindful about wasting precious time on this that should be better spent on positive things in my life. I've resigned myself to the fact that there is no going back to a quality relationship (without joint therapy - yes i would be willing), even if the opportunity arises and she wants me back. From what I've read in this forum, that opportunity just might happen when she ditches her current squeeze (He lives 45 minutes away, 2 kids in high school, and they are #1 with him.... she doesn't like that). There are already signs of trouble in paradise. She told me this when I confronted her at a party a few months ago about leading me on to believe she was still interested in me while still going with the other guy!! (I ignored her at the party and she ran to me like a moth to a flame later that night - I blasted her for toying with my feelings)

You should know that I'm aware that ultimately, it's a huge waste of time and energy trying to get even with her and making her feel as crappy as i do. At this point, I have a great desire to "wound" her and compounding that mess that already exists in her mind. To be clear, I don't intend to actively seek her out, but in the event the opportunity presents itself (at a party, function, supermarket, etc.), I want to seize it in hopes of getting back some of my power that I so LOVINGLY entrusted in her and reclaiming my self respect.

So back to my original question.... After an HPD devalues you, can ignoring them still drive them crazy?

I hate hating someone! Harboring resentments is like taking Cyanide and hoping the other person dies...

Ingoring histrionics makes them really mad as they thrive on attention.

That's good to hear. She told me just 3 months ago that "...I have this desire for you to be in my life". So she inadvertently exposed an Achilles Heel. So was I a surrogate father perhaps that she still has a need for? My unwillingness to cave in to her chronic emotional immaturity was something she just couldn't figure out and honestly, I think it turns her on to some degree.

Anyway, I feel compelled to inflict an emotional "wound" upon her by ignoring her - I mean totally - when I run across her - not even acknowledging her presence.

It's my going away present to me!!!! Revenge is a dish best served cold!!! Someone needs to bell this cat. This girl sure missed her trip to the wood shed years ago. She needs to be confronted/reminded about her behavior. She has NO empathy - especially when it comes to my feelings. That's the amazing part - NO EMPATHY. NONE!

Hi Bigangel:
In my experience these people (with HPD characteristics) have very weak Superego's, so don't expect her to feel bad about anything she may have put you through. Lack of empathy also means that she will never be able to see your side of the story, and probably very little of your suffering.

When I met mine she showed me letters from 2 of her X's, neither were as involved as i was with her, but the content of the letters breathed their devastation at the unexpected break up and the circumstances under which they happened. I still don't know why she showed me those letters (in the early days of our relationship), but she did, may be as an indirect warning to me for what was to come, and hell it did, she repeated the exact same tricks on me as she did on them (sugary start, #######5 finish...). Even the photo's we took whilst travelling together, including the circumstances, mimicked her previous relationsips, in terms of types of places (usually dream like and romantic, i.e. on a beach at sunset, you know poor quality film crap...etc). It was all a load of rollocks I sensed what was coming (almost too late...just in the nick) and bailed out by ending the relationship (yes she screamed and wailed and all the dramatics and what not...) under absolutely abominable circumstances. Like I said in my other post all my alarm bells were ringing based on her actions, I kept kidding myself it could not be her, or was just a passing phase, but phrases and actions (often discrete) in our recent past haunted me enough to stop the damage there and then as i knew more would become unmanageable.

Now since all that happened, I know my indifference towards her (which is what i show on the outside not what i feel...) drives her crazy, but only sometimes, those days when she thinks of me or wants to see me (once in a blue moon probably... ), when I am totally not available for her. She admitted to me ages ago about being unable to make clear cuts in past relationships (I believe common with HPD), dragging them on over years. They like to have their "puppets on a string", "shoulder to cry on" lots of "sincerity for a day" type of relationships, and get very upset when that circle of X intimate realtionships no longer respond to their selfish demands for attention. Given their cruel callous treatment of those people (not just lovers, but friends and family too). it is inevitable that they need to go from friendship to friendship, relationship to relationship to fill the "self" that is lacking in their lives. It's because other people send them walking once the sugary surface is scraped off to reveal the pile of human shite underneath.

I am still suffering as you know big angel...but the key (in my opinion) to really not giving them what they want (to destroy you whilst having you as an emotional slave at their disposition) is displaying your inner happiness (even if you hurt inside) and showing complete indifference. You can also threaten a face full of gob if she comes near again...I did, and she is frightened enough since to not approach me in direct ways (she has resorted to occasional discrete little games during those blue moon moments instead). Ignore her

Good luck, Musician

To Bigangel,

Remember, these people are the "Ultimate Attention Whores".
They will do and say anything for attention, period.

Do not actually do anything that could/would be perceived as harrassing/confrontational that she could turn around, and burn you badly with, and then play the victim role. Come and vent here, here you will get support and understanding.

In the real world she is the woman you are the man. You are hurting, hurting badly and rightfully so. You were once intimate with her and because of that she has a whole lot of cards to play if you should confront her, especially in public. She does not like what she hears, throughs a fit, she is now the Victim.

Always, anticipate the worst possible outcome when thinking about actually talking with her!

Take care of yourself! Exercise, exercise! It will help you sleep better, releases those feel good chemicals in the brain. You will begin to feel better about yourself.

Lastly, just leave her alone, period.

Best of Luck,

Ohioguy

Thanks guys... just a bit frazzled now. She is off to Oz with her new guy. Jealous? You bet... but everyday, I replay the tapes and that keeps my head screwed on.... plus everybody that knows her is on the same page >> spoiled brat; shallow; self-centered; it's all about her; it's her way or the highway; puts on a good front... you know the story. But I know from experience, her weak spot is being ignored. Just feel a need to poke my finger in her eye - so to speak. She even admitted to me 2 months ago she has a desire for me to be in her life - while at the same time seeing another guy!! NO EMPATHY!!!!!. Just don't know how effective my ignoring her was since she is in a new relationship. I feel certain she is still attached to me so I take some consolation that my ignoring her got to her. I know - it doesn't matter. No doubt I'm angry, but I think it's a good stepping stone to finding my way out of the woods.

Do not actually do anything that could/would be perceived as harrassing/confrontational that she could turn around, and burn you badly with, and then play the victim role.

Don't worry about that... we actually passed each other on a jogging trail. She gave me a great big "Joe!!! Hey!!!" then she stopped to talk, but I simply said "Hey, XXX" and kept on jogging. At least I had the civility to acknowledge her.

You are hurting, hurting badly and rightfully so.

After she broke it off, she called me and gave me signals that were so clear and strong about reuniting that I took the bait, only to find out she was still seeing another guy. This was especially crappy since I told her in a tender letter 2 months earlier that I wanted to go forward but only after we see a professional - otherwise don't call. She called. NO WAY could she be calling for any other reason - but the real reason was to take advantage of my still raw feelings for her just to satisfy her neediness and attention cravings - and to keep me close. Then she told me she was still seeing the guy. Wow! Never saw that coming. I am a believer now, but boy it hurts to believe.

Always, anticipate the worst possible outcome when thinking about actually talking with her!

She actually lead me on 3 separate times; kissing; walking arm & arm - while at the same time seeing another guy – toying with my emotions… totally insensitive; no regard for my feelings.

On a separate occasion – after I found out she was going on a trip with her new guy – I ran across her and I told her I was so upset I couldn't talk to her. She called me 8 days later and ask me for a password to a computer!! She called twice for it!! Like nothing ever happened. Unbelievable - the total lack of empathy. I was dumb-founded. So was a friend I confided in. He was so mad he almost called her! Jeeeeezzz... that's when I hit the books and started acquiring as muck knowledge as I could about what the HELL was going on. I finally stumbled on the HPD summaries and characteristics and it hit so close to home, it blew me away.

Exercise, exercise!

Ironically, that's what I was doing when the opportunity came for me to ignore her. My heart said to stop and talk, but I listened to my head and ignored her. I really do know it's totally over. My biggest challenge now is to snuff out that last ember of hope for a peaceful life together with her. Yes, I still miss her, but that too will pass.

One thing is for sure: right now, I have the last word (ignoring her) and as you all know, they have to get the last word. I fully expect to hear from her in the next 30 days or so. Hear I go again.... expectations!!

Thanks for your comments....

To Bigangel,

You're welcome.

Keep these thoughts in mind:

If she is a true HPD her pattern will continue to repeat itself over and over for the rest of her life. Sad but true. She will break every boundary of decency known to man.

In relationships she will lie, cheat on the SO, steal, and manipulate anyone, who she targets as being worthy of NS. They target people! People are objects, nothing more nothing less, in an attempt to fill that constant craving for attention/admiration, etc. It's all about Narcissitic Supply. She does have her fan club, have no doubt about that.

Everywhere she goes and anyone she meets she will seek NS from. It is all for her!! She goes from one performance to the next, to the next, and so on, craving NS.

The public walking trail when she approached with big smile and etc.. Was for her and only her, so anyone who was with her or within earshot saw how nice she was to you. Another performance.

When she calls you on the phone, another performance, she knows she still has you. You talk to her. Then with her BFF's, it probably goes somewhat like the following:

(To draw all attention and focus back to her.)

Her: Talked with Joe last night. Heavy sigh!!
BFF's: You saw him?
Her: No! It was on the phone.
BFF's: He called you.
Her: He just can't seem to let go. He still thinks we can get back together. Heavy sigh! I told him, I could still see him still in my life. Heavier sigh!! But, only as friends! I also told him AGAIN. (Done with a look of disdain) I have a new boyfriend, Big smile. And he's Oh Sooo wonderful! I do hope, though, that Joe can move on.(now frown/worried look). Because, it's over between us.
BFF"s: How do you do it. Guy's just seem so enraptured with you?
Her: I dunno! I'm just me! ( Wearing the biggest smile)

What a performance. Two totally different takes on the phone call. Her version of events and yours will be diiferent, much different!

Next time she calls, looking for NS, and, she will! They do break boundaries. Work in the following. Tell her how good she was for your EGO! (Based on how she looks.) Tell her you met someone new. The new girl isn't as pretty as she is (appealling to her HPD vanity. Her thinking, I'm still prettier. I still have him).
We have great conversations. She is very intelligent!
Come to think of it, "You never had much to say for yourself". You're pretty and all. But I require more than that.

OOPs!
I gatta call comin' in!
Gotta go.
See Ya!
Hang Up.

Then never talk to her again!

Do not acknowledge her presence/existence in anyway. If you should see her, when you are out and about, act like a blind man. Put on a performance for YOUR benefit. IGNORE HER!

She is not your friend. Remember, she is not your friend! You are a target for NS, that is all it is.

Again! Best of Luck,

Ohioguy

Thanks again, Ohioguy1002...

If she is a true HPD her pattern will continue to repeat itself over and over for the rest of her life. Sad but true. She will break every boundary of decency known to man.

All the evidence certainly suggests this. I just wish I had an advance preview. This definitely tests your faith. They are so accomplished at creating doubt in you that of course I feel like the bad guy. I know it wasn't about me..... I felt a long time ago (about 4 months in to it) that this wasn't right and should have moved on. Saw the red flags, but hung around anyway - I could fix her (right).

Do not acknowledge her presence/existence in anyway. If you should see her, when you are out and about, act like a blind man. Put on a performance for YOUR benefit. IGNORE HER!

I actually did this at a club event in April. I got within 3 feet of her a couple of times. I ran in to her a week later and she made it a point to say (and I quote), "I didn't like that".. so I know it bugs the crap out of her!!

I have wasted so much time and energy (Vampire!) on this girl over the last year. We technically broke up in NOV 06 (!!) but she just keeps popping up. We sort of run in the same circles. Every time I start to pull it together and not dwell on her, there she is!! I've asked her about 4 times not to call. She told me in DEC 07 that she wouldn't call, txt, email..... broke that boundary too. Looks like a 4-6 week cycle with incredible regularity. Maybe this time is the real deal. It has to stop somewhere. I have bigger fish to fry.

Last 2 episodes, I didn't answer when she called, but she's persistent. In each case, she called again the next day and, of course, I answered. Boy, I could kick myself now!

She does have her fan club, have no doubt about that.

Oh yes.... I've seen it all too often... but let me tell you something.... I've polled a couple of the fan club members privately and it might surprise you to her the negative things that they had to say about her.

Well, thanks again Ohioguy.... onward....

To Bigangel,

You never mentioned how the HPD'ed devalued you!

Actually, the worst situation for A true HPD person is isolation, spending time alone with themselves and with nothing to distract their thoughts, for obvious reasons.

Nothing surprises me anymore with these people. HPD's cannot read body language to save their lives!

The number/members of their "fan" club is only known to them. If she was/is a true HPD there is a tremendous amount of info concerning her personal life you will never know about!

Below is a link to an interesting article on HPD.
It is titled "Dual Diagnosis and the Histrionic Personality Disorder (HPD)". I hope you find it useful!

http://www.schrodingers-cat.org/dd/histrion.htm

Commonly, cluster B's share traits within the personality disordered realm. What other traits did she exhibit? These traits have to be pervasive and pathological in nature.

Pay particular attention to the section where true cluster B's can/will become volatile and intensely angry with others. Also, the section on memory, it is strangely odd, how they cannot remember in detail events that happened an hour ago. Conversely, if a Narcissitic injury of some sort occurred their memories are very long, very long indeed. They may seek revenge of some sort. Another strange fact, HPD's will actually approach those that they fear. Look out if you decide to euphemistically "stick your finger in her eye".

Take Very Good Care of Yourself,

Ohioguy

You never mentioned how the HPD'ed devalued you!

When I passed her on the running trail, just the tone and voice inflection was very strange - very distant - almost too casual and cheerful. It's just a hunch really, but I sensed a great distance between us. She's been trying to get me to be friends for about 8 months now, but as I stated in a letter back then, I just can't be her friend (the way she wants me to) when there's an underlying intimate level. She's dead set on making it "normal" between us and that's what I heard when I last met her. I'll have no part of it, especially when she toyed with my feelings so often with ABSOLUTELY no regard for my feelings. Again a hunch but I thought it was clear from body language and inflection. It was totally new - almost too friendly if you ask me. She was probably unaffected by what I did, BUT one thing I've learned.... they change their colors. You think you can predict them out but they'll respond totally differently in few weeks.

Actually, the worst situation for A true HPD person is isolation, spending time alone with themselves and with nothing to distract their thoughts, for obvious reasons.

Last time we met face to face (before this jogging deal; about 2 months ago), she told me she was ".... lonely, lonely, lonely". Mind you now, she's still dating the other guy.

What other traits did she exhibit?

She was so attractive and sexy. Still is... that's the hard part. She just has this allure that was simply irresistible. She was married at the time I first met her and I have to admit I had a huge crush on her. Very toned and athletic. Charming and flirtatious. She had very immature emotions. She often pouted and relied on guilt trips from time to time. She was very thin-skinned and could not take ANY criticism, constructive or otherwise. She was very self-centered and selfish. Even her friends admitted that to me. She had a very strange sense of time management/cause and effect and was averse to any systematic approach to anything. She talked incessantly and I would drift off. She would get offended when she related a (boring) story to you and you couldn't repeat the smallest details 3 days later.

She had an interesting speech pattern in that she would change the syntax in mid-sentence but didn't tell you or say something like "he" or "she" when she never mentioned anybody prior to that. Or mention "Robert" like you should just know who Robert is. Perplexing for sure. It was as is she had a "private language". After she finished what she was saying, it was so ambiguous with 2 or 3 different possibilities as to what she really meant. "Word Salad" I think is the term. She had an infantile thought pattern - she just came across as shallow and not too bright; she was just stuck in her reality and never showed much interest in learning about mine. Not really curious about my kids, etc. It really was all about her. After 3 years together, she didn't know how old I was and forgot when my birthday was!!

She also had a very flimsy value system with no apparent principles for day-to-day living - a mutual friend saw it the same way.

Also, she laid blame at my feet for why the relationship didn't work and when we had a major flap the year before.

BTW, her fan club never witnessed what I did. Her dramatic episodes; yelling at her son in front of me,etc., etc.

HINDSIGHT...Boy, was I asleep at the wheel. About 2 months into this relationship (6 months after her husband left her), she uttered these words which now resonate in my head everyday: "All I want is for somebody to take care of me". I should have run out of there!

Wow! That article (link) really hits home, especially the following:

>incapacity to pursue personal, professional, cultural, and social values

>they are not particularly effective in understanding how others are feeling

> This view of themselves as less powerful allows these individuals to absolve themselves from responsibility for their own behavior and to engage in manipulative behavior with others to force attention and care-taking

> On the surface, in HPD relationships, there is warmth, energy, and responsiveness. Covertly, this behavior is accompanied by a "secretly disrespectful agenda of forcing delivery of the desired nurturance and love".

> They accept their emotions as evidence of truth rather than just a statement about their current emotional state.

>They hide their true cognitive sterility and emotional poverty

These aspects match up so well to her behavior.

I must say that this forum has helped me shift burden of our failed relationship where it belongs. Sure, I made mistakes - pretty human stuff - but undeserving of what I got in return.

Thanks for everybody's input.