So why are they typically good-looking?

Jeez, why did anyone here post a picture of a woman hahaha, I mean to bring solid proof of beauty. Sorry I was just laughing hard about this style of argumentation.
Reasons why I think a healthy man wouldn't want to have exactly this woman in a relationship or consider her as truly beautiful/sympathic:

This woman looks uncomfortable in the picture. Does not appear to have a warm radiance. The typical "little model smile" is also missing. She has an empty stare, meaning either she doesn't care much about the photoshooting or the reason for the picture itself or she has some sort of psychosis on her own which is more likely. She seems slightly bulimic. A woman with an adorable emission due to her appearence makes a healthy man more happy than perfect skin.

Speaking of perfection (that nobody can reach):

Her jaw as far as it goes in this picture, is slightly deformed if you look closer. Her hair is too thin in my view and her forehead shines, which is not good on a good picture. Her facial bone structure is masculine in my opinion.

There you go a superficial opinion in a superficial world

Yes, in that picture. It looks a little fuzzy on the left side, distorting it.

Hi Crystal, thanks for your insightful post. First of all I would like to clarify I may be a bit different than trophywife, I may have more dependent features, though we both seem to be appeasing style, I don't always brutally discard, in fact tend to form on going attachments, I just have a difficult time being completely pinned down because of past experience, so I probably subconsciously choose men who are not 100 pecent available, whether emotionally or distance. I get what you are saying, about men and women no longer needing one another for practical purposes, unless they have children together. I think having children is still a rational and functional reason to maintain a relationship of mutual respect.

I don't want to be in a position of being entirely dependent upon a man, I find that abhorrent and frankly dangerous, unless you have carefully selected a very kind and responsible man. That doesn't mean though that a man and a woman still couldn't have a partnership of mutual respect and trust based on more equality than assigned gender roles. There are people who do this.

I disagree that the person in question wasn't listening to me did so because I was talking about things I shouldn't be concerned about. What an odd and archaic thing to say! I'm sorry but I find your view here rather anti intellectual, but you are entitled to your opinion. I think it's something more along the lines that I chose a man for the wrong reasons and he similarly did so, which returns to my original point that the pwHPD may seek out (unintentionally) the sort of man who will objectify her, who will constantly compliment her looks or sexiness, because the HPD may have the idea ingrained into her this is the best or most fulfilling form of attention, though in extreme cases it's actually possibly harmful. Trophywife and I agreed that just telling us to dress down is comically simplistic. A "hot chick" often genuinely may have attractive physical features naturally, a curvier figure or prettier face, but I think the the real issue is the smoldering sense of seduction that the HPD projects. This seductive or sensual nature has very little to do with looks or cosmetic/fashion effort. And again, there's the catch 22 where the pwHPD may start to feel insecure in some way or not quite right if they are not getting a certain TYPE of attention, that unfortunately objectifying sort of attention.

That's why it's a personality disorder. Even if I'm self aware enough now not to type exaggerated vague sentences half in all caps on line, and can analyze my relationship to men, and am now a little more capable of real intimacy instead of "audience only or ewwww" ...that doesn't change what I have been subconsciously attracted to, or what might trigger me to start showing more obvious symptoms.

It's a process. I do get your point though about men and women in society no longer respecting one another in the same way, but then again, I'm not sure going backwards is the answer. There may be a third way that is not old fashioned and is not based on romance and sexual objectification.

-- Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:11 pm --

Marmotini wrote:Hi Crystal, thanks for your insightful post. First of all I would like to clarify I may be a bit different than trophywife, I may have more dependent features, though we both seem to be appeasing style, I don't always brutally discard, in fact tend to form on going attachments, I just have a difficult time being completely pinned down because of past experience, so I probably subconsciously choose men who are not 100 pecent available, whether emotionally or distance. I get what you are saying, about men and women no longer needing one another for practical purposes, unless they have children together. I think having children is still a rational and functional reason to maintain a relationship of mutual respect.

I don't want to be in a position of being entirely dependent upon a man, I find that abhorrent and frankly dangerous, unless you have carefully selected a very kind and responsible man. That doesn't mean though that a man and a woman still couldn't have a partnership of mutual respect and trust based on more equality than assigned gender roles. There are people who do this.

I disagree that the person in question wasn't listening to me did so because I was talking about things I shouldn't be concerned about. What an odd and archaic thing to say! I'm sorry but I find your view here rather anti intellectual, but you are entitled to your opinion. I think it's something more along the lines that I chose a man for the wrong reasons and he similarly did so, which returns to my original point that the pwHPD may seek out (unintentionally) the sort of man who will objectify her, who will constantly compliment her looks or sexiness, because the HPD may have the idea ingrained into her this is the best or most fulfilling form of attention, though in extreme cases it's actually possibly harmful. Trophywife and I agreed that just telling us to dress down is comically simplistic. A "hot chick" often genuinely may have attractive physical features naturally, a curvier figure or prettier face, but I think the the real issue is the smoldering sense of seduction that the HPD projects. This seductive or sensual nature has very little to do with looks or cosmetic/fashion effort. And again, there's the catch 22 where the pwHPD may start to feel insecure in some way or not quite right if they are not getting a certain TYPE of attention, that unfortunately objectifying sort of attention.

That's why it's a personality disorder. Even if I'm self aware enough now not to type exaggerated vague sentences half in ALL CAPS online, and can analyze my relationship to men, and am now a little more capable of real intimacy instead of "audience only or ewwww" ...that doesn't change what I have been subconsciously attracted to, or what might trigger me to start showing more obvious symptoms.

It's a process. I do get your point though about men and women in society no longer respecting one another in the same way, but then again, I'm not sure going backwards is the answer. There may be a third way that is not old fashioned and is not based on romance and sexual objectification.

-- Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:11 pm --

Marmotini wrote:Hi Crystal, thanks for your insightful post. First of all I would like to clarify I may be a bit different than trophywife, I may have more dependent features, though we both seem to be appeasing style, I don't always brutally discard, in fact tend to form on going attachments, I just have a difficult time being completely pinned down because of past experience, so I probably subconsciously choose men who are not 100 pecent available, whether emotionally or distance. I get what you are saying, about men and women no longer needing one another for practical purposes, unless they have children together. I think having children is still a rational and functional reason to maintain a relationship of mutual respect.

I don't want to be in a position of being entirely dependent upon a man, I find that abhorrent and frankly dangerous, unless you have carefully selected a very kind and responsible man. That doesn't mean though that a man and a woman still couldn't have a partnership of mutual respect and trust based on more equality than assigned gender roles. There are people who do this.

I disagree that the person in question wasn't listening to me did so because I was talking about things I shouldn't be concerned about. What an odd and archaic thing to say! I'm sorry but I find your view here rather anti intellectual, but you are entitled to your opinion. I think it's something more along the lines that I chose a man for the wrong reasons and he similarly did so, which returns to my original point that the pwHPD may seek out (unintentionally) the sort of man who will objectify her, who will constantly compliment her looks or sexiness, because the HPD may have the idea ingrained into her this is the best or most fulfilling form of attention, though in extreme cases it's actually possibly harmful. Trophywife and I agreed that just telling us to dress down is comically simplistic. A "hot chick" often genuinely may have attractive physical features naturally, a curvier figure or prettier face, but I think the the real issue is the smoldering sense of seduction that the HPD projects. This seductive or sensual nature has very little to do with looks or cosmetic/fashion effort. And again, there's the catch 22 where the pwHPD may start to feel insecure in some way or not quite right if they are not getting a certain TYPE of attention, that unfortunately objectifying sort of attention.

That's why it's a personality disorder. Even if I'm self aware enough now not to type exaggerated vague sentences half in ALL CAPS online, and can analyze my relationship to men, and am now a little more capable of real intimacy instead of "audience only or ewwww" ...that doesn't change what I have been subconsciously attracted to, or what might trigger me to start showing more obvious symptoms.

It's a process. I do get your point though about men and women in society no longer respecting one another in the same way, but then again, I'm not sure going backwards is the answer. There may be a third way that is not old fashioned and is not based on romance and sexual objectification.

Sorry about the above, I was just trying to edit details for clarity. Oops.

Marmotini wrote:but I think the the real issue is the smoldering sense of seduction that the HPD projects. This seductive or sensual nature has very little to do with looks or cosmetic/fashion effort. And again, there's the catch 22 where the pwHPD may start to feel insecure in some way or not quite right if they are not getting a certain TYPE of attention, that unfortunately objectifying sort of attention.

but it's not enough.

no matter how smolderingly seductive you act, even unconsciously, if your appearance is mediocre you won't attract disorderly/disruptive levels of attention.

of course it is driven by insecurity. PDs are not choices per se they are emotion disorders. I know because I have one.

But my point is HPD is not the unwilling victim of good looks and others' reactions this thread makes them out to be. the HPD started off insecure and chose to capitalize on their good looks which led to a subsequent dependency on good looks to partly solve that problem. they could have addressed it differently, or just remained insecure like countless other women and accepted that.

Hello All.. It has been a while for me since I have last posted. We have had this discussion on more than one occasion back when "the old gang" were all here.

I have often contemplated on WHY we (hpd natured) are typically considered above average in the looks department. I have two sisters that are in their own birthright considered attractive but neither of them have whatever it is that I have that naturally has driven men to like me and stand out amongst many women even those that dress to impress or buy fancy purses and shoes in which I do not.

This has been this way for me since I was about 7th grade. Boys...and later men... had a natural attraction to me that I did not understand at the time. I was different than most of the other girls and although I had a lot of fun with my friends, I did not act the "giddy good girl" type even when I was a "good girl".

One of my sisters has used many means to attract men. She is not as pretty as I am nor has she ever been. She has some more attractive features I believe such as thicker hair and an athletic body, but she did not draw men to her by nature. She dresses...to this day... very skimpy and sexual and meets men online.. mostly weaker men that she can control for a bit of time until they all figure out she ACTS completely narcissistic with a touch of HPD(though I'm not diagnosing her, just pointing out her behavior is such.) Her ability to sleep with many men has now been enhanced by the internet as opposed to how she was in high school. Sadly, she was the one that guys would go to after they took their girlfriends home and use for a one night thing.

In her mind, she was getting even with the girlfriends for snubbing her, but she had no idea they type of damage she was doing to herself and of course getting pregnant at a very young age. She is aging now, and claims on her facebook page that she is "very happy" in her age and etc etc... but she has been married and divorced three times and keeps getting engaged to different men she meets on the internet. It's all flowers and butterflies until she shows her true self to them. Once she does that, they are dumbfounded that she is the girl they "fell in love with". She transforms herself to what she thinks they want. Then... she drops the hammer like Thor when she doesn't get her way.

I never had problems with boys or men wanting to be "the guy in my life" and many suitors that I did hurt in the process of finding my true self. I did dress slightly more provocative in my teen years, but nothing like what my sister did to gain even half the attention that I had on my own with normal clothes. At the time I did not understand what it was or why because I would think, my friends are prettier, why am I the one that the boys would come up to. My friends and family all would comment on me being a heart breaker, but I honestly did not see myself as such.

After much changes and deep reflection I regret some of the decisions that I made based on what I was given in the looks department. The "burden" so to speak of having many options was that I could not make a choice at all. I could picture myself in each scenario with each suitor and was always afraid to settle down with just one because "what if my life would be missing something if I did?" My relationships were short lived (at my doings) and no one could measure up to my standard of what I thought they should be. After a few weeks in a relationship, I would dismiss them due to some indiscretion they would reveal and there would be my "OUT" and I would mostly try to bow out gracefully and remain their friend, but of course we all know that is not possible when one party wants more than the other.

My parents are small by nature. My father probably could have been in Hollywood if he had pursued that avenue. He was very attractive and the James Dean rebel of his hometown. My mother has a few attractive features but was very plain and mediocre. She pursued my father because he was the rebel and unattainable. She basically just refused to take no for an answer. My father viewed her as a pest and was not attracted to her, but then realized she was someone he could use. And somehow they ended up married and hated each other for it.

I have my fathers looks over all the other siblings. I am very humble about it (although I am tellin you all on here for reflection purposes) and I assure you I do not ever dress provocatively or TRY to stand out, but I still do stand out. Even twenty years almost past my teen years. No one at first meeting believes my age when I tell them. Now that I am older and wiser I know what my looks are capable of getting me, yet I never use that. I think it is ill thinking to get anything based on things other than merit. I have earned the place I am at in my career based on hard work and effort.

There is probably no reasonable explanation for WHY the HPD is considered above average in looks except for the fact that as someone stated above, that someone less than average looks could not get by with what many HPDs get by with because no one is considering them "the prize" as they do with HPD women. There IS something different about us. Even those of us who have changed their ways over time due to maturity and experience. There are others who still live in that toddler mind... you do as I say or I throw a fit and punish you. The reason most guys stick around is because of what they saw in us in the beginning. Maybe they were so drawn to our looks they decided to ignore those redflag warnings, and still always hope that we will finally see the light and treat them how they want to be treated.

I have said this many times on this board. No matter why the reason we became the way we did, EVERYONE HAS THE CHOICE to be how we want. You can either give in to this... diagnosis... or CHOOSE to do something about it. This took me many years to get to that point to finally see WHY I had so many problems in relationships in the past, but after being married a couple of decades and a few kids under my belt, I realized that only I can change what I do. You can't lean on a DX to tell you HOW YOU ARE.

You can't help how attractive you are or that people are attracted to you, but you can help not to encourage it by using what you have for ill gain. And by ill gain, I mean anything other than what is right. ALL or most HPD dx are considered ABOVE average attractiveness, but ALL attractive people are NOT HPD. So if the attractive people that are not HPD can succeed in life, then so can we. We just have to model our behavior after the right kind of life. And RIGHT kind of life you can say is a matter of opinion, but the RIGHT WAY is .... not to do harm to others. If you are using anything to your advantage that leaves a mass of destruction behind you, that is certainly not the right way.

Scarlett

Hey Scarlett,

Scarlett1939 wrote:...Now that I am older and wiser I know what my looks are capable of getting me, yet I never use that. I think it is ill thinking to get anything based on things other than merit. I have earned the place I am at in my career based on hard work and effort.

Always a pleasure to read your posts

so you're saying if you wore no make-up and skipped the hair guys would still flock to you?

i think your need to feel special is distorting your self-perception.

also the HPD doesn't just attract anyone, it is a particular kind of guy that shares their insecurity.

the HPD has something that attracts certain guys and keeps them. that doesn't say anything about their overall attractiveness.

Crystal. ...
I assure you the need to feel special is long past. I do not do things to attract attention. I fix my hair and makeup for work or an outing of course but I have also gone places with very little effort and when I thought I was most rugged and fully covered and clothed with hoodie and all and some have still come up to me to address me. As for the kind of guys they are. ..I didn't stick around enough to find out. I am fully happy in my marriage. I do not need outside validation to know what is. I'm sorry you misunderstood my post. If you ever go back and read my posts from years ago you will remember most of my shortcomings I fell into were before I was married. It wasn't though until I found this board that I realized WHY I did those things. I still try to make sure to keep things in check. I know who I am and I do not need to justify myself to anyone. I only post on occasion to help anyone that it may.

You can't change the symptomatic things about hpd because you don't like the fact we are in the "above average looks" it is what it is. If you don't believe it then that is of course your opinion. But the professional doctor opinion is that we are. But had our families not been so screwed up we might not have developed the tendencies we did.

Either way...you are entitled to your opinion and I have no ill will against anyone here on this board. If you met me in person you would not believe I am looking for attention or validation of any sort. I'm just being honest here of my experiences.

Best of luck to you Crystal.
Scarlett

Thank you xdude....

Things sure are different on here now. Don't really see much of the ones that used to be here. I hope that is a good thing. I only get to check in on occasion. I've changed employers in last few years and graduated and will graduate a couple of my kids. Its a busy and good life for me but bittersweet that my kids are growing up.

But the best part about it is....there are absolutely zero symptoms in my kids that they are flawed or disordered. With the help of my husband over twenty plus years helped me make changes for the better in me so that it did not trickle down into my kids. They are sweet and pure and unscathed. That has been my utmost goal to keep them good and on the right path and to give them a fair start in this big cruel world.

The fruits of our labor have paid off. Only a few more years til the last one leaves the nest and then my husband and I wi have OUR time. It's been a fun and wild ride raising our kids and sometimes tough but it has been worth it.

Take care. .
Scarlett