Empathy costs you nothing.

A few thoughts.

I really don't know if empathy is entirely natural. It seems that to some degree we are taught to stop, consider others feelings, and I have no problem with that personally. Quite the opposite, I'd rather live in a world where people are aware of each other, at least some degree.

To me empathy has two parts. Being able to stop, consider how someone else would feel if we were in their shoes, plus also to have a sense of concern, to value their feelings, at least to a degree. Enough of a concern to act, even if the act is not to add to their hurt.

It's strange because we might have learned that empathy means to 'feel bad' for others, but there is no reason why empathy cannot also include feeling happier, positive, etc., when others feel that way.

Is there a cost? I suppose so. There is a risk that we might put someone else' feelings before our own, or just find it tiring to consider their feelings. It took me a long time to learn that empathy can go too far. That you can end up putting your own wants/feelings as 2nd place, and that's not right either. Imbalance indeed.

Is there a benefit? I think so. I really would rather live in a world with people who treat each other more or less how they want to be treated, and without empathy often what happens is people take what they want in the moment, even if they'd feel it unfair if the situation was reversed.

xdude wrote:A few thoughts.

I really don't know if empathy is entirely natural. It seems that to some degree we are taught to stop, consider others feelings, and I have no problem with that personally. Quite the opposite, I'd rather live in a world where people are aware of each other, at least some degree.

To me empathy has two parts. Being able to stop, consider how someone else would feel if we were in their shoes, plus also to have a sense of concern, to value their feelings, at least to a degree. Enough of a concern to act, even if the act is not to add to their hurt.

It's strange because we might have learned that empathy means to 'feel bad' for others, but there is no reason why empathy cannot also include feeling happier, positive, etc., when others feel that way.

Is there a cost? I suppose so. There is a risk that we might put someone else' feelings before our own, or just find it tiring to consider their feelings. It took me a long time to learn that empathy can go too far. That you can end up putting your own wants/feelings as 2nd place, and that's not right either. Imbalance indeed.

Is there a benefit? I think so. I really would rather live in a world with people who treat each other more or less how they want to be treated, and without empathy often what happens is people take what they want in the moment, even if they'd feel it unfair if the situation was reversed.

i agree that empathy is in part learned. however i also think that it IS a natural part of us as well. an evolutionary measure that ensured that humans could work well together.

however that said i personally think that empathy is akin to weakness. being able to feel others pain makes it hard for you to inflict it when necessary, and can cause a person to be easy to manipulate and use.

Icarus wrote:i agree that empathy is in part learned. however i also think that it IS a natural part of us as well. an evolutionary measure that ensured that humans could work well together.

My personal view as well.

1. in my pov empathy is mostly natural - just watch kids sharing their toys and feeling bad after hitting someone ...

2. I'm dx an avoidant - although xdude gave this great idea of a shy narc which fits me better but anyway, I have tons of empathy - however when I am in my narc mode I have less empathy and if I'm in my hpd mode I just don't care cos I want the attention on my childish antics

3. Despite being very empathetic I always check if I am not being taken advantage of / for granted - it happens always and this checking drives me nuts

I don't understand what is the reason for my checking - any ideas?

blank identity wrote:

InSpiritus wrote:BlankIdentity, it's that sensitivity that is so beautiful to me. It showed in your anger in your earlier posts, but how you dealt with it, made my blood boil...so that is on me.

What posts are you talking about?

Long time back...I rage when I see blindness, and the blood lust rises. Sadistic I can be, but you are helping me, and I hope I am not harming you. That is the best I can do, but I do not enjoy your pain. I am not that sort of filth. When I choose to inflict pain, there is a reason. There is not pleasure in it.

Is there a benefit? I think so.

Agreed. So long as it does not blind a person.

however that said i personally think that empathy is akin to weakness. being able to feel others pain makes it hard for you to inflict it when necessary, and can cause a person to be easy to manipulate and use.

It's both. A strength in which one can also hone in on to inflict maximum damage should you choose to.

I think empathy comes naturally to those who receive it in childhood.

otherwise it can be 'muted' or impaired or disturbed in some way.

the naturalness of empathy is evident in young children. some will cry by the mere sight of other children crying.

adults usually learn to contain this sort of unrestrained empathic response, continuing to feel empathy but developing more restrained and adaptive responses, perhaps in light of cultural norms.

it is said that some people with BPD never develop beyond empathy in young childhood, and as a result can experience intense empathy for another, and inappropriate responses because they can't control the resultant emotions.

this might be viewed as a 'cost' but it's contingent upon the level of empathy. so level of empathy must be taken into account, not simply empathy or no empathy.

is mature/adult empathy costly? in some situations probably, moreso in individualistic competitive situations or societies (like ours)

so i think its costs and benefits are heavily context dependent. lack of empathy is synonymous with detachment so without empathy you can't share a real connection with a person, or experience deep and rewarding relationships in that way.

lack of empathy might make doing certain jobs easier, or make you better at them, and it may allow you to avoid some emotional pain others go through, although you will also miss out on emotional joys through social connection as well, including with your potential future children.

so in individualistic, competitive societies it might mean gain in some situations, loss in others, in terms of experiencing all there is to experience in life. in other societies it might be purely detrimental, if give and take and fair play is the name of the game, which it tends to be in more collectivist or interdependent societies/communities.

there is also the extra mental effort that must go into coming up with appropriate empathic responses where one lacks empathy naturally. so even where it's ultimately advantageous maybe, it still takes some kind of cognitive compensation to mimic appropriate empathic responses the expectation of which is generally universal, even in societies such as ours across most situations.

running does,'t cost annything nether but i still get tired from it and after about 40 k i need a break from it

madjoe wrote:running does,'t cost annything nether but i still get tired from it and after about 40 k i need a break from it

lol at first I interpreted this as "the HPD running away from his/her problems" and 40k in divorce expenses, because that's exactly what she did to me. She got exactly what she wanted, it didn't cost her a dime, and ultimately landed her a big chunk of our retirement savings along with a fat ongoing paycheck. Sucks for the kids, but I didn't pull the plug so they have no one else to blame but her. The fact that empathy doesn't exist and/or can be simulated was a hard lesson I had to learn about cluster B people. At the very least it made future potential marriages way less attractive.

Tell me about it...

Affective empathy is barely there, but you know when your partner is hurting or the r/s is going to hell, but still potentially salvageable. Enter cognitive, which is beyond exhausting and utterly pointless anyways.

Bail.

So...does it cost you? Yes/ No. Depends where you choose to focus it. If it's a one way dead end?
No thank you. Good bye.

ridingthewtfbus wrote:

madjoe wrote:running does,'t cost annything nether but i still get tired from it and after about 40 k i need a break from it

lol at first I interpreted this as "the HPD running away from his/her problems" and 40k in divorce expenses, because that's exactly what she did to me. She got exactly what she wanted, it didn't cost her a dime, and ultimately landed her a big chunk of our retirement savings along with a fat ongoing paycheck. Sucks for the kids, but I didn't pull the plug so they have no one else to blame but her. The fact that empathy doesn't exist and/or can be simulated was a hard lesson I had to learn about cluster B people. At the very least it made future potential marriages way less attractive.

i don't have empathy i can fake it but i get nothing from it so i get tired of it that's what i ment
(running is my hobby i get a nice endophine and testosterne boost from that)