Homosexuality and cluster B disorders

by **creative_nothing** » Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:59 pm

@blank identity

Thanks for the repply. But my criticism is toward the words sexually seductive. You can seduce people to many different goals and different ways. You can even combine, to seduce someone "sexually" in order to solicit help. You can also do it throught flattery alone. You can also seduce someone by pretending to be rich in order to have sex. Or you can seduce someone elicit empathy for gaining access to a place.

Also I dont think sexually seductive is the same as physically seductive, that is not the same as beauty. A woman with a great face and beautiful smile can make people do what she wants without resorting to physical or sexualy seduction.

seducing:

1. to lead astray, as from duty, rectitude, or the like; corrupt.

2. to persuade or induce to have sexual intercourse.

3. to lead or draw away, as from principles, faith, or allegiance:
He was seduced by the prospect of gain.

4. to win over; attract; entice:
a supermarket seducing customers with special sales.

The same criticism I have between ASPD and Dissocial, with the word criminal and conduct disorders.

I ve looked there.
http://apps.who.int/classifications/icd ... /en#/F60.4

True, but I think it's generally different words to describe the same thing. But I don't know, I think I'm starting to become a fan of the ICD. I like their classifications better.

Like #6 could be construed for "uses physical appearance to draw attention to self" I think. It's all in the wording.

But I still don't like that they don't have NPD listed as its own disorder.

by **creative_nothing** » Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:25 pm

blank identity wrote:True, but I think it's generally different words to describe the same thing. But I don't know, I think I'm starting to become a fan of the ICD. I like their classifications better.

Like #6 could be construed for "uses physical appearance to draw attention to self" I think. It's all in the wording.

But I still don't like that they don't have NPD listed as its own disorder.

I also miss passive-agressive and even sadistic from DSM-III R.

You can use other specifics at ICD. But the truth is that still today NPD is poorly defined. I think ICD is more conservative and DSM more innovative.

Now NPD theory itself divides in overt narcissism and covert narcissism. I think they are different enough from each other to have at least two different diagnosis. The NPD of DSM captures the overt only. But I think the covert is akin to passive-agressive and BPD.

Also at ICD the dissocial criteria is not focused on juvenil delinquency(conduct disorder is a must at DSM) so the most overt cases of NPD could be captured by it. Also borderline is split in two, and I think cases of hypersensitive narcissism could be capture by it.

by **xdude** » Tue Aug 19, 2014 5:26 pm

It seems that the general point of the last few posts is that sexual (vs other types) of seduction is a means to an ends, and that more generally what is observable is 'seductive' behavior. For someone else another form of seduction could serve the same ends, and that the criteria has been updated to reflect this idea.

I suppose the general idea behind the word seduction is that it has something to do with having something someone else wants, and using that to try to influence them. So for example if you have a lot of money you could potentially try to influence someone else by implying or offering money in exchange for something else (e.g., try to persuade them to do something they might not normally agree to; for attention; for approval; etc.). Perhaps the notion of 'sexual' seduction (versus other forms) just was in the forefront of the original authors minds because it's a form that a high percentage of their patients seemed to engage in?

by **creative_nothing** » Tue Aug 19, 2014 5:31 pm

xdude wrote:Perhaps the notion of 'sexual' seduction (versus other forms) just was in the forefront of the original authors minds because it's a form that a high percentage of their patients seemed to engage in?

Problably. But that is why I think DSM's criteria a little vulgar compared to ICD's criteria.

I mean they are intended to professional use, so why making it vulgar?

Homosexuality and cluster B disorders

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