Support for Non-Histrionic Personality Disorder

I agree, the treatment of the child is quite hard to watch, but she is also so incredibly spoilt that it makes it hard to feel sorry for the child sometimes. She is a very rude, spoilt brat. But not spoilt with love and affection and caring. Spoilt with material things. And money. Sorry that this triggered some negative feelings in you HPDVictim.

Everyday this woman shows more and more of her HPD. That it is scary how long people have just let her be this way. As I mentioned before, there is construction going on here. It is quite close to my house. Today the excavator hit a huge planter we have with my boyfriends beloved pepper garden in it. Totally destroyed it. It's not a big deal…we don't intend on living here much longer, but I told my boss about it. Her face was blank. NO emotion. She just said 'oh. I'm sure he can make another one'. So far the construction has effected my life and the way I live. But not anybody else here. It has shown me really how selfish she is as a person.

I've noticed that my bosses relationship with her daughter looks like it has improved. My boss has what she always wanted from her daughter… a friend. They now have things in common. They are both very spoilt 'ladies of leisure'. Her daughter is now beginning to enjoy material things and thats great for my boss. They can boast and giggle about how great life is when you don't have to pay for anything or work for anything! She has began to discard me. Which is great. I don't get off on material things and I don't have a ton of money.

My boyfriend will find out some big news in January about his job which may force me into a 'no communication' zone with her…I HOPE. Sometimes I wonder what she will do without me….but I know….she will replace me.

D xx

DaisyChain18 wrote:I agree, the treatment of the child is quite hard to watch, but she is also so incredibly spoilt that it makes it hard to feel sorry for the child sometimes.

A bit of background since I don't know if you read other threads.

Most people that come here do so because of a failed romantic relationship, or a potential one, with a Cluster B personality disordered person. That said, I know, first-hand and from reading that Cluster B's do far more damage than to such adults. Almost everyone around them suffers.

Those Cluster B's that have children often scar/damage them for life. Children can't reason/understand as an adult can nor can they leave ("escape") their parents until old enough. In short they're captive victims. I don't believe that is discussed or recognized enough.

I don't know this girls status. Perhaps she's permanently damaged perhaps she's fine. Whatever the case I'm sure she's had a lot to cope with over her 16 years.

DaisyChain18 wrote:Sorry that this triggered some negative feelings in you HPDVictim.

Thanks but not your fault. Plus, unlike a Cluster B, it's not all about me.

DaisyChain18 wrote:It has shown me really how selfish she is as a person.

I've said this before but technically I don't think they're "selfish". Yes to them it's all about "me" but IMO they don't see others as fully real so...

DaisyChain18 wrote:My boss has what she always wanted from her daughter… a friend.

From my research that can happen until the child attracts more attention and/or brings home romantic interests. I've read that Cluster B moms can try and "steal" their daughters boyfriends etc.

So, the inevitable has happened. (sorry for this jumbled mess)

Last week I was informed by my bosses husband that she is having an affair. He asked me not to tell her I know about it and I haven't told anybody. When I first received the news i was shaking. I was so mad with her. She has such a lovely life! How could she sabotage it! I had noticed (as i previously mentioned) that she had been quieter around me and I hardly ever saw her. Well now I know why.

The more I look back it all starts to add up. Last week she went christmas shopping, she was all dressed up and asked me more than once how she looked…I also noticed her take a make up bag with her…she never even wears makeup! Thats the day I found out.

According to her husband, she has been thinking of leaving him since June. She feels like he is never around and never there for her (he works in the city…but he works at home 2 times a week). She told him that the new man had anxiety problems like she did and that they were going to help heal each other. When he tried to warn her that she actually shouldn't be with a man who has anxiety and she needs to see a specialist she said no. She then told him that they had not slept together yet… But said that it was bound to happen. Within the space of a week of telling him this, she then declared that she had called it all off because she feared his wife would find out and would attack them all. We don't believe that it is actually over though.

What I can't get my head around is how uncaring she is about it all!!! She doesn't seem sad, or guilty or down about it at all. Yesterday it was revealed to me by her husband that she had in fact got a secret cellphone. He told me about her past relationships and that they had all ended like this. She just stopped caring about her partner and said…seeya! She has been like this with her friends before that I have witnessed. Her husband is devastated (God knows why). He has vowed to fight for their marriage… and has told her to choose. He's asked me to interject the mail because he wants to find evidence of a second cell phone bill. I know you go through different stage of grief and i feel like he has gone through the 'sad' part and now he's getting to the 'mad' part.

Today she was happy as a clam, putting in effort to make sure christmas is a good one. It makes me suspicious. It makes me wonder if she is just trying to move on, or if she is trying to make it so good that when she ups and leaves in the new year we won't feel as bad… They argue a lot, she refuses to sleep in the same room as him. She needs her space. She blames him for her anxiety. She has totally abandoned her daughter.

I mentioned to her husband that I just couldn't believe how 'chill' she was about it all. I know it is effecting her though inside, Her ability to concentrate has reduced. She can't finish sentences. She will be mid-sentence and drift off and just stare blankly at the wall. She doesn't want to talk. I try and make small talk and she just ignores me like i haven't spoken. I think she talks to herself a lot in her head. She still continues to walk around 'shrugging' to herself in her own answer to questions she is asking herself in her head.

I don't know who the other man is. I have been put in such a difficult position. Which her husband has apologized for…i think he actually thought i knew about it… He told me my job was secure and not to worry. But it feels almost unfair. On the day I found out about this, she was off with her 'lover' and i was picking up the slack, I feel like she's lying to me and doesn't care that this will effect my career. I think she won't want me to find out because she knows it will give me the power to just leave her. I think she has a hold on her husband but not me. I want to yell at her. She is an ungrateful spoilt woman! I hope this other man is worth it. I actually have even less respect for her if thats possible. I think its more because of the way she has gone about this. Instead of being upfront and honest, she's being sneaky. She's trying to take us all down with her. She wants her cake and to eat it too.

As I mentioned before, she is having a new house built on the property which she has declared she will move into. I hope her husband kicks her out. I haven't told a soul and i don't intend to ruin christmas. My boyfriend already dislikes her and this is how his parents split up with his mom cheating on his dad so i'm keeping it under wraps for now.

I stil don't believe it all, i go through and check my txts and emails everyday re-reading what her husband sent to me. I've managed to keep it together around her. Actually more than i expected to. I think i just don't want to believe it.

I think the worst thing is that i actually think she is going to get away with this! I think her husband is going to stay with her, she is going to continue living this lavish lifestyle with no consequences just how her daughter lives too! Never having to have any responsibilities or having to admit what she has done is wrong. She doesn't even seen remorseful. Her husband has said that too…that she has manipulated it into him feeling like its all his fault.

D xx

DaisyChain18 wrote:Last week I was informed by my bosses husband that she is having an affair.

I'm shocked!, shocked!, that gambling, um I mean cheating, is going on in here!
[In my best Captain Renault voice ]

DaisyChain18 wrote:She then told him that they had not slept together yet….

We don't believe that it is actually over though.

*Holds up his 5 Pinocchio's scorecard*

DaisyChain18 wrote:What I can't get my head around is how uncaring she is about it all!!!

IMO you really need to read about HPD more. Much of this is typical.

DaisyChain18 wrote:Yesterday it was revealed to me by her husband that she had in fact got a secret cellphone.

A "burner phone" no doubt.

My P-doc think my Mother is HPD. She seems to be. '

If I have a cold-she has the flu
If I do something intellect wise, she tells me she has a genius IQ
If I have male attention, she tells me about the men that courted her.

I thought she was NPD. But maybe HPD fits better.

I am new to PsychForum. This is my first post. Hope I chose the right place.

After writing for a while I've decided to break this into multiple posts that reflect the stages of my HPD experience. It would be way too long for one post otherwise. Each stage I describe will reflect what I consider to be the major periods of this rollercoaster ride.
____________________________________________________________________________________

I feel like I have read every post of every thread related to HPD trying to figure out what happened to me in the span of 3 months. What I have discovered is that my experience is typical of those who get involved with a pwHPD. Of course, I am not aware of any formal diagnosis. I went NC after realizing she was jerking me around as one of her potential fan club members.
_____________________________________________________________________________________

My story...let me begin by saying I am a middle-aged married man, professional, physically fit, educated, and I have had my share of success in life...meaning I think I'm fairly well adjusted and able to relate to most people and understand where they are coming from. All of this was turned on its head by my experience with this pwHPD. She is 46 years old, has 2 grown children, is divorced 10 years (which she told me in the very first flirtatious encounter described below), likes to go to rock concerts and travel...despite complaining constantly that she has no money for anything due to her low paying job. I found out later how she "funds" these activities. I should add that she is drop-dead gorgeous with a fantastic body (at least at first glance) and captivating smile.

We met briefly when I was at her workplace representing my company. She was overly flirtatious and I was flattered by it. However, I immediately noticed how shallow, childlike, and uninhibited the flirtations were (both her and my coworkers witnessed it) but I disregarded these red flags.

Two weeks later I decided to make contact via email which was met by an enthusiastic response of how happy she was that I had made the effort to contact her. One thing I noted was there were several grammatical errors in the email. Not that I'm perfect, but these were errors like using the wrong tense of a verb. Not your classic fat finger type error. Anyhow, I chose to look past these as well. Then she sent me her phone number in the next email. Kinda made me curious that she would share her personal number so quickly with someone she had just met.

Texting started out awkward. I asked her to tell me something about herself and she responded with "tell me something about you." I asked what she wanted to know and she said "anything." Ok...I thought, I'll start with some basic 'get to know ya' stuff. We made a little progress but every reply was basically her version of what I shared...I went to college here...she says I went to college there. (I believe this is called mirroring.) Mixed in were little compliments about how good looking she thought I was, which was nice to hear, but they weren't exactly in the flow of conversation. So, I thought, if this is where she wants the conversation to go, I'll go there. I started complimenting her and what I had noticed about her. Things seemed to liven up a bit in the conversation at that point. I starting using the little devil emogee when I would say something suggestive and she would reply with the angel emogee. At on point she highlighted this as if to imply she was very innocent. I learned later this was not the case.

Late on Friday evening she alluded to the fact that I was married because she had seen my wedding ring. I asked her if this would be a problem for her and she replied, "I'm good if you're good." (I would find out later this was her pattern...go after successful married guys because they typically like the attention, had money to spend, and couldn't be too demanding on her time. She basically told me as much through a series of text messages and during the second of the two times we were together.) The above all occurred over a two day period, Thursday-Friday.

On Saturday I saw I had the opportunity to talk on the phone so I asked if she could talk. She said yes and I called. We continued some of the banter from our text conversation and she told me that I was special because she usually didn't talk on the phone to guys. I thought this was strange considering she was single but figured "whatever." Didn't really register that what she was telling me is that she manages her fan club via text which doesn't tie her up like a phone call does. Texting also allows her to control the pace of the conversation and simply disengage when she has something or someone more important to do and then return to it if she chooses. Sometimes I noticed she would simply drop out of the conversation, ignore whatever the last text was and resume the conversation at some other point. I should also add that I spoke to her on the phone once more and we NEVER spoke on the phone again throughout the 3-month period this occurred.

After a couple more days of texting I said I would like to spend some time together. She immediately responded with dates she was available and that she would gladly meet me halfway. (We live 3 hours apart.) I thought this was an indication of her level of interest in a relationship. I found out later that it was more an indication of how quickly she wanted to secure a new source of admiration, sexual supply, and potential financial support. We agreed to meet about a week later on a Tuesday. Throughout the course of the next few days the texts became less frequent sometimes going hours or overnight without a response to a simple question. I also asked for another phone call which was met...two hours later...with a "sorry, can't" reply. This became frustrating and confusing so I decided that over the next weekend I would just back off and see how interested she was. After not hearing from her from Friday night through Sunday, I decided to check in and see if we were still on for Tuesday. She replied very enthusiastically that "Of course, we are" as if I was silly to think otherwise. I thought, "cool", glad that's settled...and then didn't hear another word from her. I realize in hindsight that she was most likely "entertaining" another fan club member during this period.

On Monday I got a text saying she wasn't sure if she could make Tuesday due to her boss being ill, which meant she might have to fill in for her. I thought, here we go again, but decided to give her the benefit of the doubt, and said, "ok, just let me know." She replied that she would and I never heard another word until I got a text Tuesday morning stating..."I haven't heard much from you over the last few days and I was wondering if we're still meeting." I thought, WTF...I had already made up my mind to not meet up with her because she had not confirmed whether or not she had to work so I replied with a very forceful text stating the same. She came back with something like, "Oh, well, ok then, guess I just learned something" as if to imply that I had done something wrong. Again in hindsight I recognize this as projection...making it seem as if her behavior is actually coming from me. This would turn out to be one of her main coping mechanisms.

I was NC for a few days and then I thought (still not realizing I wasn't dealing with a rational person), I don't want to be a jerk and there seemed to be something there. So, on Friday, I sent a text and offered an apology for being so abrupt about our Tuesday meeting saying I was just disappointed over the whole thing and hoped she wouldn't feel too bad toward me. Didn't hear a word and then the following week on my birthday got a Happy Birthday text. This got me back on the rollercoaster. (If I had only had the sense to not get back on, life would have been so much better.) The texting started again and turned sexual very quickly. Within a couple of days we were essentially in a sexting relationship with everything being about what we wanted to do to one another. She actively and enthusiastically participated in these conversations. When another meeting was mentioned she quickly responded with available dates and one was set for the following week.

Same pattern as before started...texts became less frequent over the next several days and remained very shallow...even sexting was almost non-existent. The weekend followed the same routine with virtually no communications from Friday through Sunday. (Again, in hindsight I recognize she was probably doing fan club maintenance or adding new members.) Still thinking I was special and that she was just an innocent woman who wanted to meet a decent man I committed to getting through this phase thinking surely it would get better once we had a chance to spend time together. I (wrongly) assumed either we would like each other and want to spend more time together or we wouldn't and we would just end it amicably.

On Thursday before our Friday meeting I texted Good Morning and got an immediately reply - Just landed in Chicago. Huh? I thought. So, I asked how long she would be there. She came back with, I'll be home tonight...and I'm looking forward to seeing you tomorrow. I thought, ok, so she didnt' forget about our meeting. So, I ask, what takes you to Chicago. Her reply, just meeting a friend for a short Christmas visit. This is coming from a woman who regularly talks about having no money. Another red flag goes up and I start paying attention this time. She's obviously gone to see a man who paid for her flight and she's going up to spend the day with him before seeing me on Friday. Now I have all sorts of warning signals going off but I suppress them telling myself that I can just have some fun but not get emotionally involved and then we can go our separate ways. Boy...was I wrong!

There was a little texting Thursday night and Friday morning as if I was the only man in her life. She couldn't wait to see me. We finally meet in a city halfway between us on Friday morning and immediately kiss and hug like we've been dating for weeks or months. We head to a museum where we can walk around and talk. She doesn't want to wear her jacket from the truck to the museum even thought it is extremely cold, which at the time I thought was rather strange. (I realize later a bulky jacket would take away from her ability to show off her body...and do what she had planned.) As we walk around the largely empty museum we hold hands and touch and she moves seductively in front of me allowing our bodies to touch in strategic places. Sensing my arousal she starts exploring with her hands and then starts whispering what she wants to do to me right there in the museum. At first, I just write it off as more flirting...then I realize she's serious. This all happened within the first hour of our Friday "date". She continues to persuade me to give in to her and I finally do taking a huge risk of being caught, which, in hindsight, would have had enormous devastating consequences. I mention that we should go someplace private and she agrees. However, once we're back in the truck and headed someplace private she mentions she's hungry and needs to eat before we go anywhere else. I agreed and over the course of lunch she begins to say maybe we shouldn't "go all the way" because she's afraid she'll never see me again. I'm ok with this because I'm thinking we've got something good going and I fully intend to see her again. I WAS SUCH A FOOL! After lunch we spent more time talking in the truck (very shallow conversation I might add) and engaging in more sexual activity. Again, I'm thinking this is incredible...a gorgeous woman who is sexually adventurous...it doesn't get any better. Of course, I was so infatuated that I'd forgotten about her texting/phone habits, shallowness, visit to Chicago, etc.

We went our separate ways late in the afternoon with lots of promises to see each other again soon. I did notice that during our goodbyes I began to see a little of the "histrionic stare" I've read about. I realize now that she had no emotional investment in our day together and she was already moving on mentally to whatever or whoever she was going to do that night or that weekend.

This is the end of the first stage - days 1-46. I was totally "in" at this point and had no clue what I'd gotten myself into.

Stage two - days 47-71: She tells me she is spending a week with a "friend" in Florida over the holidays. I call her on her lies and have huge red flags but give in to her insistence that it's innocent. I also commit to planning a trip for us which is stage 3.

Stage three - days 72-76: Our trip - The truth is exposed but my mind is also f'd up due to her histrionics. Even though I could see what was happening and knew the truth of her behavior and lifestyle, I had no way to process it and had no reference point for it. I thought I was prepared for anything but I was caught off guard by how dramatic it actually was.

Stage four - days 77-91: Post trip. More of the same. Mind games.

Stage five - days 92 - present: No contact. Discovering HPD and recovering.

More to come.

Thanks,

FreeMind

Before I jump into Stage 2, there are a few observations of Stage 1 that I'd like to bring out.

-In the first round of texts, when asked about her family, she described her dad as a "sperm donor" that she never sees and has never been a part of her life since abandoning the family when she was around 4 years old.

-She describes her mother as having a Rosanne Barr like personality, very loud and obnoxious. She also says her mom has very large t*ts (her words) that she uses to get attention and her mom gets angry if anyone suggests she consider breast reduction.

-She told me about her divorce after 18 years of marriage. She said her husband got up one morning, stood by the side of the bed, and told her everything she had ever been suspicious about with regard to him was true (implying he had been cheating on her and lying about it). Then she said he calmly went to work and they pursued a divorce. In hindsight, I believe this was an HPD lie and she was projecting. Although I can't prove it, I'm guessing she was the one who had been cheating all those years and he had finally had enough. She also said she's the best ex-wife ever because she didn't demand anything and just let him keep everything - including her in-home tanning bed that she used every day. I believe this part as it supports one of the classic HPD indicators of wanting to always be attractive.

-She described herself as being much more liberal with their two kids before and after their divorce while her husband was the much more conservative church-going type. I believe she was trying to say this was a positive thing because it appeared to make her more popular with the kids. However, she was very short on details when it came to describing the impact on her kids.

-Early on in talking to her she said the roles had almost reversed with her and her kids. She said her son and daughter acted more like her parents telling her what she should and shouldn't do. She said she often acted "dorky" and loved to just "goof around" with her kids and have a good time.

-She told me about a great number of trips she had been on - LA, Vegas, NYC, Chicago, (all several times) and numerous others and emphasized that she loved to fly. I believe she had actually gone all these places and she used them to indicate to me that this was the way to spend time with her. As I mentioned in my first post, I believe this is her "thing" and she uses sex to lure men in and then keeps them with promises of more sex when she travels with them. Of course, the men pay for everything because she "has no money" as she repeated at some point in nearly every text conversation. I remember thinking, "this sounds a lot like prostitution to me" but I just kept rolling with it.

So, all of the above is revealed during Stage 1 and there are many red flags. None of this sounded very normal or even plausible to an average person, and yet, I still thought she was just a woman who had had some rough times but was doing the best she could in life. Again, I WAS A FOOL who was thinking with the wrong head.

Now, Stage two...

So I would like to make an addition to this thread. I'm curious on people's take. About 20 years ago, when I was in my last year of college, I met the most beautiful girl I had ever known. I went up to her and tried to get to know her and even went out on some dates. But something wasn't right. She would often blow hot and cold. Sometimes friendly, sometimes she would completely ignore me. She had her fan club and often I was invited to do things with them. Despite my best efforts to make a connection, all I got was games. Baiting me to go places and then, when I got there, I was faced with strangeness. Mother looked at me as if she would kill me. "Girlfriend" talked to me telling me at the time that all sex with men was rape (lesbian feminist). All the while, she would mysteriously disappear. I could go on for hours.

Anyway, I got fed up and stopped playing the game. The final straw was a strange interaction in a foreign country where she became overtly sexual and then shut down when I reached for her. I must have triggered her. For me, it was the last thing I was going to tolerate. I had experienced enough. So after 12 hours of the silent treatment from her I told her I was outta here since she wouldn't engage.

I had always wondered about the strangeness but never really gave it much thought when I was young. I had too many other things to worry about and attend to. But in the back of my mind I had always wondered about it. One thing led to another and I started to look into it... nearly 20 years later. I discovered NPD and HPD and I think it answers a lot.

But just a couple years ago, before I knew about this, I reached out to her in an email just to talk. Of course I was curious about her perceptions of the time and I wanted to apologize for losing my temper with her.... But of course.... more strangeness

Many people cyber stalking Linkedin page. She friends me on Linked in and then doesn't respond. Views my page but doesn't respond. I interpreted it as baiting behavior. Like by reaching out to me she is trying to get me to reach out again... and since she has probably smeared me as a crazy, stalker, whatever, I just said forget it and did nothing going forward. I don't want to give her any more ammunition.

I'll wrap it up by saying that if I'm right, I'm glad that I took a stand and did what I did. This forum has answered the greatest relationship mystery I've ever had. Although I always questioned my authentic reactions wondering if I was too harsh or emotional, I think I've determined that some people just don't have noble intentions and you have to trust your intuition.

Hi I'm new. My psychiatrist told me my mother has HPD, so I researched and well BINGO.
Fortnight ago I dared to question my mothers behaviour and told her everyone commented.
Hell hath no fury like an HPD criticised.
I'm being attacked so manipulatively I'm struggling really really badly to keep it together.
I have complex PTSD, depression anxiety an eating disorder and chronic pain. I'm 43.
She destroyed my sense of self, I block difficult emotions, I'm in therapy for PTSD.
So now she's the victim apparently. Not ringing me on my birthday hurt her more than me apparently! Sent me a cheque in the mail for my birthday. Silly me I banked it. Of course it had been cancelled.
My dad hasn't spoken to me on 2 weeks she's convinced him again that I'm to blame.
Sigh.
I think I need to break all contact. Not sure how? Any suggestions? I want to tell her she has HPD but it will infuriate her. I want to tell my dad too
She does not believe she has done anything wrong. She flirts with my teenage stepsons and she literally gropes my husband. Gross, embarrassing, creepy. I'm so filled with anger I need some support so I don't take it out on myself. Anyone else feel this much anger?
Thanks for listening and any advice welcomed. Megsie

itsmegsie wrote:Hi I'm new. My psychiatrist told me my mother has HPD, so I researched and well BINGO.
Fortnight ago I dared to question my mothers behaviour and told her everyone commented.
Hell hath no fury like an HPD criticised.
I'm being attacked so manipulatively I'm struggling really really badly to keep it together.
I have complex PTSD, depression anxiety an eating disorder and chronic pain. I'm 43.
She destroyed my sense of self, I block difficult emotions, I'm in therapy for PTSD.
So now she's the victim apparently. Not ringing me on my birthday hurt her more than me apparently! Sent me a cheque in the mail for my birthday. Silly me I banked it. Of course it had been cancelled.
My dad hasn't spoken to me on 2 weeks she's convinced him again that I'm to blame.
Sigh.
I think I need to break all contact. Not sure how? Any suggestions? I want to tell her she has HPD but it will infuriate her. I want to tell my dad too
She does not believe she has done anything wrong. She flirts with my teenage stepsons and she literally gropes my husband. Gross, embarrassing, creepy. I'm so filled with anger I need some support so I don't take it out on myself. Anyone else feel this much anger?
Thanks for listening and any advice welcomed. Megsie

Hey Megsie,

I can relate with the urge of saying they are "HPD/BPD/whatever". Indeed, the underlying goal behind this is to "make them see" how much their thoughts/behaviours hurt us deeply!
Unfortunately, that is going to - very likely - backfire. More precisely, their thoughts/behaviours are so rigid that they rarely realize there's something wrong in them which constantly causes dramas, fights, etc..

So, I think that the best thing to do is to go to a therapist and ask for the best "course of action" to follow; they have experience when it comes to handling these kind of personalities.

It is also useful to acquire as much knowledge as possible about the disorder, so you can understand how they work and the damages they inflict on us; to this end, you may be interested in reading these documents:

http://maretwebproject.com/users/docs/histrionic.pdf
http://www.universitypsychiatry.com/cli ... _PICPs.pdf

A hug!