Previous Front Now a Child, Apparently???

ArbreMonde wrote:I would not advise to just leave alters alone by themselves. I would rather advise to check what they need and how much of this. Some need more time than others to build a sense of safety in the here and now. But they all need to be cared for and grounded into the here and now.

Seeking triggering memories is a bad idea but there is a difference between seeking the traumatic memory and building a feeling a of safety.

That is what I was talking about. Not leaving Jayce alone, just not trying to get him to confront things. Being there for him and responding to his needs, versus trying to get him to confront things he may not be able to confront. So yes, I would entirely agree with you.

ArbreMonde wrote:I do not like the expression "autistic savant sense". It comes from an ableists perspective that the normal state of autism is to be dumb and cognitively impaired. The truth is, autism has nothing to do with IQ and you can have any IQ while being autistic. People with an IQ > 130 and autism at the same time are common. Having a good memory while being autistic is just, normal. Moreover, us autistics tend to be traumatized more often - and trauma keeps vivid and very detailed memories of the events. The link between "good memory of trauma" and "autism" is made through the sensitivity to trauma as a whole, not through autism in itself. Also what makes the "savant" part of autism is the autistic ability to hyperfocus on niche "savant" subjects. It is almost a derogatory way of saying "okay you know all about the genetics of cats but you're autistic and disabled in every other aspect of your life, remember that, you're no better than anyone" which comes from the allistic/neurotypical social behavior of always trying to one-up each-other. Because that's one of the main differences between autistic and non-autistic brains: autistic brains are specialized for information treatment (yay science!) while allistic/non-autistic brains are specialized for social interactions (yay social drama! subtexts! thinking with your emotions!)

I can only surmise you are talking about a part of modern popular culture I am unaware of. I don't really get the reference, though.

I am not talking about IQ in any way. I am talking about a trick memory thing which, according to the peer reviewed literature I have read, occurs in more than half of autistics, IIRC. A part of it is, as you say, hyperfocus and normal learning. That's not all there is to it, though. At least, not in all cases.

Take my memory. I can remember, well, technically not everything, but one whole hell of a lot more of it than the vast majority of other people. I can remember almost back to birth. I can remember learning about object permanence, learning how to speak, and more. But, more than that, well, I am pretty sure that most people can think of a rock, all by itself, for example. Just sitting there and not doing anything.

I can't. If I think of, say, a rock, I get every file I have in my memory on the subject of rocks opened at the same time. I become aware of the various igneous or sedimentary processes that formed the rock. I get stories of how the rock could have come from the natural world into my possession. A few at first, then a flood. It see angles and break patterns on the surface and see the impacts that shattered the larger rock that once existed. Then I see that larger rock. The information unfolds rapidly, and I am left with the urge to scream from the sheer overload of it.

It is this way for me for every #$%@ thing I look at, every moment of my life. I live in a world of verb phrases without solitary nouns. I am drowning in memories. My head is full of noise. Every moment. Even when I dream.

Even absent every issue from my past, this drives me mad. Dealing with it is one of the major challenges of my life. Because of this, simply existing passively hurts.

(And believe me, the intersection between this kind of memory and a traumatic past is NOT FUN.)

There are benefits to this, though. If I can focus through the chaos, I get all the information I possess about a thing at once. And that makes me VERY good at certain science things. And it leaves me capable of certain odd feats of memory that can be beneficial in a number of ways.

Another science article I read and wish I could remember suggested that structural differences in autistic brains seem to suggest that many are optimized for one type of memory storage over the type most people's are optimized for. Thus, odd abilities of the sort once called savant-like. And odd deficiencies at the same time.

JayceSystem wrote:

ViTheta wrote:I've had to go through a similar process. We have six Littles ranging from Age 3 to Age 12 and a further three Middles (Teens) who range from Age 13 to 16. For the most part, they don't come out right now because we can't be alone enough for them to be comfortable doing so except fairly late at night

I am sorry for them. At least they have late at night.

Has this process helped them work through stuff? Or is it more of a maintenance thing?

-Lily

It has made healing slow and sometimes difficult.

I will say that healing is draining and tiring, especially for someone on the autism spectrum. Autistic peope can feel emotions to a greater degree than non-autistic people and it can be overwhelming.

Vi

ArbreMonde wrote:For the wolf, it is similar but the observed change is different. It sounds to me that as a whole, you tend to see black wolves as symbolizing something scary and fierce and violent while grey wolves symbolize more the "gentle giant", tame and caring and protective side of wolves.

I am sure the first of those comes primarily from The Neverending Story. I loved the movie as a kid, and identified with both Bastian and Atreyu very much. And one of the primary villains of the movie was G'mork, a wolf with black fur. I think the young Wolf took his self image from that: powerful, dangerous, capable of handling violence, something that everyone is afraid of.

Whereas numerous T-shirts, black velvet paintings, and those tiny mirrors they used to give out at carnivals as prizes have drilled it into our heads that noble, spiritual wolves are gray-furred. No doubt where the current self image has its roots.

Bobby had 'savant-skills' ..I say 'had' in the past because we have had now had several strokes -- body is now 54 and we've had one big one, a TIA and a couple of 'mini/silent strokes in areas of the brain not used for major functioning - (movement, speech etc) which has damaged some memory area's and yes even Bobby's amazing memory have been affected!

None of us others have memory before the age of 7, We believe Bobby had but they rarely blend and when they do they are always blended with their changeling that can block access to other alters of Bobby's memories. Phoenix (a changeling, so called due to their ability to rebirth themself to become something/someone completely different) also assisted our child host (LS) to 'passively exist' whilst blocking Bobby from the front so we could appear to 'becoming 'normal' (we had a lot of medical procedures and 'therapy' for the first 7 years of life) at the same time allowing Bobby to secretly remain in existence.

I have to say I did not know the definition of a changeling was related to children been spirited away by the fairies etc until I read ArbreMonde's link, but Teen S remembers being told we were like 'a little Pixie' (especially in a reference to a photo of us when we were about 2 also blond haired and blue eyes) and phrases used like 'away with the fairies' and 'in her own world' etc...I wonder now if Bobby overheard once .someone (maybe grandparents) reference the changelings or heard a fairytale about them..and thats where our 'changelings came from'? None of us (older ones) can remember that far back now so as someone who was previously an insider...the changelings have always been there. (there's a whole tribe of them in our inner world not just one)

For us the experience of 'going inside' is like....you know the movie 'Avatar'? (first one where guy is in wheelchair..our physical body is too so we can relate to this) they go lie down in the ..erm thing....like sliding into an MRI ?... and get connected then in the program he's a Na'vi who can run and jump about and do anything ...we have separate inner bodies like that too and can see a whole different world in there. ..of course ours has been there for years before James Cameron came up with the film! ... but we had never seen our inner world depicted in real world terms like that until that movie..so were fascinated (and somewhat obsessed) by it when it first came out! ..that maybe why practically all of us love video games too. ..I mention this because oddly the inner world is still as detailed as it always was despite memory problems affecting memories in the outside world and the host fronting in it!

Kit

TheTriForce wrote:Bobby had 'savant-skills' ..I say 'had' in the past because we have had now had several strokes -- body is now 54 and we've had one big one, a TIA and a couple of 'mini/silent strokes in areas of the brain not used for major functioning - (movement, speech etc) which has damaged some memory area's and yes even Bobby's amazing memory have been affected!

I wish I had something more useful to say than "I'm sorry." You're dealing with a lot.

It sounds like your inner world is like a memory palace. It's an old 19th century technique where users build up a rich, detailed inner world that maps directly to various areas of their memory. That way they can have greater recall by exploring the memory palace through a process of association. Like that, your inner world is maybe so deeply rooted in who you are, and your memories, that it's unchanging.

JayceSystem wrote:
It sounds like your inner world is like a memory palace. It's an old 19th century technique where users build up a rich, detailed inner world that maps directly to various areas of their memory. That way they can have greater recall by exploring the memory palace through a process of association. Like that, your inner world is maybe so deeply rooted in who you are, and your memories, that it's unchanging.

Never thought of it like that! Did see it on 'Sherlock' (with Benedict Cumberbatch) where it showed a visual representation of him searching through his 'memory palace' to piece things together. yes, maybe thats why we managed to find each other again and re-establish communication? The external host lost connection and 'lost her map' of the inside initially but we have managed to get back communication with the entire system. There's still some memory issues...a few of us are bad with judging passing time ...so I can't remember how long ago it was now! Sometimes I might think something happened a few months ago or last year and then find it was something like 6 years ago!

Our brain seems to have managed to hold onto the past, maybe because like you said the 'memory palace' was working back then and locked everything in....getting new events to move from short term to long term memory has been harder but I think its coming back now. We're getting better at organising ourselves to use our limited energy better.

Kit

I loved Sherlock! They did a great job at making Doyle's stories new while still keeping the feel of them! And the main actors had excellent chemistry together.

ArbreMonde wrote:

JayceSystem wrote:

Eliseahorse wrote:id personaly advise you leave well Alone

I take the advice seriously and will follow it, though it opposes my natural inclinations on the matter. I fear that leaving trauma merely repressed will mean it is not only never healed, but that we will forever be subject to flashbacks and such. Especially because we have an unusual memory, in the autistic savant sense. I doubt, whatever the amnesia trick is, that it will hold out forever against that. Sooner or later, memories come to find us.

But, then, it's not as black and white as I'm making it out to be, is it? It's not like his repression and leaving well enough alone is all there is to it. He suffers flashbacks and such still. Those memories already leak out, just at a rate slow enough that he can bear it. And, as you observe, it is my job now to be the parental figure he never had, and help him deal with those memories when they happen, and to let it go when he forgets again. Maybe in that way, slowly, I can help him heal.

I would not advise to just leave alters alone by themselves.

Thats not what that phrase means. I have never advocated abandoning alters. I guess there's been a misunderstanding due to us all being from different cultures.

To "leave well alone" is to sit by some ones side while they cry and just be present. You don't ask questions you certainly don't offer solutions you just are present and wait for them to tell you what they need.

Could just be that English phrasing is slightly different. To leave something well alone sounds more like you mean to leave something strictly alone, to leave it entirely alone, to the American ear.

We say "leave well enough alone." In America, the phrase means something like "don't go up to a sleeping bear and kick it in the nuts."

I got what you meant, though!

Thanks for the clarifications, Eliseahorse!