Delusion of separateness and trance logic (CW)

Hi everyone !

As it's kind of an issue in the french DID community*, I was thinking of writing something about the delusion of separateness for my website, just to make sure there's at least food for thoughts for those who want to hear something else than the common tone... but I find almost nothing about it.

Searching for articles and into my books, I finally ended up where I thought I would, and I'm now looking into trance logic.

I was wondering if you guys had any resources related to those topics to share with me ? Books I might not have yet, scientific articles, even blog articles if they have solid sources ; I just want to make sure I'm not missing something.

Thank you <3


*Officially, there's no issue, as the few who don't think "we don't feel like parts, so we're really separate people" know better than directly confront people who think this, but as some of those people are highly visible and are now used as references for DID every time it's mentioned on french social medias... and they use this belief as a basis to say books written by Van Der Hart, Nijenhuis, Steele and Boon are b*llsh*it, and all they, the so-called "professionals", want is to force people with DID to be "normal"... *sigh*

trance logic is a topic that has been on our list to blog about for years now. it IS difficult to find good stuff about it. It gets really difficult if you exclude van der Hart, Steele and Nijenhuis from the list of possible sources!
basically, trance logic is mentioned as trance logic in Coping with trauma-related dissociation.
We know that in a small booklet by Colin Ross called treatment of dissociative identity disorder most of the interventions he shows are aimed at dissolving trance logic. he doesn't go into the details of it though.
it is best explained in The Haunted Self, hidden in the chapters about personalization and presentification, which explain how parts lack information and therefore can only see a small part of life, and only be parts of a whole.
Nijenhuis gets into greater detail in The Trinity of Trauma. That one goes incredibly deep into showing the pattern of dissociation, how action systems are split between parts, how these separated action systems result in the characteristics of parts and how these characteristics lead to a rejection of the other parts as 'me'. the whole concept of the trinity of trauma (ignorance, fragility, control) explains the delusion of separateness pretty well. it is at the core of structural dissociation. it will be hard to bring realization to people with a disorder marked by non-realization.
we recently blogged about action systems, in case you are looking for info on that. I find the concept pretty convincing. not all parts have access to all action systems, therefore they are not complete personalities. if they had access they would be integrated and not have DID.

Thank you a lot !

trance logic is a topic that has been on our list to blog about for years now. it IS difficult to find good stuff about it.

I've got few scientific articles which seems to mention it, but I still have to read them. If I find anything interesting, I'll let you know !

basically, trance logic is mentioned as trance logic in Coping with trauma-related dissociation.

And it might have been translated in french into something with no relation to the original term, because I can't find it and I don't remember it being mentioned... I guess I'll have to read it all again and pay more attention.

it is best explained in The Haunted Self, hidden in the chapters about personalization and presentification, which explain how parts lack information and therefore can only see a small part of life, and only be parts of a whole.

I'm currently reading it, I'll pay attention to this, thank you !

Nijenhuis gets into greater detail in The Trinity of Trauma. That one goes incredibly deep into showing the pattern of dissociation, how action systems are split between parts, how these separated action systems result in the characteristics of parts and how these characteristics lead to a rejection of the other parts as 'me'. the whole concept of the trinity of trauma (ignorance, fragility, control) explains the delusion of separateness pretty well. it is at the core of structural dissociation. it will be hard to bring realization to people with a disorder marked by non-realization.

This one is on my list of books to buy. I'll keep it in mind !

we recently blogged about action systems, in case you are looking for info on that. I find the concept pretty convincing. not all parts have access to all action systems, therefore they are not complete personalities. if they had access they would be integrated and not have DID.

Yes, I saw it, and it's on my list of articles I need to read

So many things to read, and not enough hours in a day

So many things to read, and not enough hours in a day

I know! Bothers me to no end.

we just finished the first book on the trinity of trauma recently. beware, it reads like an encyclopedia. the first part is about trauma, the second about dissociation. you can skip the whole first part. chapter 13 and 16 would make the most sense to read. the whole book is wildly nerdy

I checked coping with trauma-related dissociation and didn't find it there. I know it is mentioned in at least one place because that is where we first learned the word and then googled the meaning. it wasn't explained properly.
I checked Treating trauma-related dissociation, it looks so similar on the inside, and the chapters about working with parts mention trance logic a lot more often, especially 16 and 17
hope that narrows it down a bit

did you find any more interesting things?
we typed a blog post, more about the practical meaning.
still waiting to release it in case we learn anything we need to add...

I'm currently reading the articles I've gathered.

I found a brief mention of it in those articles :
- Richard A. Chefetz M.D. (2000) Disorder in the Therapist's View of the Self:
Working with the Person with Dissociative Identity Disorder, Psychoanalytic Inquiry

- Simeon, Daphne & Loewenstein, Richard. (2009). Dissociative Disorders.



There's a paragraph about delusion of separateness in those :
- Chefetz, R. A. (2017). Issues in consultation for treatments with distressed activated abuser/protector self-states in dissociative identity disorder.

- Loewenstein, R.J. (2020). Firebug! Dissociative Identity Disorder? Malingering? Or …? An Intensive Case Study of an Arsonist


The others I've checked so far only mention it without really explaining what it is. I also find interesting that most articles see the delusion of separateness as something extreme (the "alters will not die if the body dies" belief) and don't mention less extreme forms (the "alters are totally different persons" belief). Or maybe I don't understand/I've missed something ?...

There's also those I still have to read and seem interesting :
- Beshai JA. (2004). Toward a phenomenology of trance logic in posttraumatic stress disorder.

- Öztürk & Şar. (2016). Formation and Functions of Alter Personalities in Dissociative Identity Disorder: A Theoretical and Clinical Elaboration

- Karen H. Eiblmayr. (1980). Examination of the phenomenon of trance logic using objective measurement and limiting the hypnotist/subject relationship measurement and limiting the hypnotist/subject relationship