Fading out?

Feeling a bit stupid/vulnerable asking this, and not sure if I can explain well enough anyway.

But I have been wondering about my DID diagnosis and seeming lack of supposed amnesia which constantly plagues me as “proof I am making this up”.
I know I get “amnesia of amnesia” which is interesting in itself.

But the last few days I was wondering about something else...
I am starting consider that I am not around as much as I think I am.
I mean I wonder if I am “fading out”. I mean what if “my” continuity of thought continues, yet I am no longer in charge of the body or aware of the world. Then I drift back. Does that make sense?
Anyone else identify with this as part of their DID or is it just normal for a distracted absent minded person?
Are other parts doing the doing while I “go away” to think things through? I mean the outside job still gets done, whatever I was doing (working, driving, talking), I have always just figured I was doing stuff by “remote control” when it happens.
Thanks for reading.

Violet (1) was originally convinced she didn't have any amnesia, but journalling has revealled a lot of things she didn't know / wasn't aware of.

When we have the sort of switch with full amnesia and stuff, she frequently doesn't realize it's happened.

Like, she documented one a while back, where it was Monday afternoon and she was working. Doing normal routine work stuff, getting through her to-do list. Then a courier came to pick up the box she had ready to go, and as he left he wished her a good weekend...

She looked at the calendar, and it was Friday morning. She then realized she didn't remember calling the courier, or preparing the box, or any of the intervening time. It went smoothly / seamlessly from routine monday-afternoon work, to routine friday-morning work. No sudden 'waking up' or anything.

In that instance, I was present for the wednesday / thursday / friday morning. We don't know what happened on the tuesday, it's a mystery lol.

but to outside observers, there'd be nothing unusual. 'we' acted normally for the whole week. Just subjectively from her point of view, she lost nearly 4 full days. I suppose from her point of view she could think of it as the body acting on 'remote control' or whatever, but it wasn't. I was there for most of it, and presumably some other part was there for the one day neither of us know about.

-V2

We use to think we don't black out as well. I still don't know how much I do actually, but I'm learning. I live in an institution, in a youth home and every night we roughly go thru the day, where was I doing what and when, and I don't remember it all. It's easier to notice stuff is missing, when actually doing a lot, so you realize what you've missed and others know you did, but if you are like depressed a lot and just laying on your bed, you don't know if you've missed half an hour or not.

I also used to co-front with other part without realizing anything. I was accused flirting with men when I certainly wasn't. And I didn't miss a thing what was happening, I remembered every second. Later on I found The guilty one, that's how he calls himself. He remembers same situations, but differently. I didn't loose any time, things I didn't notice were just little expressions on our face, or actually not knowing why I checked my phone just then, coz it's NORMAL to check your phone. Well, it was because he realized someone had noticed him walking, and he stopped for letting him look at him. Just pretending that was for checking out if someone had contacted us. I used to think I lived with very perverted adults back then always seeing things in me, that weren't there. I was very upset when I found out they were right.

I also used to be asked a lot do I remember what just happened, and I thought it was just to check, and I said yes, coz I really didn't know what I should remember. There's no point in asking that if not telling what the thing you ask about was, like that I've been acting strange. You can't know what you don't know, otherwise you'd know it.

And if the thing is, you actually don't black out at all, then you maybe don't have DID. It doesn't mean you are making things up. You can have an OSDD 1b -system or something.

I don't know where you live, but where I live there doesn't have to be long black outs or alters with completely different lifestyle not knowing about each other to have DID diagnosis. Your alters don't have to be so different from another that anyone else than you would even notice them.

I think there's an easy way to check if you are just making up things. This is just my thing, nothing diagnostic, but if you are just daydreaming about other people in your head, you can decide what they think. If you can't decide, it's not just imagination.

I feel like that happens to me. I'll be having a conversation with someone and the person will ask me about something I said and I'll have no recollection of saying it, but they assure me I did. I also have a bad habit of constantly thinking about past memories that bother me, so I wonder when I do have moments I don't remember fully if the memories were altered to keep me from worrying about it until something triggers the memory. My family also tells me that I zone out a lot, which I used to do a lot when I was younger, but I wonder how often I do it now since it's become so common to me that I don't really notice it.

PlanetIcarus wrote:I think there's an easy way to check if you are just making up things. This is just my thing, nothing diagnostic, but if you are just daydreaming about other people in your head, you can decide what they think. If you can't decide, it's not just imagination.

That's a good way to check! Our rule-of-thumb was if we can get in an argument with someone, then they're not just our imagination lol. Not that we're actively trying to argue with insiders, but that's how V1 learned she was separate from our previous host, and separate from me lol.

Violarules wrote:My family also tells me that I zone out a lot, which I used to do a lot when I was younger, but I wonder how often I do it now since it's become so common to me that I don't really notice it.

This reminded someone inside, they just told me. In highschool, one of our nicknames was 'space cadet'. Because we spaced-out like all. the. time.

-V2

VioletFlux wrote:

Violarules wrote:My family also tells me that I zone out a lot, which I used to do a lot when I was younger, but I wonder how often I do it now since it's become so common to me that I don't really notice it.

This reminded someone inside, they just told me. In highschool, one of our nicknames was 'space cadet'. Because we spaced-out like all. the. time.

-V2

Yeah I used to get called that too as well as my teachers telling my parents that I didn't follow directions in class because I'd miss bits and pieces of what they said.

PlanetIcarus wrote: And if the thing is, you actually don't black out at all, then you maybe don't have DID. It doesn't mean you are making things up. You can have an OSDD 1b -system or something.

I don't know where you live, but where I live there doesn't have to be long black outs or alters with completely different lifestyle not knowing about each other to have DID diagnosis. Your alters don't have to be so different from another that anyone else than you would even notice them.

This is expressed so well! Thank you, Aleksi!! And it's the same definition no matter where you live.

Also, your alters don't have to be so different from one another that you notice them! Mine were hidden from me for years and years, and I can't believe now how these people have been in here helping everything run smoothly (from the outside) for years and years.

the Gang

TheGangsAllHere wrote:
Also, your alters don't have to be so different from one another that you notice them! Mine were hidden from me for years and years, and I can't believe now how these people have been in here helping everything run smoothly (from the outside) for years and years.

the Gang

There is also many different kind of switching and co-fronting with or without noticing it. That's the biggest difference between me (Boy) and Dude. There are few alters who are always clearly separate from us, but to me, most switches happen like sliding I can't clearly feel. When part is near, my emotions mixes with theirs, I don't easily notice those are not my thoughts until they are gone. So I become them (with most parts) and I'm just starting to learn what is actually me and what comes from someone else. It's very difficult for me sometimes to know my opinions, since I can't be sure are they actually mine at all. I don't know if I really have anything at all, that's just me for sure.

To Dude co-fronting always feels like two or more thoughts in the head at the same time. Parts always feel "others", he doesn't become them. So he knows who he is, he is someone. Sometimes I feel like I don't even exist, I'm just the channel for alters to come out.

And you also have to remember that in psychiatric disorders there are no clear rules. All diagnosis are there just trying to describe symptoms, they are nothing "real" like physical sicknesses. I mean if you have symptoms that don't fit into diagnosis, it doesn't mean you are wrong somehow, it means there can be something wrong in the definitions of the disorder. We are not here for the diagnoses, diagnoses are here for us. So in that matter there can't be anything that's wrong with you in a wrong way. Do you understand what I'm trying to say BJs? Of course people can get wrong diagnosis, but you don't have to worry so much if you are not just the same kind than others. I always feel I do have DID, but it's broken, working wrong way.

Aleksi, 15 (Boy)

PlanetIcarus wrote:And you also have to remember that in psychiatric disorders there are no clear rules. All diagnosis are there just trying to describe symptoms, they are nothing "real" like physical sicknesses. I mean if you have symptoms that don't fit into diagnosis, it doesn't mean you are wrong somehow, it means there can be something wrong in the definitions of the disorder. We are not here for the diagnoses, diagnoses are here for us.
Aleksi, 15 (Boy)

I know a lot of psychiatrists and other mental health professionals that lose track of this fact! And the corollary is that the label is important only really to the extent that it helps decide the appropriate treatment (also for mundane but important things like disability or insurance coverage...). That's why there is little use in spending time worrying about whether one has OSDD-1b or DID. The treatment is the same, and the ONLY difference is whether or not there is past or present amnesia--which one can't easily rule out anyway.

That said, I can still spend time wondering about that...

Ahoy BJ

This thread should of had a *Warning. Mind Explosion* attached to it!

Perhaps I can cope with the content better if I hadn't of just woken up and had some coffee first! lol

by BJs » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:50 pm

Feeling a bit stupid/vulnerable asking this, and not sure if I can explain well enough anyway.

But I have been wondering about my DID diagnosis and seeming lack of supposed amnesia which constantly plagues me as “proof I am making this up”.
I know I get “amnesia of amnesia” which is interesting in itself.

Right out of the gate you read my own mind and hit the nail right on the head!

OK BJ you are not the only one who is asking themselves this very question! And yes that whole "Amnesia of Amnesia" thing is very interesting in it's self, but also adds another layer of confusion for me as well. There are parts of me who are constantly questioning this whole DID thing too.

It's aggrivated even more by the ways I was "Diagnosed" with it so many times in a short amount of time by a crappy Intern T, then the Medical Director at the local clinic, who was a Psychiatrist who later bragged about how he was "Practicing for 35 years, and I've NEVER heard of this "SCID Series" (which embarrassed his peers in that meeting for it's a standard Diagnostic tool that every counselor has on their desk written by the APA and is called the DSM-SCID Series" for short). And then again at the other county's Mental health clinic by the Psychologist who had many years of "Assessing" although yet again like the Psychiatrist didn't believe in "Structured Interview Tools" for the were for "Research Purposes Only!", and she knew nothing about Dissociation when I asked her about it. And then a few more times by Therapists who also knew nothing about Dissociation and didn't use the DSM for diagnostic purposes. So in each case I was "Diagnosed" by people who bragged about not using any Standard Diagnostic tools like the DSM or the likes, and clearly didn't know anything about Dissociation. The rest of the random Diagnoses besides PTSD were all wrong as well and radically different from the previous ones before and after. So That all by it's self has made me question the validity of this one particular Diagnosis out of all the others that were so far off base.

And yet...it's very hard to deny my trip to the ER a few years back as well as so many other things that meet "The defining feature of dissociative identity disorder is the presence of two or more distinct personality states..." that has been at times very obvious my entire life, well at least going back to grade school. and there is this whole "Not Me" aspect to most of the "Personality States". I often argue with them on this very topic without even realizing it. Which brings me back again to their argument...

by BJs » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:50 pm

But I have been wondering about my DID diagnosis and seeming lack of supposed amnesia which constantly plagues me as “proof I am making this up”.

This is "Their Argument questioning the validity of the diagnosis...

I was/am a "Black Out Drinker". I quit drinking because of it. They scare the Bejeebus out of me! I know them all too well sadly. And I can recall several times with a year of sobriety under my belt in AA in a meeting complaining that "I quit drinking because it caused Black Outs and Now I am having them sober! So what do I have to do now to get rid of the sober Black Outs? join a 12 step program for that too?". They started to my knowledge around the time my seizures started some 3 years ago or so. I can't honestly say if they were before or after the seizures started though. It does matter because Seizures also cause Blackouts, so it's possible that the sober black outs are due to the seizures. Which yet again makes me question this whole DID diagnosis again.

Now to confuse matters even more,...Not everyone with DID has Amnesia. It's an indicator of DID, but is not "The defining feature of dissociative identity disorder".

These are exactly the types of arguments that go on in my head. I don't know if I'm winning or losing the arguments? So let's say for the point of saying that the "Black Outs" are caused by my "PNES" which is well known to cause black outs all by it's self. You and the other posters brought up some very profound experiences that I also have commonly, but never really thought too much about in this way before until now...

by BJs » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:50 pm

But the last few days I was wondering about something else...
I am starting consider that I am not around as much as I think I am.

I mean I wonder if I am “fading out”. I mean what if “my” continuity of thought continues, yet I am no longer in charge of the body or aware of the world. Then I drift back. Does that make sense?

Anyone else identify with this as part of their DID or is it just normal for a distracted absent minded person?

Are other parts doing the doing while I “go away” to think things through? I mean the outside job still gets done, whatever I was doing (working, driving, talking), I have always just figured I was doing stuff by “remote control” when it happens.
Thanks for reading.

That topic is what blew my mind this morning on so many levels!

Boy! Can I relate to exactly that! You just described my everyday experiences! YES I can relate to that!

One of the first things to pop into my mind was you just described a common form of Dissociation that Everyone does. And I mean explicitly "Everyday People". It's often called "Highway Hypnosis", but is short and not for most parts of the day like I experience. Also it's a bit different because "HWY Hypnosis" is a form of blackout and mine I can "remember" the experiences , all be it, like in a foggy haze. But it's just like you described so well.

It's like I am still here in my head and plugging along like nothing is wrong,but am not all in my body and "here"I'm really struggling to put this experience into words. You did it so well and describes it perfectly. Ok let me try this and see how it turns out? I tend to"Hyper Focus" a lot on whatever I am doing. By "Hyper Focus" I mean concentrate intensely on the task at hand and sort of, no Really Tune out anything else. So it's like I am still there, but not. This sounds like the opposite of what you are talking about, but on the flip side of it I often do it with my inner world or thoughts.So the result is I am plugging along on the outside on "Auto Pilot" on the outside, but am doing my own thing on the inside! Yes! That is it exactly!

I've been doing this for ages! A perfect example is the type of work I would seek out with this exact purpose in mind, Consciously. Although I am very skilled and bright and would always excel quickly in the work place, I would instead take "Mindless" production jobs that would bore most people to tears! I loved production type jobs where you would do some "Mindless" task all day long because after you learned to do it, you could just do it in your sleep! And "Sleep" is exactly what I would do so to speak. I would get into the groove and then go off in my inner world and felt like I was getting paid to do my own thing. Bosses of course loved this too because they could never keep anyone else in these positions for very long at all and I would actually beg for them.

Here is how it would go. I would start up my saw or whatever it was I was working on,and then get into the production groove and then would then "clock out" while still on the clock. While "Clocked Out", I would go into my inner world and work on any projects in my head,could be anything like basic electronics or something I was working on at home etc. Other times I would go off on wild tangents in my head and create hilarious scenarios and my co-workers all thought I was nuts because I would just be laughing so hard all by my self and couldn't for the life of them figure out why. Another odd feature was that Time would get really distorted. Most days it felt like I just got there and would baffle me that it was already time to go home. But other times the two hour segments between breaks felt like 8 hours and would confuse the heck out of me. I still experience all the time too. Like last week while I was in here, it felt like a month instead of a week! It's like the time in my inner world was slowed way down compared to the outer world. Perhaps is because there was just so much going on in such a short amount of time? I really am just guessing.

by Violarules » Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:53 am

I feel like that happens to me. I'll be having a conversation with someone and the person will ask me about something I said and I'll have no recollection of saying it, but they assure me I did.

I also have a bad habit of constantly thinking about past memories that bother me, so I wonder when I do have moments I don't remember fully if the memories were altered to keep me from worrying about it until something triggers the memory.

My family also tells me that I zone out a lot, which I used to do a lot when I was younger, but I wonder how often I do it now since it's become so common to me that I don't really notice it.

Something in here is triggering the heck out of me. It's like an anxiety attack just under the surface, but for the life of me I don't have a clue as to why or what it is that is causing it? That usually happens in these situations when it's too close to home. I try to read it but is flat and meaningless. I tried to break it up so I could read it easier but am still blank. Will skip for now. but something or things in this quote is getting a panic response. and now flashbacks.

PlanetIcarus » Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:47 am

There is also many different kind of switching and co-fronting with or without noticing it. That's the biggest difference between me (Boy) and Dude.

There are few alters who are always clearly separate from us, but to me, most switches happen like sliding I can't clearly feel. When part is near, my emotions mixes with theirs, I don't easily notice those are not my thoughts until they are gone. So I become them (with most parts) and I'm just starting to learn what is actually me and what comes from someone else. It's very difficult for me sometimes to know my opinions, since I can't be sure are they actually mine at all.

I don't know if I really have anything at all, that's just me for sure.

To Dude co-fronting always feels like two or more thoughts in the head at the same time. Parts always feel "others", he doesn't become them. So he knows who he is, he is someone. Sometimes I feel like I don't even exist, I'm just the channel for alters to come out.

Aleksi, 15 (Boy)

Aleksi - Ahoy, Jak Se Mat

You really also know how to put into words things that I can't even begin to describe accurately!

These are really subtle and very hard to describe experiences that any language is hard to put words to.

Your first part of that post about different kinds of switching is true for me as well. I can relate to the other posters here that say they are sneaky and have been hiding just under our noses the whole time and never knew it. I also have been discovering after the fact about some fronting going on that at the time wasn't aware of which is spooky to me. Some times it's very obvious and I feel the shift in my body which is an odd experience all by it's self. But other times it's very subtle and don't notice at all because the part I call "Me" is so distracted.They slide in under the radar, jump in and smoothly gain large parts of my experience and all without "Me" noticing, unless something get's my attention like a change in perception that is enough to catch my eye, so to speak. Threads like this one are very helpful for me in these regards.

I often freeze in my tracks if anyone asks me a personal preference question, like "What's your favorite color" etc. It's embarrassing really badly because I can see on their faces the reaction that it has with me in response to me locking up and staring confused and obviously not knowing how to answer it. Internally it causes chaos and I shut down from being overwhelmed by the question. I have always had that same response in my favorite Book store "Powell Books" up in Portland Oregon for it's an entire city block and each floor has entire sections anywhere from Czech History, to DID, to Children's floor, Poetry, and loaded with fun toys for all ages. I have left as soon as I get there so many times because is too overwhelming to be pulled in so many directions all at once. Same with a Chinese Food Buffet! lol

Something that I'm also starting to become more aware with is the subtle "Blending" of parts. Most of my parts are so separate in tastes , ages and personalities that it's obvious. But I am recently discovering that my Little Marky and Cody are so close in age and tastes that it's very hard to tell one from the other at times. Some times is just one of them and so is easy to tell who is who, but together it's almost as if they are one?

They are both around age 4 to 7ish and both like the same stuff, but are also total opposites from each other as well. Cody is very out going and talkative and playful. And Marky is very shy, quiet and scares very easy.

Last week in a journal when Marky first started to talk to me for the first time comfortably, I asked him who "Cody" was and he said he was his twin. I asked "How So?" and he said since he is a Gemini he is "Air" and "Cody" is a "Bull" (Taurus), that he was "Dirt". He laughed and said when they mix they make clouds of dust! But they are Twins. He showed me images from an old "Peanuts" book my Dad used to read to us of "Pig Pen" and the huge clouds of dust where ever he went! It was really cute and was a very strong image I keep seeing now.

on topic to this thread again, I just looked at my clock on my stove and 15 minutes passed while I wrote that last paragraph. I was sitting here, but was in my inner world almost completely. It felt like just a moment and not 15 minutes. In this case time sped up. My memory looking back is only of my experiences I just had in my inner world. None of typing or me being here. I think this is common for me?

Dang I started this at about 10am and is now 3:20pm. It's epic long yet again. and I didn't do any of the things I was trying to do today. And most of all feels like was just a moment ago! I just got up to re-fill my coffee cup and noticed that I only had that first cup when I started and completely forgot to even have my morning coffee because I was lost inhere all this time.

I'm not writing that because I am complaining, but rather feels like it is somehow related to this entire thread. I'm not even sure how or why. Just a part of me is telling me that. *shrugs*

Sorry for the epic post again

I really want to thank BJ for posting this as well as all those who pitched in as well! All of you are so amazing to me and are able to describe so much of what I experience daily but am not able to put into words like all of you do so wonderfully!

I only touched upon just a few things and want to come back to this to see what others have posted as well as dig deeper into such fertile ground!

Keep On Shining!
Lumpy