*TW* helping suicidal littles *TW*

I am wondering if you have any experience with helping suicidal littles?

I know some stuff about helping outside little kids that are suicidal. Not sure if the same kinds of things apply. It's not much different then helping older people except that little kids think more concretely, and don't necessarily understand the concept of death. The reasons they feel suicidal are usually similar--feeling powerless to change things or feel less pain any other way, or trying to show someone how bad they feel, or feeling like they are causing a problem, so if they are gone then people they love will be happier.

So I guess I would try listening to how they are feeling (letting them know you can handle hearing how bad they feel), letting them draw their feelings, asking them how things would have to change for them to feel better. Also, locking away sharp objects and other practical approaches to safety.

Yes, I have one suicidal little. It can be difficult to interact, because it becomes so apparent that she has not quite developed the same emotional regulation skills. It's also worth noting that she is clearly still stuck in trauma-time.

Do you know why your little is suicidal? Is it about current circumstances, or about past ones? If it is about the past, you can try to orient them towards the present - for example by telling them the date and showing them (if applicable) the different physical circumstances (the house, the TV shows, etc).

I've found that it often helps to give them space to express their feelings, either by asking questions, or letting them draw or write (similarly to what TheGangsAllHere wrote).

thanks. I am only just learning how to be better at all this.
it is a current situation that reminds of a traumatic one and brought up the idea that it might get bad for us again.
she is very emotional and dramatic, so I feel like it is hard to get thru with reasoning. she is caught in her little drama, her story of how things will develop from here, working herself into despair over that.

Ah, that sounds tricky indeed.
Not just for littles, but for older parts, too.

It brings up multiple streams of thought for me. I might be totally wrong, I hope you won't take it personally if I am. I'm just hypothesizing... best case scenario is if you find some of this useful!

(1) It is certainly possible that she is too emotional to reason with. Brain-theory wise, this makes sense because younger parts have less developed "reasoning" parts of the brain (the prefrontal lobes), and they operate more from the lower "emotional" parts (limbic system). But this also happens to adults: when we are stressed, we operate more from the lower, immediately-responding-to-stress parts. If this is the case, it may be important to focus on calming down. Do you have coping skills you can use to calm down? (Ideally, to get to a place of relaxation... but that can be near-impossible at times, I know.) Some things that work for us are exercise, taking a shower or bath, drinking a hot beverage (such as tea, or a hot chocolate).

(2) It is possible that while it seems that she isn't listening, she still is. I've seen this a lot in outside-kids. You could still list the things that make this situation different from the past situation, for example.

(3) From what you wrote, it seems to me as if she wants to take responsibility for preventing the past situation from occurring again. That comes from a place of wanting to protect all of you, in her way. That way (suicide) may not be the most adaptive way. How do you feel about coping with the situation? Perhaps she feels as though no one is able to cope - and if you could reassure her that you (or others in the system) can, it may take the suicidal feeling/urges away, or lessen them.

I hope some of this is helpful!

we are all for brainstorming

most of the rest of the system has calmed down. we find that most relaxation exercises only help those who are front. when the situation was out of hand we asked the Little to spend time with her imagery helper animal.
she is keeping up the despair and the ideation of catastrophy.
we have been trying to engage her in relationship based interaction without much success.
we fail to ground her by making her aware of the outside world.
and we are starting to wonder if she has any secondary gains of keeping the drama up. she seems to be resisting every attempt to help her. like she wants to have these feelings
we are wondering if maybe intense despair makes her feel safer cause it is something she knows so well, something she is good at. like a familiar thing to go to when she is stressed.

Asti already made 3 different plans on how to safe the situation. it might not be fun, but we feel capable of doing this.

the teens will host a pizza party with movies for the kids later. Maybe we can distract her?

It's very positive that most of the rest of the system has calmed down! And I love how you have inner imagery helpers.

When you say that there may be secondary gains, to me it doesn't sound like it comes from a very empathic place. It could just be a rational observation, and it's important to keep in mind, but to me it seems a bit harsh. (Maybe I'm just overly sensitive to thart sort of thing). To me it kind of seems as if you are assuming she has bad intentions - which I get, it's normal when you are frustrated with someone, but usually that's not how people (and alters) function. Most of the time, people are trying to get their needs met. They don't always use 'nice', adaptive ways of doing so like saying: "hey, I need some help". It's indeed possible that this is what makes her feel safe, or in control, because she doesn't have to surrender to "It will be okay". It's also possible that she needs you to be present with her feelings without trying to solve them; just being there with her.

But, I think it's a Great idea to have a pizza party with movies!!! I hope you'll have fun, and will be able to get her out of the desperation!

we use the expression of secondary gains without the stigma that is often attached to it. she's a girl. we don't accuse her of manipulation.
we are trying to figure out the needs and just wanted to express how maybe her behavior is an expression of a hidden need or meeting a need in itself. even if this was for getting more attention, that would make her attention-needing and attachment seeking, so we would understand how to meet her. it somehow is not and we are puzzled. no frustration, just puzzled.
sorry if we sometimes use rational wording for emotional things. speaking to the brain while dealing with a heart issue has to feel wrong.
she is slowly running out of energy. seems like hard work to keep up a crisis for so long. she is getting tired. maybe when she is rested she will be able to interact again.

birdsong87 wrote:we are starting to wonder if she has any secondary gains of keeping the drama up. she seems to be resisting every attempt to help her. like she wants to have these feelings
we are wondering if maybe intense despair makes her feel safer cause it is something she knows so well, something she is good at. like a familiar thing to go to when she is stressed.

I hear what fireheart said, but I think (I may be wrong) that's it's just the term "secondary gains" that one might object to. I don't think that term applies here. What you're saying is that this is a feeling-state that paradoxically supplies some kind of comfort to her because she's so used to feeling that way. I totally understand that, and used to spend a lot of time stuck in that kind of state. It feels horrible but it's a known horribleness. And it's also a self-regulation issue because she may not know how to calm herself down and doesn't want to try anything coming in from outside of her.

One idea I have would be to ask her to focus on herself physically (is that possible-does she have an awareness of a body?). How do those intense feelings feel physically? There's a grounding technique of focusing on a body sensation, describing it, and continuing to focus on it until another sensation comes into the foreground, and then focusing on that and describing it, etc. Continuing for 15-20 minutes, or whatever. You're not trying to take away the feelings, just focusing on the physical sensations of having them. This can be calming and might take the edge off the despair. Then if thoughts bring the intensity back up, you/she can try it again. It's a start at self-regulation, and just a thought I have of something that might help.

sometimes we still run into the language barrier. we are not native english speakers and sometimes dont realize when a translation doesnt work well. i think it is the same with saying it is "drama". meaning dramatic as in a play showing strong emotion. not judging this as if she was trying to cause drama.

her awareness of the body is rather limited and connected to a lot of fears about sensing the body.
we will return to her tomorrow and see if she wants to create something to express herself. maybe she wants to create a sand tray about all this.
I feel tired too. all this is draining.