We try to be Nondescript (a journey thread)

Decided to start a thread so we don't keep posting new threads that probably no one is interested in.

Our situation: we finally found treatment directions and therapists that inspire confidence and are catching up after a couple of years with the wrong kind of support.

There's a lot to say about that, but I actually want to talk about one of my alters and how he seems like a key to so much, but also elusive and hard to understand. This alter, Alex, had a personal crisis and weakening when became aware he couldn't have his own life the way he had imagined he'd had in the past. (When we were physically 18-20, he was a main work alter and I was the home alter. After that, things were more complicated, mostly due to the fact that he is a strong masculine presence and somehow this was determined not to be good.) He also seems to have picked up some unfortunate beliefs about his role in the system.

Anyway, he went underground after hearing from a therapist that the road to integration was to influence other alters rather than switch. He put all his energy into transferring his traits to me and others, hoping to disappear and stop the problems he thought he was causing. This kind of worked. I'm more Alex-like than I was before in my abilities, but I'm still not Alex. (Hmm. My "me" in this post is totally confused. It's as if more than one is writing this. My POV keeps shifting.)

Alex is on the one hand this easy-going, calming, friendly engineer in the outside world. He likes challenges and doesn't take things personally. On the other hand, he loves all intellectual pursuits in every area and is very sensitive and insecure when it comes to his role in the system. I'm not sure whether he may be two different alters (or maybe the same alter, heavily influenced by specific others?). I haven't asked him yet.

Anyway, not having Alex around has been difficult but has forced different alters to step in and find different solutions to problems. While he has been gone, he seems to have changed a lot, including by getting more connections in the inner words, but most of the system seems to want him to come back in some capacity. He is not so sure about it, in large part because of the gender thing. At our request, he came back today (but I didn't notice that I was co-present but not in control for some time--it's not as though he announced himself) for a while. I hope he enjoyed it. Definitely made my day better.

At the same time, I think my system may be having some kind of consolidation or new organization or changing of the guard. This isn't the first time it's happened, but it's the first time when I've been aware. I hope it's a sign of healing and not just a routine thing. My system has been very hard to pin down. There are still sections I have no idea about it, but at least there are signs of interest in open communication.

And somehow this is all supposed to have something to do with being able to approach my PTSD...

journey threads are nice because it keeps everything in one place and I think are a huge help to others down the line.

sounds like you are moving forward. slow and steady wins the race!

Elated noise, how can you get to the most purest innocence of an alter. Before the knowledge and start of co consciousness and other alters experience to what created the particular alter. I wish I knew, everyone is vague! I was just commenting on heavily influenced part not to mention the day to day stuff! Seems impossible!

Nondescript wrote:Decided to start a thread so we don't keep posting new threads that probably no one is interested in.

hi nondescript. I really like what you post. But I agree interest wanes or collects in certain places and sometimes it is hard not to take it personally. So I love this idea for you (all).

I can understand where you are coming from, the shaping and moving of the system and not really knowing where everything is coming from. A wise soul (salted lipstick) once told me to try to not worry about the where so much as the what? It might be important to know what alter feels fear but feeling the fear first might be the necessary first step. This has worked for us. To try not to "make sense of it" - hard when you are an engineer

some inside reacted badly to the statement/paragraph about Alex sharing his abilities with you (sorry we accidentally hit submit instead of quote lol). That ended with you were still not Alex. you aren't!! I guess one person inside said "so you would share some parts of you but not all of you" and others were confused. So I can see how this maybe wasn't a good idea. I like being more like K for example (our main adult protector) but I feel like it is more my desire to be like him out of admiration (like you might with a role model or mentor) but not that he is giving some of himself to me. BTW our system is not open to integration but more to harmonious co-concsciousness.

anyway to avoid my usually length posts, keep going on this. i think it will be nice to reflect back on over time and it will be a good space to work some things out. Maybe Alex will come and tell us what he thinks from his pov.

best,
Sam

SamsLand wrote:A wise soul (salted lipstick) once told me to try to not worry about the where so much as the what? It might be important to know what alter feels fear but feeling the fear first might be the necessary first step. This has worked for us. To try not to "make sense of it" - hard when you are an engineer

Definitely a good point. Thanks.

SamsLand wrote:some inside reacted badly to the statement/paragraph about Alex sharing his abilities with you (sorry we accidentally hit submit instead of quote lol). That ended with you were still not Alex. you aren't!! I guess one person inside said "so you would share some parts of you but not all of you" and others were confused. So I can see how this maybe wasn't a good idea. I like being more like K for example (our main adult protector) but I feel like it is more my desire to be like him out of admiration (like you might with a role model or mentor) but not that he is giving some of himself to me. BTW our system is not open to integration but more to harmonious co-concsciousness.

Sam,
I wish this post hadn't set you guys into turmoil. That wasn't my intention! I hope it wasn't very disruptive.

Alex originally wrote something here, and I was uncomfortable with sharing it on the internet. Part of what he said was that he was trying to experiment with integration, and that the experiment had some desired and some unwanted results, and it wasn't the answer to his existential problem.

I'm not sure if this is unusual or not, but Alex and I unknowingly collaborated in our life for much of our life. I can feel him with me as I write, but it's me writing. There were a few instances or periods when I noticed as a teen and young adult that there was "someone else." Often high pressure situations. Once I was put to work cold calling people to drum up business. At the time I suffered extreme social anxiety. I didn't black out but was shaking and went out of my body, and I heard the person on the other end of the phone referring to "me" as a male, and heard my voice being so different. I was relieved and terrified--the call had happened and was over, but someone had perceived me as a male, something that seemed very dangerous. On other occasions, his help saved us from danger. If I noticed anything off, I didn't know what to call it, except that I wasn't like THAT right now. As I got older, it seems like my switching with Alex became much more invisible. He seemed to me just like a male-ish, more confident version of myself, and nothing more, and I put it aside. What I came to know is that if Alex is not nearby, though, I'm very different from Alex.

My system seems to operate in groups of alters with similar functions. I'm in Alex's group, but so are several others. The thing is that before my awakening, I assumed most of the time that everything Alex provided was "me" and he wasn't thinking about his own situation. We were pretty clueless. So post awakening, it doesn't seem like such a stretch for me to have wanted Alex to dissolve to get us out of our DID mess or for Alex to have decided to try. We were part of one another. Except that I thought I knew what there was to be known about Alex, and I don't.

Your thoughts about imitating an alter and not trying to become them, and cooperation versus integration: This made me think. I usually assume that if two parts share the same skill that it is, well, in the same place in my nervous system and a sign of those parts being close in some way. For example, many parts can drive, thank goodness. And I think of our "drivingness" as being anchored in a common place, and the driving parts having a neural connection with one another that way. I think of us as being one person with traits that are segregated. But it could be true that if I have learned to do some of the things Alex can do, it doesn't mean I'm integrating with him.

Ace wants me to mention that we weren't always so boring about being MP. We were linked with a major advocate of the multiple personality empowerment movement in our younger years. And some of us are more into empowerment. And we respect the choice to stay separate.

I have thought it is the responsible choice for me to try to integrate. The current situation of not being integrated is awkward in married life and I hate feeling like I have to "change channels" before I'm ready to do something, whether it's having a conversation with a particular person, doing numerical calculations or playing music. But I don't really even understand integration. I just want to have access to all of me all the time.

Nondescript wrote:I'm not sure if this is unusual or not, but Alex and I unknowingly collaborated in our life for much of our life.

My system had that going on. For decades there were two of us conducting my work life, me and Alter 2. I used to trance out for entire workdays, and come to, and find that a full day's work had been accomplished but none of it was what I had intended to spend the day working on.

For what it is worth, the "change channels" thing is not specific to DID. Everyone has that experience to some degree. Sometimes, recovering from DID is more about learning how not to change channels.

Una+ wrote:

Nondescript wrote:I'm not sure if this is unusual or not, but Alex and I unknowingly collaborated in our life for much of our life.

My system had that going on. For decades there were two of us conducting my work life, me and Alter 2. I used to trance out for entire workdays, and come to, and find that a full day's work had been accomplished but none of it was what I had intended to spend the day working on.

When you say "trance out" do you mean in a fog/daze/hypnogogic state? This is how it works with some of us. Did you share knowledge of work related stuff? Alex and the OP are so together in some ways and so totally distinct in others. Super confusing.

Una+ wrote:For what it is worth, the "change channels" thing is not specific to DID. Everyone has that experience to some degree. Sometimes, recovering from DID is more about learning how not to change channels.

I think the OP was saying that s/he wants to learn how not to have to change channels. Do you mean everyone has modes? Yeah, totally. So how do you think we could know if that change channels thing is DID related or not at different times? The most straightforward way would be, ask. But we apparently suck at self-knowledge. So is there some other guideline for "yes, DID/trauma-related" versus "just regular stuff, don't sweat it?"

I was away on a long, stressful trip and got back a week ago. While I was gone, it was hard to do neurofeedback. I definitely feel a huge difference in my dissociation, level of awareness, and mood.

I'm have a lot of identity confusion and switching/influence. I am bombarded by "foreign" thoughts like, "You don't have DID" or "We just need to get out of here." I know who I'm supposed to be, but I have to keep those other trains of thought from taking over. From a therapy perspective, it would be good, too, to get to know them better. That's so tiring, though, and I'm already very tired.

I'm not sure I'm going to be able to get better from DID. The past doesn't seem to have anything to do with what's going on with me. Maybe DID isn't my problem after all.

sounds like a good rest is needed.

I also struggle with wondering what is normal. or even not knowing what isn't normal. like nightmares. I only realized this morning that most people don't have nightmares all the time.

anyway. just going to say that when the denial starts in, paying attention to pronouns helps me. "you don't have DID" vs "I don't have DID".

I hope you start feeling better / normal for you soon.

BeccaBee wrote:sounds like a good rest is needed.

Yes, I'm gradually getting better. So glad these days I am capable of sleep.

BeccaBee wrote:I also struggle with wondering what is normal. or even not knowing what isn't normal. like nightmares. I only realized this morning that most people don't have nightmares all the time.

It's very hard to know these things. It helps me to know when something is part of a pattern or constellation of symptoms, helps make sense of things and know what will get better with treatment or not.

BeccaBee wrote:anyway. just going to say that when the denial starts in, paying attention to pronouns helps me. "you don't have DID" vs "I don't have DID".

Yeah, good point. Fricking DID. So confusing and topsy turvy.

BeccaBee wrote:I hope you start feeling better / normal for you soon.

It was nice of you to write. Your well wishes are felt and appreciated. Thanks!