Rant About Forum- So Much Serious/Triggery Threads- TW

AlteredArt wrote:Then stop lecturing us, Shay. I understand you have problems, but that doesn't make it okay to come in here and attack people and then when they respond (in a more reasonable, understanding way than you have, by the way), to turn around and blame it on being autistic, like that makes it alright.

Autism is not an excuse to be a bully. If Shay can't handle being here without exploding and spewing all over every else, then Shay shouldn't be here.

Velle


Edit: fine, "bully" was going too far. But I stand by the rest of my post.

***Trigger Warning**** - anger***

PLEASE LEAVE NOW!!!!!!

ALTEREDART NOT BEING NICE OR UNDERSTANDING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY NOT TRYING BULLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY CLEAR IN TRIGGER WARNING AND TOPIC AND TITLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY EXPRESSING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOT DOING ANYTHING WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOT TRYING LECTURE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STOPSTOPSTOPSTOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IF NOT WANT READ THEN DON'T!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOT HAVE TO READ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AM NOT BLAMING IT ON AUTISM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HOW DARE SAY THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



SHAY NOT TRYING ATTACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY HAVE EVERY RIGHT BE HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY NOT DOING ANYTHING WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOT NOTNOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY NOT BULLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOT NOT NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SHAY HAS EVERY RIGHT EXPRESS LIKE OTHERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PLEASE LEAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





~s
h
a
y~

-- Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:07 pm --

AliasForAFew wrote: we sowy shay upset we sowy shay no feel unerstanded.
Can we say we unerstand not been unerstanded?
We lissen to shay. Is dat kay to say to? sorry if its no o k. den we mayk wurds go away.
We lissen to shay sho feelys.
We can giv shay high 5?

Clara w-rite wit help little bit.

(she's too upset to write herself, so i'm writing for her )

you can definitely say that. and thank you for sharing.

it's nice that you listen to shay, and it's ok to say that too.

you can give shay a high 5.

that's very nice of you clara! thank you


- cassie (writing for shay)

-- Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:09 pm --

bourbon wrote:

tomboy24 wrote:evenifremindselfofwhatselfabledo,otherstuffwillstillfrustrating

Stuff in life is always going to be frustrating. But it is what you do with that frustration that matters. I see my post wasn't really accepted too well so I will leave it here.

-B

it wasn't that it wasn't really accepted, it was more that shay doesn't really understand how it's supposed to help, i think.

(and she might not have understood how to respond to it either, or might not have known how to respond to it)



she does thank you for your posts, though.

- cassie (writing for shay)

AlteredArt wrote:This is Juniper. I apologize for Velle's post. I agree with her in principle, but her post was inflammatory, which is not helpful, and it's probably better that we just let this one go.

(Explanation, though we recognize it's not an excuse: our father is probably on the autism spectrum and his inability to control his anger led to physical/emotional/verbal abuse of us that resulted in the split creating Velle. Similar things trigger her.)

She's pretty upset about us apologizing for her and feels like it's kind of a betrayal on our part, so let me make this clear - I agree that Shay's posts were attacking and that that's not alright. She does have issues that she can't help, though, and she seems to be trying, and I feel for her, and hope that we can all move forward and be supportive and respectful towards each other in the future.

-- Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:40 am --

For what it's worth, I thought your post was great, bourbon.

shay's too upset to accept an apology right now... but she knows you gave one, and i thank you for that.

maybe if this subject was triggering to velle, she shouldn't have been reading this thread or shouldn't have been responding? (similar to the very advice you gave to shay despite her mainly talking about titles that have been serious/triggery lately, so not even the reading part of the threads).

i'm glad you recognize it's not an excuse. we weren't trying to use autism as an excuse either. i was trying to simply explain stuff, that's all.


shay has seen other posts that seem attacking. not that it would make this alright, but she's just saying it's not very fair that she seems to be the only one who gets attacked for posting, especially when she was ONLY trying to express herself. she was NOT meaning to attack. she was trying to express herself and she has every right to do that. she was clear in her title, in the trigger warnings, she did nothing wrong.


i hope we can move forward as well, but please don't assume that just because of this, shay is disrespectful or unsupportive. that's not very nice to do that.

shay has been and tries to be respectful and supportive of everyone here.


shay meant no disrespect to anyone.


LET ME MAKE THIS VERY CLEAR TO EVERYONE:

SHAY WAS ONLY EXPRESSING HERSELF HERE AND TRYING TO EXPRESS HERSELF, HER FEELINGS, HER THOUGHTS, ETC., HERE. THAT IS ALL.

and she has done nothing wrong.




- cassie (age ?)

I don t see any problem here.
We can ALL express how we feel.

What the responses are we cannot control.

But I could relate and hope not to have upset anyone.

I want to send Shay some gentle cuddles if accepted
cause this is a hard misunderstood disease

we all need to stand together

we are united

Nina11

I am glad that Shay was able to express herself here. I felt that Shay explained herself in her objectives for this thread several responses ago (mainly, that this was venting and that she did not expect anyone else to change).

On the other hand, I think that this was not understood very well by most people here, especially when the first few replies were, "Sorry, we'll change!" It is also my experience that Shay does not understand explanations very well, which is one of the main ways that people have tried to respond.

I am sorry that Shay has felt alienated.

(I wrote this before I saw the most recent responses).

This is continuing to escalate, and I am wishing to put a stop to it, for it is unnecessary and it is close to getting irrational, as well as out of hand.


Please allow me to address what seems to be the issue here.


Shay was not meaning to nor trying to lecture anyone, attack anyone, disrespect anyone, discourage anyone from posting, saying how things should be, saying there needs to be balance, none of that. None of those things is what she was meaning or trying to accomplish here.

All Shay was doing here was expressing herself, her feelings, her thoughts, her opinions (that no one is being pressured to agree with), etc., to the best of her abilities. She worked very hard to be very clear in the title for what this post was about, and to be very clear with her trigger warnings. She has done nothing wrong because she has been clear in her title and trigger warnings, and they were clear enough to give fair warning to all who choose to read this.


I will admit, her expressions may not have been the most eloquent, nor the most kind, but there is no boundary nor rules for expression, especially emotional expression. There are rules here, indeed, and we/she followed them by making the title clear and giving a clear trigger warning. Her word choice could have been different, but she has a hard time with words and language in general. Again, she was expressing herself to the best of her abilities. Her expression may come off as mean, inappropriate, etc., but often when one expresses themselves or attempts communication it can be interpreted many different ways and can be taken in ways it was not meant to be taken as. Not only that, but when one deals with expressions, rants, venting, etc., one must realize that the things that will be expressed will not always be to everyone's liking, nor will everyone always agree with them, and some may even take offense to them. That does not mean we/she still does not have the right, the same right everyone else here has, to express herself. And that is all she was attempting to do here, and that is all she is continuing to try and do here.


I ask you all to please understand that it can be very hard for Shay, and I will admit ourselves, to find the "right words", as well as the "right way" to say things, not to mention expressing herself/ourselves. This means that her attempts at communication can often come across as blunt, mean, uncaring, lecturing, etc., when in reality all she is trying to do is express herself, including any feelings, thoughts, or opinions she may have, and she is doing her best to communicate to the best of her abilities.


Now, I am not saying that no one has any right to feel hurt, or upset, or offended, etc., at such expressions. Everyone here has every right to have their own feelings, reactions, opinions, thoughts, etc. What I am saying is that please, recognize and try to understand that all Shay is doing here is expressing herself. She is not looking to start arguments, she is not looking to start fights, she is not trying to bully anyone, hurt anyone, offend, anyone, etc., the only thing she is attempting to do here is express herself, and that is all. I also ask you all to please realize that everyone is entitled to their feelings, thoughts, opinions, reactions, etc., and that include Shay, and it also include feelings, thoughts, opinions, reactions, etc., that everyone might not like or agree with. If you do not like what is being said here, or if it upsets you, you can always choose to leave, you can always choose to ignore, you can always choose to not read this thread in the first place or to not read it again, etc. (You can also choose to respond and express yourself here, but please do so without specifically attacking Shay. Shay was careful to not be specific in her expressions, so I ask you to return the same courtesy and not specifically attack her. One can express disagreement and dislike without attacking someone specifically).

I am not saying that we are trying to keep people from replying here. We welcome and are open to all people and replies, of all sorts. However, I ask you to please keep in mind that all Shay is doing is expressing herself here, and I ask you to remember that this is her thread that she has made, and that she has done nothing wrong and has given you all proper warnings through her clear title and trigger warnings. Please take such things into consideration before you reply to this thread.



It was never our's, nor Shay's intention to cause upset here. The only thing that was being attempted here was expression of self, thoughts, feelings, opinions, etc. That is all.


Thank you for your time, thank you for your understanding, thank you for your patience, and I hope we can all move forward past this in time.


~Rain

I hope this can deescalate but I wanted to point out one of the things that may or may not have been part of having this thread go the way it did: I think it's important to note what it is one is looking for by way of replies. By this I mean the fact that the original post has many questions - that she, seemingly, wants an answer to. When given these answers (by various users and both as agreements, disagreements etc), it is said that it is "just expressing". I think part of the confusion might stem from this. I hope this doesn't come off as attacking because it is not at all meant as such, I am just trying to help maybe communicate why things turned out the way it did.

Ah, yes, thank you, I forgot that point.

Shay often asks questions as a form of expressing her confusion. This does not always mean she is looking for answers or explanations, however. It can understandably get confusing to others, though.

When Shay is frustrated or confused by something, often she is "stuck" in that state/emotion. She asks questions as one might ask themselves questions, meaning she is not necessarily looking for an answer, and often such questions that come from said emotions are how she expresses her confusion.

She has a hard time understanding explanations, and often knows the explanations and reasons anyway, though she is still confused, so having others give explanations (or at times repeat explanations she's already aware of) does not really help the situation, because she still remains confused, and often times becomes even more frustrated or confused because the explanations have solved nothing for her.

Explanations are even more difficult for Shay when she is still emotional, meaning when she is still very confused or frustrated, the focus is still on those emotions and thoughts, and so explanations will either be simply more confusing, or they will be shrugged off since she is already to confused to try and understand more, or they will be rejected because she is already dealing with a lot of input and her own emotions, or something to that effect. She needs time to calm down, clear her head, and prepare herself to be ready and open for such things to even have a chance at making sense and being processed instead of simply confusing her more or causing more frustration or even just being "too much" for her to handle at that point in time. (I know that no one had any way of knowing this, and I know this is not on the responsibility of others to know nor remember, but I am simply explaining so that there can be more understanding).


It was also mostly not the replies of explanations that were upsetting to Shay.


~Rain

-- Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:42 pm --

Nina11 wrote:I don t see any problem here.
We can ALL express how we feel.

What the responses are we cannot control.

But I could relate and hope not to have upset anyone.

I want to send Shay some gentle cuddles if accepted
cause this is a hard misunderstood disease

we all need to stand together

we are united

Nina11

thank you

shay doesn't like being touched or physical contact that much

but i'm sure she'd be accepting of a high 5 (that's like her "hug", a high 5)




- cassie (somewhat writing for shay)

michiru7422 wrote:I am glad that Shay was able to express herself here. I felt that Shay explained herself in her objectives for this thread several responses ago (mainly, that this was venting and that she did not expect anyone else to change).

On the other hand, I think that this was not understood very well by most people here, especially when the first few replies were, "Sorry, we'll change!" It is also my experience that Shay does not understand explanations very well, which is one of the main ways that people have tried to respond.

I am sorry that Shay has felt alienated.

thank you

i agree, i think there was some misunderstandings that happened, and hope they can be cleared up (thank you rain for your help)


thanks again


- cassie (somewhat writing for shay)

tomboy24 wrote:
maybe if this subject was triggering to velle, she shouldn't have been reading this thread or shouldn't have been responding? (similar to the very advice you gave to shay despite her mainly talking about titles that have been serious/triggery lately, so not even the reading part of the threads).

Yes, that's true. We screwed up, realized it, apologized, and will be alert to the possibility in the future and take steps to protect our system by trying to avoid similar situations. That probably won't happen all the time, but we can try. We also fully appreciate the irony.

Now may I gently point out that you are urging tolerance and understanding of emotional expression but overlooking that Shay isn't being tolerant or understanding of that herself?

And may I make a friendly (honestly ) suggestion? Those of us reading Shay's posts have no way of knowing what her meanings and intentions are, or her difficulties in expressing herself and handling certain kinds of responses. (Well, those of us who have read through this thread have a pretty good idea, but in general, what she says is all people who are reading know about her.) Just putting a trigger warning doesn't help with that. Given that she reacts so strongly, I think it would be a good idea for someone(s) in your system to make a habit of adding an explanation/interpretation/introduction to her posts. I think that would help her get the responses she needs and can handle. Alternatively, you could put a short blurb in your signature, but that probably wouldn't be as reliably read by responders.

I hope you're all having a good night. Assuming it is night in your time zone.

I accept and appreciate your apology.

I am not overlooking anything. Just because I do not choose to publicly address every issue does not mean I am overlooking it by any means. I had also stated numerous times that Shay's expression could have been done more differently and appropriately.

And I mean no offense, but I do not need suggestions or lectures on how to take care of or watch out for the system I have been taking care of for a very long time. I never said I expected anyone to know anything, and I admitted to everything you have pointed out. Her trigger warning was fairly clear enough that though it may have not explained much, it was a fair enough warning to those who CHOSE to read this, after also reading the title, which clearly states "rant".

I have already stated what I wished to say, I have explained what has needed explanation, and I am not looking to turn this into a conversation, since I did not mean to start one.
I am also, no offense, not looking for advice on how to help our system. Though I do thank you for the advice all the same, and do agree that you state a valid point, I do not put explanations until I see that they are needed. The title of this thread was clear, the trigger warnings were clear, people had a fair enough warning before reading this thread that this was a rant, that there was anger and confusion involved, and that it may be triggering in some way. Not all responses upset her, only certain ones did, which means that an explanation was not necessarily needed. Now that I have seen there is indeed a clear need for explanation, I have provided it. I admit, I could have stepped in a bit sooner, but Shay had asked for the chance to address it herself, since this was her thread, and I allowed her the chance to do so.
We do not have the room in our signature for an explanation, and there is not enough of a need for one to be in a permanent place such as the signature.


I wish you a good day/night as well.


~Rain