existential depression

does anyone suffer from this?

at times i feel like there is no one else in the world who can help me with this form of depression. not only do i have this, but also PTSD.

right now i'm in an outpatient program and i feel like i'm just surrounded by clients and professionals who have no freaking clue what i'm talking about. a few years ago i even tried finding a psychologist who specialized in existential therapy. all he did was tell me how smart and funny i was and barely did any real therapy-- i felt like i was there just to amuse him.

anyway, i've been having existential episodes ever since i was a little girl. art/emotion moved me profoundly. others' suffering was (still is) painful for me and i had a developed sense of empathy. before i even started pre-school i'd ask my mother, "where does god come from?"

i know a lot of people like to think they're existentially depressed or their children are because they think it's something "special" to be labeled... at least that's the impression i pick up from a lot of articles (and thus) comments sections where people like to brag about how intelligent they are and how they're suffering so much for it. if these people really had existential depression they'd be more inclined to be feeling like i have been the past 8 years, which is like you just want to die every day because you possess a borderline nihilistic view of the world. i won't go as far to say a full view of it in that respect, because i feel nihilistic individuals are just lazy existentialists, and i'm definitely existential in nature.

so does anyone know of anyway to find therapists who specialize in existential depression, or good books/resources on it? the closest i've ever found to combating this depression has been through buddhism, since most buddhists believe that life is suffering, but there's a way around the suffering, which is through the 8 fold path (which basically translates into accepting life as it is). but this is easier said than done, because if i could feign contentment, i would. but it doesn't work like that.

so any advice you all may have i'm all ears. i'm tried of opening up to people only to realize that, once again, they misinterpret what i am saying or are not on the same wave-length as me and it's like talking to a brick wall.

thanks in advance.

After trying standard therapies, I realised that I had existential depression, and have had it for most of my life. I tried existential therapy, but it didn't really help. I don't know what does help, I find looking into philosophy helpful for a while, but then realise it actually makes me worse because I become more removed from my life. I wish I could provide some advice, but am interested in seeing what other people have to say. Like you said, most people have no idea what you're talking about, and they just blame it on thinking too much, and tell you just to not think about existential questions, which for someone who experiences existential depression, it is impossible not to.

Either way it is a horrible thing to have, and I do hope you find some solace knowing you aren't alone.

To be honest, I don't really know what you mean with "existential depression". Asking philosophical questions or understanding that everything is inherently pointless isn't something that automatically leads to depression. It just does if it strips you of all positive lookout into your own future and well-being when you are in a bad situation leaving you with no hope of feeling better than what you already experience.
The point is that there is no reason not to experience fun and happiness in your life just because you're an existentialist and that's why I see no point in distinguishing depression from "existential depression", but maybe you can clear that up for me.

Unknown_1 wrote:After trying standard therapies, I realised that I had existential depression, and have had it for most of my life. I tried existential therapy, but it didn't really help. I don't know what does help, I find looking into philosophy helpful for a while, but then realise it actually makes me worse because I become more removed from my life. I wish I could provide some advice, but am interested in seeing what other people have to say. Like you said, most people have no idea what you're talking about, and they just blame it on thinking too much, and tell you just to not think about existential questions, which for someone who experiences existential depression, it is impossible not to.

Either way it is a horrible thing to have, and I do hope you find some solace knowing you aren't alone.

thank you for your post. at least someone else out there-- that i can say i have "communicated" with (even if just on a message board)-- understands what i am experiencing. everything you said made sense. it is extremely frustrating because no amount of medication or CBT "skills" or talking about it has worked. i cannot find a therapist who understands, because most therapists come from a "think positive and all your problems will melt away!" perspective. i'm tired and just want it all to end. the majority of people in this world disgust me, and when i say this i am looked at as a fiend, then immediately labeled a "pessimist" and told to use coping skills to rewire my brain to a more positive mode. as someone who suffers from this, i'm sure you understand all too well that this form of "therapy" is laughable and not appropriate for our situation. in fact, it is downright insulting. and the more defiant and enraged i become because i am trying to explain what i am going through, the more offended and frustrated the mental health professionals become with me. i'm exhausted. i just either want to become "enlightened" so none of this bothers me anymore, or get a frontal lobotomy so none of this bothers me anymore. but i prefer death at this point.

Asto wrote:To be honest, I don't really know what you mean with "existential depression". Asking philosophical questions or understanding that everything is inherently pointless isn't something that automatically leads to depression. It just does if it strips you of all positive lookout into your own future and well-being when you are in a bad situation leaving you with no hope of feeling better than what you already experience.
The point is that there is no reason not to experience fun and happiness in your life just because you're an existentialist and that's why I see no point in distinguishing depression from "existential depression", but maybe you can clear that up for me.

no offense, but if you don't understand what it is, i'm just too tired to explain to anyone else what it is anymore. it may not be the case with you, but i'm just tired of trying to explain myself to those who are committed to misunderstanding me, or can't understand me because my reality is not theirs. you'll just have to take my word for it.

i have had existential depression, i remember even at the age of like 12 saying to my friend life is weird in that we don't know how we got here, i also remembering wondering if god created us, who created god. so at a young age i had existential questions, but as for existential depression i feel like it may have been part of the depression itself. as in it went from questioning in a curious view, to a why are we here what's the point in a depressive way, or maybe it was just existential depression adding to normal depression i cant be sure.

but yea, i have had panic attacks and misery over existential stuff. one thing that's helped is coming to the belief that it doesn't really matter what objective meaning there is if any, but it's all about the meaning you create and give to you own life, and when you think in that way, there can be just as meanings of life as there is people.

also what helped was just focusing on overcoming depression itself through therapy (specifically dbt), and applying what i've learned from buddhism/zen which has led to less thinking overall, and enjoying life more instead of wondering what life is about.

because in buddhism, why we are here and what happens when we die is irreverent, and asking what the point of life is, is like asking what's the point of dancing. the point isn't for the dance to end, the point is the dance itself. so really the only thing that matters is this moment, as it's all there is and all that will ever be, and past and future only occurs in your thoughts.

and this is where mindfulness (or meditation) practice comes in, and the more you practice it the easier it gets. you can do it sitting or walking, or doing whatever, but basically you concentrate on whatever you doing, and when thoughts come up, just observe the thoughts your having and return to concentrating on what your doing. and it's a process of going back and forth.

and this would apply to your existential thoughts, and just as these have gotten more intense over time, they will get less and less over time. so at first it's inevitable you'll get caught up in them and cause you feelings, but if you practice everyday taking an observer's approach to the feelings/thoughts as if you were watching a movie, over time they'll get less and less. taking this approach helps also, because resistance is also what makes them worse.

and these are books i highly recommend, that aren't just any self-help books, but ones based on teachings from buddhism which are the most effective.

http://www.amazon.com/Wisdom-No-Escape- ... +no+escape

http://www.amazon.com/The-Places-That-S ... +scare+you

http://www.amazon.com/Wherever-You-Ther ... re+you+are

also i highly recommend this reading this blog
http://tinybuddha.com/blog/the-gift-of- ... ind-peace/

I registered on this forum to respond to this thread.

I have recently discovered that my feelings of depression exactly match the descriptions of existential depression. It really has followed me throughout my life. For a lot of my life, I wasn't really conscious of if, it sort of just was a lens through which I viewed everything. Even in elementary and middle school, I was seen as a bit of a "different' and "cynical" kid. It was better in high school when I distracted myself with petty high school drama, but maturation and lots of introspection evoked those feelings that had always loomed in my subconscious to near unbearable levels.

The severity increased throughout college and to the present day now. Like a lot of people, I looked into philosophers' viewpoints (Camus, Satre, Kirkegaard, Dostoyevsky) and found comfort in knowing I was not totally alone in thought. Up to that point, my conversation points and comments would be seen as "too heavy" or "morbid." To me, It seemed like these questions were the only things worth talking about. That the feeling that was crippling my ability to function in a normal society. I wondered if maybe everyone had this feeling and just hid it better than me. I tried to talk to people, but no matter what I was met back with blank stares and people saying I should "relax."

I have that ability to relax. Most people consider me witty and funny. I feel like my depression gives me a unique perspective. I don't want to label it as "heightened awareness", as that gives it a feeling of arrogance, but I don't know how better to describe it. I feel like the 21st century narrator from "Notes from Underground." Digressing real quick, I've always felt that Louis CK had a very similar outlook. I think him and I would get along and talk about some deep stuff. But being funny ultimately is just a distraction for me. It doesn't solve the root of the problems, which are the finality of death, the relativity of freedom, the meaninglessness of it all, and the total insignificance of any individual in the scope of the cosmos. The philosophers' couldn't answer these questions either. Not to their fault, I accept that they can't be answered.

Unfortunately, most of my anxieties come from witnessing the world around me. This awareness allows me to see how the world should be, an ideal world. Compared to what the world really is, an unforgiving, chaotic shitstorm. I grew up in a well off neighborhood in a country that preaches liberty. Statistically, I should have been born in a much worse situation (well statistically, I probably shouldn't be alive), but the RNG Gods of the world allowed me to win the genetic and social lottery. But do I deserve any of it? I sit comfortably in my room with all these pleasures available to me, but I can't stop thinking about the single mother working two job to feed her kids, the child in Africa hoping to eat tomorrow, or the billions of people living #######5, unfair lives.

I'm told that with my intellect and life situation, I should be pursuing a white collar job, getting married, and raising a family. It's what I've been surrounded with my whole life. I am finishing up a Masters degree in a major I care very little about. I see work as nothing more than a means to an end. I really couldn't think of anything I really "loved' that could pay the bills. Too bad when I interview with companies I have to #######4 the hell out of them and feign insufferable enthusiasm. No, I don't really want to work for your company, but if you pay me money I will perform the job responsibilities within the hours you designate. Do people honestly need more than that?

So what do I do? I see a pointless white collar life ahead of me. That isn't bad, please I don't ask for pity. My life is a joke compared to the average suffering of any persons. That's what the human condition is anyway, suffering. I guess I can try to solace myself in the idea that relativity plays a big part in suffering, so maybe it isn't so bad for other people. My contemplations of suicide are what I would consider, oddly, to be rather rational. I can see why people would deduce that suicide is the answer. I don't think most people commit suicide so rationally though. When faced with the reality of no meaning, it isn't that big of a jump. I would not commit suicide though, because I concede that I am indescribably ignorant (as we all are) and do not have the right to say there will never be meaning in my life. Secondly, I would abandon the people who I feel are struggling the same battle I am. Their's might be a little more shallow and a little less intellectual, but it is nonetheless as equally important.

I will go ahead and conclude this really patchwork and loose drafting of thoughts with the last issue this awareness clashes with, and that is religion. Being in a very conservative area, most of friends and family are religious. I would consider my parents devout, but not overbearing. Their desire for me to go to church isn't forceful, but it is instead delivered in passive aggressive undertones. Atheism/Agnosticism was a logical deduction I made at a relativity young age. I didn't claim to know the answer, but I knew that the idea of a monotheistic God was ridiculous in its very concept, its idolization epitomizing civilization's most primitive desire, to be led. That same idea has crossed over into our daily lives. The working environment, American politics, corporations. I witness it and feel that mankind is its own worst enemy. It has the ability, I have seen it. I have seen art, listened to music, read the most beautiful stories about what it means to be human.

And that's why I sit here in my room typing up a reply on psychforums, for maybe no one to see.

“Perhaps I really regard myself as an intelligent man only because throughout my entire life I've never been able to start or finish anything.”
― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Notes from Underground

I just wanted to write to say basically that I could have written CCE's post word for word. It is EXACTLY how I feel and we have almost the exact same experiences. I used to think that everyone went through this but that most people just found a way to hide it. As I've gotten older and talked to people more about depression, it turns out that it's not something that everyone worries about and for that reason a lot of people can't figure out why it can be so troubling.

No solutions here- just wanted to say I'm in your boat too.

I really like what bigmike shared -"asking what the point of life is, is like asking what's the point of dancing. the point isn't for the dance to end, the point is the dance itself."

But what if you find out that the meaning of life is meaningless and you realized you don't want to dance in the first place? But since i was drag in the dance floor, all i want is for the song to finish and just to be with the stars.

I reached the stage where everything becomes pointless; there's simply no reason for me to get up in the morning, to go to work, and specially to sleep. I only do so because i don't want to be an inconvenience to my family and society. I think i dont have any heavy problems in my life. My problem is life itself. It's a very heavy burden to carry. But since it's there, the only thing i think i can do with it is to make it worthwhile to humanity. Even just a little bit. My only consolation is completing my dreams. If done and not yet satisfied, that's when i commit suicide.

uginyre wrote:But what if you find out that the meaning of life is meaningless and you realized you don't want to dance in the first place? But since i was drag in the dance floor, all i want is for the song to finish and just to be with the stars.

what makes you sure it's meaningless, and even if there really is no objective meaning you can create meaning.

I reached the stage where everything becomes pointless; there's simply no reason for me to get up in the morning, to go to work, and specially to sleep. I only do so because i don't want to be an inconvenience to my family and society. I think i dont have any heavy problems in my life. My problem is life itself. It's a very heavy burden to carry..

having dealt extensively with depression for years including suicidal thoughts and severe depression, everything you wrote there sounds like symptoms of depression and not about life itself. it's easy to forget depression not only causes us pain or numbness, but it also affects our perception and our thinking, and the more i recover from depression the more i see it, as everything for me is becoming more meaningful, positive, and less thinking life sucks whats the point anyways, and i can bet when your pain is resolved you would see it too.

The reason why for me life is meaningless is because whatever you do in your lifetime will be just in vain. Earth will crumble, humanity will inevitably get extinct and the universe will just dissolve. Whatever meaning i put in my life, it will just become meaningless in the end. Yes, im sure im depressed clinically. But this perception of meaninglessness made it worse. There are times that i actually think that life is good, that i am lucky to experience life than not. But that's when im under the influence of alcohol or my body receives pleasure. But my logical perception of life remains. Meaningless. Positive thinking just doesn't work for me as my brain tells me that's just self deception. But though im pessimistic and hopeless, i still try my very best to enjoy every moment of my life since im already here, with the help of alcohol, sensory pleasures and the dream of making the world s happy place to live in. Sorry if i sound crazy, i think i really am.