Compulsive Liar Seeking Needed Help

Hi Claudette,

Yea I'm not the one to argue. I hate conflict, and with that being said I tend to lie to avoid it. I still lie about other things as well. Similar to your friend, for attention. I got so caught up in the lime light, praise by many, great athlete, and a list of other things. I had to have the best looking car, at least two girlfriends, which created more lies. I pretty much lost myself in all that, and now it's almost like I've made myself into someone I'm not, or who I choose not to be anymore.

With me and my wife, I think my childhood as well played a big part. I'm not the type to show my feelings, that changed from not being able to trust. My childhood girlfriend or should I say ex-fiance did some unthinkable things that I wish on know man. From their I vowed to never put a 100% into a female or much less trust them to the fullest. I felt that way, or still feel that way. I felt I would never have to worry about getting hurt again. With all that as well, I really picked up the lying because I would juggle different women or feed them lie after lie. I feel that has played a part in our relationship. I want to let all that go, but it's hard. When you feel your feelings have been tramped over it's hard to allow yourself to let go. I'm very guarded when it's comes to my feelings.

Lying has been with me so long, it's caused hurt to many people, especially my wife. She's a very straight forward person. I've seen how she's basically stop talking to people who has lie to her. And the only reason she's with me I believe is because she feel in love with the person I proclaimed to be, honest, faithful, family oriented, and a person not to pass on. All those things she now sees were untrue. I lived a lie, and she felt for along time I could turn things around. The thing is I felt that way to. I felt the lies I told, I could change on my own. I never wanted to believe I was a compulsive liar until now. The women came from my own insecurities. Anytime me and my wife, girlfriend at the time got into it, I would leave because I had others to fall back on, telling me how much they cared for me and they would literally just put up with my arrogance.

Claudette, I now know I don't want to lie any more, I want people to see me for me. Crazy thing is, I don't lie to co-workers, feel its nothing to gain. I'm well established with and in my job. I want to re-write the script, and live the rest of my life as just that great guy, no matter what.

Hi.

It seems the trust issue is really what lies at the heart of your lying, whether that lying is to your wife (you don't allow yourself to be emotionally intimate which is really what "marriage" is-- a union of both the physical and emotional) or whether that lying is to others. Or am I wrong? I got the impression from your first posts that it's not just to your wife that you lie. It's interesting you don't lie to co-workers although I see your point in that you feel there's nothing to be gained, but does that mean you lie to strangers or other family than your wife? Lots of compulsives, however, lie to friends and co-workers in order to impress for they fear people might not like them unless they meet a certain standard. In other words, they don't trust in other people's ability to like/love them.

So, seems in order to protect yourself, you've built walls anyone who loves you has to scale in order to get close to you, an impossible feat. You subvert yourself in doing that, seeing to it that no one can scale that wall.

Claudette,

That was well said. Yes I've lied to other family members as well as friends. But I'm not around my family or my friends that much. But I would lie about what I had or did. I just felt like some wouldn't like me for me, so I had to make my life more interesting. So it's been mostly to my Wife. I don't know why I don't lie to Co-Workers. My Counselor said that's a good thing, and he feels we can make some ground with that information. He also told me that he feels, I don't treat my Wife as equal. I never notice that, but that's what he got out of our session. I'm still trying to figure that one out. He definitely notice that I have the wall up. I really not just a open person about my feelings. Still going strong with not lying, haven't lie in quite a while. Came close but getting the hang of catching myself or thinking before I respond. How's your friend?

Hi j.r.

Sounds as if you are doing well with not lying. Lots of folks on here seem not to be able to make it through even a few hours w/out telling one.

Your therapist gave you something to think about. About treating your wife as an unequal. Have you arrived at what was meant?

Thanks for asking about my friend. His name is Ted. Last week Ted said that he had spent one month two few years ago salmon fishing in Alaska. Now, that's not so unusual since where we live there are quite a few people, women included, who spend much of their summer in AK doing that. However, when the people at the lunch table, some of whom have friends/relatives who do seasonal commercial salmon fishing, asked Ted some rather simple questions, he tried to change the subject (which he is usually rather good at), but one of the guys persisted, and it was obvious to us T. had never done salmon fishing. He was vague in his answers and then he got up to get coffee as if to not have to continue the conversation.

Then, it dawned on me. I figured out a pattern to his lies. I remembered that about a month earlier I had been sitting with him, talking, when a small group next to us were talking about Graveyard Point, AK, a place where one of of them goes every summer to fish for salmon. Evidently Ted paid more attention to that conversation than I had, and I think what he does is he hears other people talking about things they've done or places they've gone, and down the road, their stories become his. I have figured out that incidents that have happened to other people become jumping off points for his stories. I thought of at least three other things he has said in the last year that directly relate to events in the lives of other people on staff.

That's what I meant when I said his lies are transparent. I feel so bad for him. My first instinct is to put my hand over his mouth and yell, "Cut it out! Don't you know people know you are lying?? Can't you see that in their faces?" My second instinct is to put my arm around him and ask, "Are you all right? Why are you doing this? We like you just fine as you are. Get some help, please."

But I don't do any of those things. I am afraid if I approach him about it, I will humiliate him.

So I have to ask....after you have told a lie to someone and you think they know it's a lie, does humiliation or regret set in after? Or are most of the lies so common that you forget about them almost as soon as you say them? I ask this because I am wondering what Ted feels later. I have no way of knowing.

Hi Claudette,

Just finish reading your post. Just some things that I would suggest for Ted. I really think you should confront him as respectfully as possible. Perhaps pull him to the side and tell him how much of a friend he is to you and that I rather approach you as a friend than talk about you behind your back. Mention you care for him and that's the only reason your coming to him. And explain to him about the lying, you could also throw in there about this forum. You care so much about him that you wanted to see what you could do to possible help him and help you understand things from his point of view. I think this forum really helps a lot, it allow you to get out what your actually feeling. And its always great to have someone that has the same problem as him to help him. He's really blessed to have a friend like you anyways. I think Ted is like a lot of people here who just want to feel important and accepted. I don't know were it origin from. I'm actually doing quite well. Just taking it one day at a time.

(So I have to ask....after you have told a lie to someone and you think they know it's a lie, does humiliation or regret set in after? Or are most of the lies so common that you forget about them almost as soon as you say them?)

Humiliation and regret! I feel rather silly, or should I say stupid. I say to myself why did I just tell that lie, and wonder how people think of me now. It's really an awkward feeling.

-- Tue Jun 28, 2011 6:24 pm --

Hopefully being on the forum helps you understand Ted, but it should also help you in addressing his problems. For me, I would probably kept on with my lying if I hadn't been called on it quite a bit. Even thou it's hard to stop lying, it does open up your eyes, and make you want to do better for yourself. I think Ted needs to feel wanted, and I think as a friend you could really help him. Let me know what you decide if anything. Have a nice evening.

Thanks a lot for the suggestions, j.r. and the insight you've provided.

I have made up my mind to talk to Ted. I haven't had a good opportunity yet with no others around, but there's an opportunity I have in mind in setting that will occur in the next few days. I hope I can find the right words. I don't really know what to expect. Thanks again. I'll let you know how it goes.

I hope your voyage is going well.

Thanks.

Claudette

Claudette,

That's why were all here to help each other, I'm just looking forward to see how things turn out. For me things are going ok. The marriage is on edge, but again I say I'm not here to say my marriage I'm here to fix me. I love my wife dearly, but I have to do this for me. Anyway good luck with Ted.

Hi. I did it. Here's what happened:
We attended a seminar together and since he drove to the last one, I was scheduled to do the driving this time. I figured that driving home would be a great time for me to bring up the subject.
I had to really gin up my nerve to bring it up but I did by saying something to this effect (pretty close to verbatim): "I really care a lot about our friendship and so I want to tell you something that has been upsetting me. I've realized for quite some time now that you have told me several things that are stories. I've thought a lot about this, and I know that you tell stories that aren't true not just to me but to our friends at work too. For the longest time I didn't get it, but I did some reading about this behavior, and I found out that it's called compulsive lying and that a lot of people have this problem and they don't really understand why. I found this forum on the computer where compulsive liars discuss their problem with lying, how it might have started, and most importantly, how to stop lying, since it affects their lives with everyone. I thought maybe you might like to visit the site. I don't know if you've ever sought help for this, but I really hope you do because I know it is affecting you and your friendships and I value your friendship more than you know."

Now, this whole time I was holding my breath, thinking he would interrupt me, but he didn't. At the end of a few of these sentences, I'd glance over at him and he was staring straight ahead at the traffic in front of us which was moving ever so slowly. I didn't want to get bogged down in examples and specifics since I didn't want this to devolve into an argument in which he claimed that he did or did not say this or that. Nothing. He said nothing. One reason I did this in the car was because I figured that if had an urge to leave the room when I brought it up, he couldn't do that in a car, but I guess I wasn't really prepared for the absolute silence, as if nothing had been said and we were just driving along.

So, I forced the issue. "I am offering my help. Would you like my help?"

The answer: "Why would I want or need help from someone who doesn't trust me to tell the truth. I thought we were friends."

Well, I was kinda prepared for that, I guess, the denial of any problem. So I said, "No, you are not going to be successful with making this out to be a question of my friendship for you or my feelings for you or my trust in you. You are my friend, and I trust you with acting in my best interest because I know you care about me, but that's not the same thing as saying that I can always trust the stories you tell me. If you should decide to confide in my about this problem, I promise you I am ready to listen."
And for the rest of the ride home, neither of us talked. I dropped him off. He got out of the car, said, "Good night" in kind of a normal way, and that was it.

I will see him tomorrow at work. We'll see if anything is mentioned, but I will bet nothing will be. He'll pretend this never happened is what I think. I wonder if he will try to watch out for telling more stories around me or the rest of us.

I am 99% glad I did this. I hope he takes me up on the offer, but if nothing else he knows I am aware of it (but I do think he HAD to be aware that we knew). I don't want him to feel alone or shamed, but there's 1% of me that is afraid he is so alone right now. Maybe I am wrong about that, though. Surely this has happened to him before with other friends.

Thanks, j.r.

Claudette,

It's a good thing you did this. Now the ball is left in his court. You put out there how you feel, and gave him suggestions and even mention your there for him. One thing about us is that we a lot of time try to play the victim. The things he said was his way of playing the victim and not accepting responsibility for his actions. I'm really glad you stood your ground. Most of the time I played the victim and it actually worked especially with my Wife and I think because she loved me so much and made excuses for me. I think you should still keep communication open with him, meaning talk to him, just a way of leaving yourself approachable. He now knows how you feel. Keep me posted and I'm him if you need any advice. I guess there is a positive thing that comes from my problem, I'm able to help you understand your friend.

Lately for me things I still haven't lied, my marriage is still hanging by threads. I think that comes with the fact of I've taken here down this road before and I've never been able to within stand it for a certain period of time. I really feel a lot better, I'm getting out how I feel. Still in love with her, but way things haven't been looking as of late, seems as if she checking out. I hope I'm wrong about that. That.s pretty much how things are going my way. Again great job for stepping up.

J.R.

Hi J.R.

How are things with you? Still towing the line on the lying? Slips might happen, I'd imagine, but like anything else, if one falls down,one gets back up.

When we saw each other the next day, nothing was said about the conversation in the car. He was a bit quiet I though, unless it was my imagination, but then seemed fine. So far I haven't noticed any lies, but they don't occur daily anyway, at least not that I know of. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

I know that one conversation will not likely cause a change, but like you say, at least he's on notice. What I really hope for is that he realizes there are those who like him for himself, that he doesn't have to invent a false self in order to be liked.

I wonder, though, about the motivation behind lots of compulsive liars such as Ted and you, who are good people, not sociopaths. Is it simply an emotional crutch that became a habit or is there a actually a high that comes from lying. I keep thinking about what the research says about compulsive gamblers--that winning money is not really what the compulsion is all about. It's the "action" the high that the addict, the compulsive feels when he looks at the tote board or rolls the dice or watches the game come down to the final seconds. He feels alive during those moments before he knows if he has won or lost and supposedly it's that feeling he seeks when he gambles over and over again, even when the gambling has resulted in heavy debt.

Is there a momentary high that a guy like Ted gets when he fabricates or is more just an impulse to impress or to belong that he can't resist ?

I guess it doesn't matter although as I read the posts here from you and others with the problem, I see that you guys have given thought to what initially began your cycle of lying.

Take care. Hope you are doing well.