A question from a Non to BPDs... help with my friend?

Thanks in advance to anyone who responds. I will try to make this as simple as possible. Basically when I was in my mid 20s I met a friend who was about 51 then, who was/is male to female trans. She told me then she was sexually attracted to men. I don't care about sexual orientation and the friendship was fine. I have anxiety issues and get panic attacks so I drank a lot in my mid 20s, and a few years ago I moved out of the apartment building. This friend started drinking constantly then. Her sexual orientation changed from liking men, to "bisexual" to lesbian (even though she is M-t-F trans). To make this as short as possible, she seems to become more and more unstable the longer she drinks. She threatens suicide and even homicide sometimes, and I never know what to do. She put a bag over her head and then phoned the police on herself and phoned me after that. I try to set boundaries with her and she becomes paranoid and thinks I don't care about her (she's told me that) and that will be when she threatens suicide or something worse. Sometimes she wakes me up fairly early (for me, I am a night owl) to rant and rave about things I have no power over, yet topics like her own death that she knows will scare me. She was supposed to have been assessed by a pdoc several times and keeps blowing them off. She hugs me too much and has told me she wants to "sleep" with me now, which triggers ME and I generally push her away (I don't like being hugged at the best of times and generally pull away if someone just taps me on the shoulder, but she tackle hugs me and I feel like I can't breathe). So I wriggle away or tell her to stop. Then she'll go into a rage. In fact, she gets angry pretty easily. Once she got angry because I bought her a hamburger and we were eating it in the wrong part of the city. She left the food on the ground and stomped away, swearing loudly.

for the longest time I just assumed all this unpredictable behavior was because she was trans and on a lot of hormones and the medical doctors didn't have the hormone balance right. So I tried to be as understanding as I could.

She recently (and unexpectedly) took a mountain bike I had stupidly left on her balcony and put it out in the alley until someone took it, knowing I am on a fixed income. I don't make friends easily but when I do I am very loyal. I have told her I care about her but will only discuss certain topics when she is sober, etc... my own counsellor tells me I might want to consider just ending the friendship. I don't know for sure if she is borderline or has another PD or what is going on. She doesn't seem to know from one day to the next who she is, what she likes, what she stands for, what her sexual orientation is, etc... her moods change from second to second and she can become extremely angry, quickly, which is a bit disconcerting to me. She doesn't pay attention to my own personal physical and emotional boundaries so I find myself spending less and less time around her. I don't want the friendship to end if it's possible to salvage it... that would be really sad, actually, as I think part of this behavior is being generated by fear of being rejected in the first place.

I don't know what to do though. I have tried to be patient, but I honestly do not find this person's company enjoyable any more, the near constant suicide and homicide threats are really getting on my nerves (at first I actually got scared and now I am used to them)- she is so unpredictable that I just don't know how to be a good friend. I think if I just up and leave she will tell herself that people will never accept her and just get worse, but I don't think I am helping her much as it is right now. My friend seems to see things in very black and white terms. For instance, if I get annoyed or angry at her behavior she can't seem to understand (even though I am about half her age) that its the behavior that is bothering me, not her.

So for those out there who are recovered BPDs, did you ever try to ruin a friendship to save yourself from being "rejected" first? How would you guys direct a Non to interact with someone who is, at the very least, acting very BPD right now (I'd know for sure but she kept putting off seeing a shrink)? I'm out of ideas.

Thanks and sorry for how long this.

Exactly what has this person ever done for you to ever consider her a friend? She holds you hostage by threatening suicide, she doesn’t respect your boundaries, she forces herself on you, and she takes advantage of you at every turn. What does she provide you other than perhaps a desire for drama or the feeling that you’re needed? I understand you want to be a good friend, but it sounds like you have a very one-sided relationship.

I tend to be a quiet borderline. I would turn more on myself than others. When I did lash out at others it’s because I felt hurt by them. I had (have) no skin. I get that your friend is struggling and in a lot of pain, but that’s no excuse for her behavior. She needs to be held accountable for her actions. You need to stand by your boundaries.

If she’s not willing to seek help and respect herself, there’s no reason for you stick around and be abused. If she wants to have a friendship with you, she’s going to have to work for it.

I honestly do not find this person's company enjoyable any more,

my own counsellor tells me I might want to consider just ending the friendship.

Sounds like good advice, and probably the only boundary that you'll be able to enforce.

So for those out there who are recovered BPDs, did you ever try to ruin a friendship to save yourself from being "rejected" first?

Yes, unfortunately I do this all the time. Then eventually come to regret it.

How would you guys direct a Non to interact with someone who is, at the very least, acting very BPD right now (I'd know for sure but she kept putting off seeing a shrink)? I

I think your councilor hit the nail on the head, end the friendship. If she's not willing to help herself, then there's nothing that you can do for her.

Exactly what has this person ever done for you to ever consider her a friend? She holds you hostage by threatening suicide, she doesn’t respect your boundaries, she forces herself on you, and she takes advantage of you at every turn. What does she provide you other than perhaps a desire for drama or the feeling that you’re needed? I understand you want to be a good friend, but it sounds like you have a very one-sided relationship.

I tend to be a quiet borderline. I would turn more on myself than others. When I did lash out at others it’s because I felt hurt by them. I had (have) no skin. I get that your friend is struggling and in a lot of pain, but that’s no excuse for her behavior. She needs to be held accountable for her actions. You need to stand by your boundaries.

If she’s not willing to seek help and respect herself, there’s no reason for you stick around and be abused. If she wants to have a friendship with you, she’s going to have to work for it.
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I copy and pasted from a previous post as I am not sure how to respond to individual posts, just the last one. Okay, what has she done to be my friend? When I was younger and got anxious or panicky at night she'd watch movies with me. Despite her problems with feeling unwanted, she was understanding about my anxiety disorder (I have a pretty severe form of panic disorder and technicaly also PTSD). She WAS a good friend and wasn't always like she is now, which is why I am curious, because this behavior seemed to come on when I moved out. She was moody before that (her "black moods") but not like this.

Honestly, life has enough natural ups and downs without added drama. Honestly, that's not it (I don't even really like watching dramatic movies)... and I have other friends. I don't need someone to feel "needed". I am a pretty independent person (I moved all the time growing up so I got used to being comfortable alone), but when I was going through bad anxiety at night she was there for me. I didn't make threats or pull the same behavior though, but I feel sort of guilty at the idea of dumping her... I already know it's impossible to fix someone else. So now I just really keep my distance. Also, when I moved out (I am on disability for my anxiety disorders) I was (and still am) in transitional housing (I am moving into permanent housing soon) and I wasn't allowed to keep my elderly cat. I told her and she offered to take care of my cat and has done a really good job, even though she is not an animal lover (although she has threatened me sometimes, when she is mad, that she might hurt my cat or take her to the SPCA... I KNOW she wouldn't, but it's still aggrivating- I get my cat back very soon!). But basically she HAS done kind things and has a kind soul at her core. I am fairly poor and I didnt have a DVD player years ago and she bought me one as a surprise, so I could have a way to watch movies when I was anxious. And like I said, while she was unstable before, she didn't act like this before, and I was under the impression that PDs started earlier in life. I know she takes seroquel for her alcohol addiction and I know that people react differently to meds so I also wondered if the meds were making her worse.

I have been standing by my boundaries actually. If she phones me now in a rage, I generally tell her I don't deserve it and hang up. Ten seconds later the phone will ring again and I put it on mute. I think part of why I put up with the behavior so much is that my mother was very unstable the entire time I was growing up so I just assume sometimes its "normal" when other people behave like that, until I get super stressed, sit down, and think about what's going on.

I realize she needs to work to get better, but I feel like a hypocrite, I guess, if I dump her, because I had so much panic and anxiety and fear (and still do sometimes) and was really having trouble coping with the panic day to day, almost house-bound. I have been assessed and don't have a PD. I don't have anything against anyone with them, I guess part of it is that I feel that she saw me through some rough times and its my duty to do the same for her... I didn't threaten suicide or make threats though and I didn't go from being happy with her to being in a rage in literally seconds, nothing like that. I didn't invade her physical boundaries (not that she had any, but I don't with anyone). But she talked me down when I was panicking, we had fun times watching movies and she has told me that I am the only person she has ever met since she transitioned who sees her as a person and doesn't care about her being transexual, and I know the stats for suicide amongst trans people (really high!) so I do actually worry. Maybe I am being selfish, because I know if I stopped being her friend and she DID hurt herself (kill herself) I'd feel guilty (even if it's not really my fault). I guess it comes down to caring about her... her behavior is annoying sometimes, but the person under the behavior I do care about, and I don't want to see her suffer or feel badly if I can help it. But I also not going to screw myself up anymore than I already am!

Great situation, huh? I am not particularly thin skinned (it IS possible to hurt my feelings) but I am not super thin skinned either. It takes quite a lot to hurt my feelings, compared to most people apparently so my feelings aren't being hurt, it's just more irritating than anything else. I am scheduled to go over to her place with another friend for christmas eve dinner, and she DID phone me sober the other day and asked if I wanted to watch a movie some time, which was a perfectly reasonable request. But since then, no phone calls. But yeah, she didn't always act like this (if she'd been like this from the beginning I wouldn't feel so conflicted now). It just sucks. But I have been keeping my distance.

Ahhh, I am probably not explaining this very well. But just so you guys know, I haven't been over there in a while.

Thanks for the responses. They were helpful. I am not going to make any quick decisions (I tend to take a long time to make decisions, especially when they involve other people) but I am protecting myself emotionally. Thanks again. I was beginning to feel like I was crazy or like I was responsible for her mood swings, even though logically I don't see how I could've done that.

Thank you both again.

As a Borderline, you need to know that we often do destroy realtionships. but we also have to eventually accepty responsibility for yourself. dont let her drag your health back down. you seem to be an amazing friend, i dont think you should cut her off but i do believe you should back off, untill she either accpets she needs help (coz Boderline or not, it seems she does need help. badly) be there to support her on the proviso that she starts helping herself. otherwise, you need to look after you. and leave.

Yeah, I know. It makes sense. Can I ask you, or anyone who feels the urge to answer- when you destroy relationships, is it intentional, or subconscious? If you do it intentionally, do you know why? I am just curious how it works. I realize that everyone gets into arguments sometimes, even the most healthy people and nothing in life is perfect. I have had a friend since I was 16 and we are close, in 12 years we've had a few (maybe 2 or 3) arguments. Once I didn't talk to her for 2 months... we just were stressed and mutually decided to take a break from one another. But that was actually healthy, gave us a chance to calm down and talk without saying stupid things when we were angry.

But why do (some) people with BPD destroy relationships? Is it a fear of being rejected?

Also, this is totally OT, but do you guys ever feel more stigmatized than other people with psych conditions, even other PDs? Does me referring to myself as a "non" upset anyone? It feels (to me) like this boundary people put up, like a fence... on one side there are the "non-borderlines" and on the other the "borderlines" and there seems to be a lot of stigma against people with BPD, so I was just wondering how you guys felt about that, even though its OT?

I will take care of myself, don't worry. I guess I just wanted to ask and see if I was being unreasonable or something. It's not all or nothing though. I can take care of myself without completely cutting her out of my life... just set the boundaries very clearly and stick to them.

Thank you guys.