What's the difference between Rapid Cycling Bipolar and BPD?

And by BPD, I mean Borderline Personality Disorder (not bipolar disorder - there wasn't enough space in the title to fit the whole thing.) You know, the one that's supposedly the result of trauma as opposed to the "all-biological" bipolar that just seems to strike people at random. Or so I've read.

So, is there a difference? I'm mostly asking because I'm concerned about the treatment for it (BPD is supposedly cured with "talk therapy" and dialectical behavior therapy - while the standard treatment for bipolar seems to be "oh just take your medication and you'll be fine!")

I really want to know... can someone explain?

There's more to BPD than just mood swings. People with it have really intense abandonment fears and tend to alternate between idealizing and demonizing people. There's even more to it than just that...

BPD is much more reactive than bipolar. If I'm cycling, I'm going to cycle regardless of things going on around me. When I talk about triggers I'm referring to things that if happen during an episode, will cause me to do things I'll later regret. Triggers in the context of someone who has BPD actually start the mood swings. (There's some variation with what some people report here with bipolar...)

Years ago I read an article that argued that the two disorders were actually essentially the same and that people with both disorders should use both therapy and meds for treatment. This isn't a popular view though...

I agree, BPD is not just about rapidly cycling mood (which are triggered by things and linked to emotions). there is the stuff Exiled said and also there are things like a feeling of emptiness and other diagnostic criteria. bipolar can share things with BPD like the mood swings and also an example is self harm which ppl with bipolar sometimes do and is pretty common in BPD.

I personally think that bipolar does well with both meds and therapy - my health trust offers a CBT based course for ppl with bipolar to help them with relapse prevention and other talk therapy is helpful too - I believe it has been said that DBT can be helpful in bipolar.

BPD does well with DBT and also at times with meds so I think there is prob an arguement that the treatment for both is pretty similar- tho of course needs to be tailored to the individual.

The traditional thinking is that BPD is about trauma and emotions and things causing mood swings and bipolar is more biological. I suspect there is more to it than that but I dont know what the latest research says.

Sorry prob not much help but just some thoughts

Cracked

I have BP1 and BPD. Before I went through DBT, there was no way I could identify the two separately. Now that I have skills to try regulate my interpersonal relationships, emotions, distress, etc, I can tell the difference. One does not lead the other...they exist side-by-side. If I am unmediated, my bipolar anger, psychosis, mania and depression tend to make it really difficult to use/access any skills, and my BPD gets worse. When well-medicated, I am calm and have clarity to see I'm still challenged in my ability to be interpersonally effective, I've got no identity, feel empty, bored and restless, but I can access my skills and try. The bipolar is really strong, but feels only controllable by meds, whereas my BPD needs skills. Medication didn't remove my BPD issues. No DBT skills are going to help me regulate my BP1 chemistry, which runs it's own course and makes me feel out-of-control and helpless if unmedicated. Finally, mania is a unique beast, and the $#%^ I do in that state is completely out-of-control and I just laugh at the idea of trying to regulate mania with behavior modification. Hope this helps!

Caribee: When you say they exist side-by-side, you don't mean to say that it's just a coincidence that you have the two disorders, do you? What I meant was that the stuff that leads to BPD (fear of abandonment, invalidation, etc) could be present in people genetically predisposed to bipolar that have a history of trauma, and because they are more emotionally volatile, are more likely to develop BPD symptoms?

I know in my case, I have symptoms of BPD (I generally don't self-harm, though I get very angry if someone I trust says or does something hurtful to me, but if it's someone random, I won't overreact.) Basically, everything depends on the mood I'm in. But doctors have suggested that I'm not even bipolar and it may just be entirely BPD, which really upsets my mother, as she can't live with the fact that she exposed me to so much trauma as a child that it caused me to develop this. Yet they keep me on my medication? I don't want to keep taking this stuff unless I "need" it.

One thing that definitely affects me is sleep. If I don't get it, I get manic-like, though I can go back to sleep and that changes it. I know that's a bipolar thing, my thought process is affected me no matter what the people around me are doing. But at the same time, this is all I've known my whole life, so maybe this is how it goes with "normal" people too? I don't know.

Often wonder if I've got BPD side dish with my rapid BP II.. Bipolar comes and goes; only actual outside trigger being high/sudden stress. My possible BPD however comes and goes depending of outside triggers - bad evening in bar -> anger, with not leaving bed in couple of days -depression; good day (such as mom dropping by and/or getting hug) -> instant mood uplift, strong enough to lift my mood from BP's depression, temporarily at least.

For the record; being pessimist by nature (which most people don't want to understand and want to fix) helps somewhat with the BPD's downkicks; expect things to go bad, and falling down isn't as big surprise and easier to handle.

So BPD depressive trigger on top of BP's depressive cycle results in nothing good, to put in nicely.

Although if the BPD doesn't fit all symptoms (as doesn't any other PD), doesn't that make it PD-NOS? (Personality disorder - not otherwise specified)