Your experiences with professional help.

Hi,

I have been lurking around at this forum for some days and I thought I drop a question that may interest some of you here.

To start with, a little bit about me. I’m a 46 years old single male. I never had, and will most likely never have, a romantic relationship with a woman even though I desperately urge for it. I consider myself a contradiction as I function well in my working life but fails horrible in my social life. I can do anything asked of me at work without breaking a sweat but as soon as anything personal is added to the equation I simply shut down. I have run some tests on the internet and score high on AvPD and SPD. I’m not really sure where I stand; I just know that I have come to a point where even the slightest interest in me personally has to be avoided at all costs. Relationships are just pointless, I can not give and thus never receive. This goes for anyone - neighbors, relatives and friends are no longer a part of my isolated life.

I have had a series of major depressions during the last 15 years and have been on SSRI twice. One of them was so severe that I even tried CBT but gave it up after three months of pointless and painful (it took hours to recover after each session) weekly meetings. I never understood the purpose of the treatment and the therapist never understood the root of my problems I assume. To be added here is that I have years of experience with the health care system in my country since I had a major accident as a child (65% third degree burns). The expression I have of professionals is not good. It is not that I don’t trust all of them; they saved my life after all. It is rather that I feel like a piece of meat in a hopelessly impersonal and uncaring machinery that is always looking for the fastest and cheapest short term solution. Thus, the problems are never solved.

To the point; I would like your opinions on the effects of therapy and how to successful pursue help. I really have no clue where, or how, to start. Should I start with a proper diagnosis? Have you had different experiences between public and privately financed health care? Are there any therapy forms that you have had any success with? Has any long term medication helped? I have a lot of these questions like these, more than I can think of right now.

Your experiences are most appreciated.

/Angler

P.S. Also, how do you handle a situation where you lost all trust for therapists? Last time I had a major depression I first ended up with someone putting me on SSRI and running all possible tests on me to find out if there were any physical problems. After that I complained (I have been like this as long as I can remember, duh) I was sent to an even worse nut case that recommended the book ‘The Secret’ by Rhonda Byrne. I gave up and have never returned. This was three years ago. D.S.

Hey,

My life kind of mirrors yours so far, and Im 26 now. Ive been on SSRIs twice, do very well academically/professionally, but suck at socialising. I suspect that we just never allowed our brains the chance to develop it's social 'side'. I have had CBT too, but I viewed it positively. I was lcky in that I got a good therapist - maybe you just got a 'bad' one. I mean, not every two people are compatible, and maybe you and her/he clashed in whatever way. Were you completely open with the therapist? He/she cannot do everything, and the point of CBT is that the patient actually does most of the therapy.

Kevin

I have had let me think:

Groeptherapy
Idividual therapy
Therapy where you had to ''dance with feelings'' dont know the word for it in english
Therapy where you had to draw the things you felt inside

Years later I stared with cbt and can honeslty say it has been the most effective form of treatment I have so far . It's kind of hard to just go and reproggram yourself , it requireses a lot from you . But it can be done as long as your willing to take riks and your presistant in the whole proces

My guess is that you have to fiend something that works for you and stick with it . Im whising you the best with that

My situation is close to yours. I'm even about the same age. I have had the same experiences with therapists. My problem is that my anxiety over work can get so severe that I have to do something. When I got hospitalized 15 years ago they just wanted to give me antipsychotic drugs, but I refused. I was not having psychosis, just severe anxiety. Only be being very proactive was I able to get help for the anxiety. But they still pursued an involuntary medication order for antipsychotics. That really put me off any therapists for 13 years.

For help with my personal and social life I came to online groups like this. I went to a few hookers. I liked the hookers. I would go to more, but I got laid off from my job and can't afford them.

I will tell you what I tell everyone - it can be really hard to find a therapist who can help you. You may have to go to several before you find a decent one. I've heard good things about CBT. But I've also heard some say it was too painful for them. Gradual exposure desensitization therapy seems to work for me fortunately. That's how I was able to finally get into full time work. I started out doing a 10 hour per week job and gradually added hours.

Hi, Angler!
Reading your thread, a question arises to my mind. You say that you have no problems with your job. Are you referring to the present or your avoidace or whatever it was, never affected your job? I ask you this because I have even had problems with this in spide of I adore my job.

As for the question you asked, experience with therapists, as a rule, my experince is quite possitive. I don´t think I could have been able to work without a therapists help.

My first phycologist (cognitive-behavioral approach)was a really good proffessional, he helped me in my first years of proffessional life. I never had worked before and I was overcoming a period of 7 years of isolation. No med at all. I only have a phychologist. Then, I had a relapse and I told him that I didn´t believe noone could do anything for me. This was a serious depression stage.

My second phychologist (behavioral approach) was ok in a first moment but when I was two hours filling an giant test, and in the next sessions, he talked me about other patients including a co-worker of mine. I left him.

The third professional was a phychiatrists (phychoanalisis approach). After a couple of sessions where I only talked and he took notes. I left him.

The forth therapists (behavioral approach) was good during a time, but she only worked the surface. So I left her.

Then, I came back to my first phychologists and he helped me for a time so up to arrive to a point where I don´t improve.

My fifth therapists (cognitive-behavioral approach) was really helpfull for me. She knows my oddyssey of relapses and phychotherapies and she was really open-minded with my present demands, I want to mean that I tried to give her some information of the things I need to work in order to improve and she provided me with lots of skills.
As you know, its not only a question of a good or bad therapists, it´s about how you take advantage of the therapy.

Good luck and well come!

Thanks for the responses,

The reason why CBT had little, or none, effect on me has bugged me a lot. I sincerely hoped it would help when I started, but it didn’t. When I finished the treatment nothing had changed. I also believe I was honest with the therapist. At that point I had nothing to loose. In my opinion the therapy failed since:

- I was remitted to CBT since I was suffering from a major depression. Thus, this was what my therapist tried to ‘fix’.
- The therapist never tried to give me a diagnosis, something I now believe is extremely important. How can a patient be expected to break away from something when there is no definition?
- The treatment itself was extremely painful for someone like me whose core is to avoid very personal questions at all costs. After each session I was totally drained. It’s hard to describe; think ‘white noise’ or ‘white snow’ in the mind and it took hours to get out of that of it, each time.
- I was on SSRI and was gradually getting better from my depression and I got to the point where life was not unbearable anymore. Thus, given the meager results and the pain of the treatment it was far easier to just quit. My therapist agreed.

Best regards,
Angler

Twistermind,

Regarding my job; I believe I have no avoidance problems when I look at my occupation. I work at a large company as a specialist, attend a lot of meetings without any anxiety even though there are complete strangers attending, travel a lot and meet people worldwide. I’m comfortable in my role and I know what I’m doing. I do admit that major depression spells do have an impact on my performance but they are temporary and the performance slump is to be expected.

Privately I’m the exact opposite and I avoid contact as much as possible. I just can’t handle any interest in me as a person. If go down to the local pub for a pizza and a beer I always hide behind a newspaper to avoid contact, I never go out partying because I feel completely out of place surrounded by strangers I’m supposed to interact with, female companionship is completely out of the question because it’s impossible without any intimacy, I don’t have any contact with my relatives since they dig into my private ‘life’, I even keep my closest friend at bay after he and his wife expressed their worries about me, heck - I don’t even open the door if someone rings on my doorbell anymore, etc., etc., the list goes on.

To me it’s a completely absurd situation. I actually enjoy people.

Best regards,
Angler

Do you drink more than just a beer or two? Lots of avoidants are only able to get sex and relationships because they drink like fish. I guess when you're drunk you can be a totally different person. I've never been drunk and I don't ever intend to be since alcoholism runs in my family. But maybe if I had been a drunk I wouldn't have ended up being a 40 year old virgin.

Do you feel major anxiety around women? Are you able to flirt at all? You can practice these skills with waitresses and cashiers. I've done it. It helps a bit. Not as much as the hookers. What about strip clubs? You can get a private dance and practice talking to a beautiful naked woman. Just go someplace far away from where you live so you won't have to worry about seeing her anywhere. Then you can talk to her about what you want. Hookers are really much better. I'm sure she won't mind if you don't want to actually have sex. Get a classy $350 per hour girl. Maybe just get a massage. It will relax you and you will be able to get used to being with a woman. You say you travel. You must go to places where it is perfectly legal, so you don't have to even worry about that aspect.

The other route to go with a therapist is to look into a specialist in sex therapy. I take it you must have anxiety over that. I did and stil do a lot. Look up AASECT. AASECT stands for American Association of Sex Educators Counselors and Therapists. They may have someone who can help. I believe that in some places you can get surrogate therapy. It's something I thought about a couple of years ago. I even called ISPA (International Professional Surrogates Association) at one point and found out that there was a surrogate program about 4 hours from me. I never followed up and went. If I ever do I will definitely let everyone here know all about it.

I know doing any of these things will be very hard for you. But if you want to make progress you are going to have to push yourself. I won't kid you - at your age this is going to be difficult. I don't see how I could ever have a relationship now. I'm far too used top being on my own and being able to do what I want when I want.

Hi Angler,

I read your post and this reminded me of something:

Parador wrote:To be added here is that I have years of experience with the health care system in my country since I had a major accident as a child (65% third degree burns).

A while back I was desperately looking for some kind of therapy or workshop or group that would actually help me to get better because so far I have only found help with some of the symptoms of my 'illness'. I stumbled onto this site:

http://www.healmyptsd.com

The fact that you have had a major childhood trauma made me think that perhaps you have PTSD, which is exactly what the woman who runs this site has recovered from. She suddenly got a very rare illness which caused severe burn like pain all over her body and she never dealt with the trauma of it on an emotional level. There is a free workshop on the site and lots of really helpful information. No payment involved at all..... quite amazing these days.

I started doing the workshop and found the section about 'learning how to talk about trauma' very helpful. I realized that there were huge parts of who I am that I have never shared with anyone.... I didn't complete the workshop, because I don't have PTSD from an isolated incident, but just learning that one thing about myself became a stepping stone to talking more honestly to a therapist who I was already seeing..... not too successfully up to that point.

I'm not sure if you still have unresolved emotional issues from your childhood accident and treatment or not, it sounds like you do, and maybe other emotional issues you have developed since. But what I learned from one section of the PTSD site (above) was that if I don't learn how to open up and be honest about who I really am with at least one person in my life, then I am never going to be able to relax and trust anyone enough to get close enough to have anything resembling a 'real' relationship.

I am now seeing a different psychologist, the one I talked openly to was a counselor kind of therapist. The new one is helping me in a different kind of way..... I think I need both kinds of help though, but was told that different methods at one time are counter-productive..... hmmm!

Anyway, just wanted to share that site with you, didn't mean to ramble on

Good luck and I hope you keep looking for the right kind of help.

Angler wrote: In my opinion the therapy failed since:

- I was remitted to CBT since I was suffering from a major depression. Thus, this was what my therapist tried to ‘fix’.

I suppouse you begun therapy once you recovered a bit from your depression.

- The therapist never tried to give me a diagnosis, something I now believe is extremely important. How can a patient be expected to break away from something when there is no definition?

Only if you need to know it. Did you ask your Phychiatrist and your therapist? I did it and they both gave me the same dignosis.

- The treatment itself was extremely painful for someone like me whose core is to avoid very personal questions at all costs. After each session I was totally drained. It’s hard to describe; think ‘white noise’ or ‘white snow’ in the mind and it took hours to get out of that of it, each time.

Ok, so what are you waiting for? Look for another therapist. Try to be as sincere as possible and tell her/him all you feel or need. I don´t know, but it could had happened that you wwere so depressive and blocked that therapy didn´t do anything for you in the past.

Regarding about your job. I was thinking when I made you the question and it has sense. I feel quite normal in my job, when most of the time I know what I have to do or say. The problem arises when there is an unexpected or a special situation.