I have to report something to adult protective services.

I think that Ikari Shinji was just implying that some laws are immoral by their very nature. I mean, there are many more severe crimes out there than dating one of your patients; and yet if you were convicted of doing this, you'd probably be punished much more severely than many of those other crimes.

If you have told your executive director about this, then the ball is out of your court, right?

Kevin

First off, I have absolutely no respect for the law at all.

Sure a doctor taking advantage of an emotionally vulnerable patient is horrible. But you said these people started seeing each other when they were both patients, and even though that has changed each one is still as ###$ up as the other. We have no idea if anyone is doing anything immoral and even who it is, a patient can take advantage of people too.

Maybe they are in love too. Two crazy ###$ up people find solace in each others' arms and we have to take that away from them?



Sometimes I'm an asshole though and there is nothing wrong with covering your own ass if you have a legal obligation to report this. But then again, the way you describe your work place is it really likely that you would get in trouble for something like this? Nobody else seems to care, including your superiors. You've already diffused the responsibility by informing all your superiors and you could get out of any legal trouble by saying that you felt you were under pressure to not report it from your boss.

And you hate your life anyway, who cares about a legal slap on the wrist on top of it.

If you have told your executive director about this, then the ball is out of your court, right?

No. I am mandated to report to Adult Protective Services. I just sent an e-mail to them describing the situation. Now I'm fully covered. I really would like clarification on this situation. I think if this guy wants to be with a patient or former patient he should go get another job.

Here's another point. This guy keeps insisting that he doesn't have to obey lots of rules because he is considered a vulnerable adult. I have to supervise this guy. Have you ever tried to supervise a guy who thinks the rules don't apply to him?

have a legal obligation to report this. But then again, the way you describe your work place is it really likely that you would get in trouble for something like this?

Yes. It is possible. Sometimes a scapegoat is needed. This guy brutally killed a woman years ago. If he does something again I'm not taking the blame. What if she breaks up with him and he loses control? It could happen. Then people are going to asking who knew about the relationship. He has been open about it and will tell everyone that I knew about it and was alright with it. I need to make it clear that I am NOT alright with it. I told my staff that they MUST report things like this.

And you hate your life anyway, who cares about a legal slap on the wrist on top of it.

This could result in much more than a slap on the wrist for me. I could get fired, and fined $100,000. In theory I could even face prison time. I'm already depressed. Something like that could push me over the edge.

I don't understand how reporting a possible crime can be considered immoral. This guy is insisting that he has the right to have relations with patients even though it is clearly against the law. He can if he quits his hospital job.

...sigh. I NEVER said that doing so was immoral. I simply said that in a situation such as the one you are currently in, morality is completely irrelevant. Wether this is right or wrong matters very little if anything at all, the only thing that matters is that the law says that you have to report it and if you don't you could face serious consequence.

To be completely honest, if I was in your position, the thought of wether this was right or wrong would have never crossed my mind, not for even half a second. I don't understand why are you so adamant about justifying your decision. I mean, does it truly matter at all?

I think that Ikari Shinji was just implying that some laws are immoral by their very nature. I mean, there are many more severe crimes out there than dating one of your patients; and yet if you were convicted of doing this, you'd probably be punished much more severely than many of those other crimes.

That isn't exactly what I meant. What I basically meant to say is that there are times in your life when you must do morally objectable things. As simple as that. Don't get me wrong though, I'm not saying that the end justyfies the means, I'm just saying that sometimes you have to do the wrong thing (Note that I am using the words right and wrong in entirely moral terms.).

Two crazy ###$ up people find solace in each others' arms and we have to take that away from them?

Yes, if it means not going to jail, paying a fine or losing your job.

...sigh. I NEVER said that doing so was immoral. I simply said that in a situation such as the one you are currently in, morality is completely irrelevant. Wether this is right or wrong matters very little if anything at all, the only thing that matters is that the law says that you have to report it and if you don't you could face serious consequence.

OK - sorry. I'm uptight. I've got too much crap going on.

Remember that there is a central issue here, so please don't 'nit-pick' comments from peoples' posts. If you do that, the thread loses focus, and I'm just not in the damn mood to be dealing with stuff right now.

I reporetd it by e-mail. But a copy did not end up in my sent messages file. So I'm going to call and see if I can get a copy of what I wrote.

I also want to point out to everyone that I got locked up for two years after being accused of only simple assault years ago. People get 30 day suspended sentances for that. So you can see that I've gotten the shaft before in life. I don't want it happening here.

Yeh, I can now understand more why this issue is concerning you so much. In my opinion, punishment are not fairly balanced amongst different crimes. For example, a rapist can get a year or two in jail but, if you commit fraud, you can get 10+ years.

Indeed, and have you looked at the news lately? All you hear about is financial stuff: stock markets, food prices, mortgage prices, big companies going bust, etc. Did you know, for example, that there was a stampede in India a few days ago that killed 10's of people? If you didn't know, that's because it was barely reported. Oh, and bombs are still going off in Iraq each day. We had one 'Omagh' within the past decade; Iraq has an 'Omagh' everyday.

For those who aren't Irish: 'Omagh' is a town in Northern Ireland that was bombed by (it's assumed) the Irish Republican Army. 16 people died as far as I know.