Advice for wife of a possible AvPD who also has mental illne

Hi. Can any of you who have AvPD please give me some advice on how to be a better partner to my husband? Could you let me know how he feels in these situations, and where his actions/thoughts come from? If you have a moment, I would really appreciate it. If this is the wrong place please let me know.

I think he may have AvPD. He hasn't been to a doctor, but I see traits. Examples: no great need for socializing, shy, doesn't like arguing and gets extremely upset when we do, escapism, seems to be distancing himself lately, and other things I'm not 100% sure on because I'm not in his head. He's experienced depression and seems oversensitive to criticism (however, I'm too quick to criticize). I think he doesn't understand his emotions or emotions in general very well. He's very logical. I don't want to go too in-depth to protect his privacy.

We're arguing all the time lately and I feel terrible. My mental health problems are bipolar disorder (type 2), GAD, and BPD traits. BPD diagnosis is not confirmed. I had a screwed up childhood with some learned behaviors and attitudes that are not good.

We've been together for 5 years and married and living together for less than a year. The problems between us have come up in the past year. Normally, we're quick to joke and laugh, and are loving and supportive to each other. When we fight though, it's horrible, and it causes deep wounds that take a long time to heal -- in my opinion, partly because he doesn't like to address the fights and work on healing them, he wants to ignore them. The other side of the coin is that I don't let stuff go.

I know "get couples counseling" is the answer here. We're working on it. It's in the process. But I'd like some perspective. We have a good thing. I don't want to leave him and I really don't want to hear "wow you guys are horrible get a divorce." Because this is a list of all our problems condensed. We don't fight every day -- this list isn't our day-to-day life. It's a highlights reel of a rough patch in our 5-year-long relationship that is filled with happy memories.

Specific problems:

He doesn't like to resolve fights, and I can't let them go. I want to fix them and me trying to fix them upsets him more. He says it's like a scab that I just pick and pick and won't let it go.

He gets more hurt by fighting than I do. I grew up in a family that was angry all the time and I'm used to high levels of anger. He's not. He says worse things in a fight than I do, but him saying those things causes me to say hurtful things too. I used to never say "###$ you" but after so long of hearing it I gave in within the past 6 months and now say things like that right back to him.

He's afraid of my anger. He says I'm volatile sometimes and that he's walking on eggshells to avoid my anger -- because I go from 0 to angry in no time. His anger is explosive as well, but not in the same way -- I can predict when he'd get angry whereas for me I have a sensitive trigger at times and that makes our home life unpredictable for him and that is really hurtful to him. Anyway with him I'm not walking on eggshells, but I can't seem to express any negativity about our relationship (big or small) without him blowing up at me due to being overly defensive. He "blows up" a lot bigger than I do. When he blows up, he takes what I said literally and meaning that it's always like that. I do that sometimes too. What can I do when he's super mad? I isolate myself, which makes it worse. Aside from saying I'm sorry and never mentioning the topic again, I don't know what to do -- and I don't want to do that, because then the problem happens again because it wasn't resolved.

Also -- he hardly ever expresses dissatisfaction about me/our relationship. I think he's afraid of conflict, and I think he's building resentment due to it. I know "mind reading" isn't constructive and I shouldn't guess what's happening inside his head. But still.

I think he also doesn't understand things that bother me -- why it hurts, how I feel, why I'm not just "letting it go". He has trouble empathizing at times. I think I do too. His trouble empathizing causes a fair number of fights. My trouble empathizing perpetuates these fights.

Related, he doesn't seem to hear me when we resolve things and will do that thing again. For example, pretend I explained to him a lot about why X thing bothered me. We took a long time to have me understand why he did X thing and have him understand why X thing bothers me and why I don't want him to do it again. He will do X thing again, we'll have the same fight, he'll say he won't do X thing again (again). Then he does X thing again and it comes out that he always thought that my reason for being upset by X thing was wrong and he "can do whatever he wants" and my reason is bad and invalid. This happens over weeks/months.

He says that any good that there is is made worthless by a fight, and that the good he does doesn't matter anymore to me, once I am unhappy about something. This is a combination of how he thinks I feel and how he's feeling. I don't feel that way. I can be angry and let it go and feel fine again and remember the good times. He feels a fight ruins an entire good day and says he will always remember that day as a day we fought, rather than a day we went out on a special trip and spent time together (and fought at the end of the day as an unimportant footnote).

He seems unable to accept responsibility for his role in the conflict, and it seems like it's always my fault. He says the same about me -- that I don't accept my role in the conflict and always make it out to be his fault. Due to my mental illness, I honestly don't know what's true. Because I do get irritable about nothing. He does as well. And he bottles things up and I only find out 3-4 days later (with some pushing) that he's been pissy about something he didn't tell me. And I would've been a lot more understanding about him being crabby if he just told me what was going on.

He says I bait him into fights. He says I pick fights and then make it all his fault. I don't know if I do this and I'm scared because it's very likely true.

He has a hard time apologizing. I'm not sure he understands how to apologize and I've tried multiple times to walk him through the process.

I have a hard time approaching him to make up after a fight. I think he gets more hurt because I don't approach him.

He doesn't understand my feelings about being rejected.

I'm a control freak. He can't stand feeling controlled. I'm trying so hard to back off though.

He's distancing himself lately (physically). He doesn't understand why it hurts me. I'm not sure I understand why it hurts me either. I also have a hard time understanding his need to check out and escape. I don't know how to deal with it/how not to take it personally. He doesn't deal well with me pushing away either.

Finally, he hates talking about any of this! Nearly every time I try to have a conversation about any ongoing issue he gets very upset, overly defensive, and we end up fighting instead of resolving. I can't just say to him "hey I noticed I'm a control freak and you can't stand feeling controlled. How can I fix this?" He won't have that conversation with me. It'll turn into a fight because I'll push him to talk about it. He'll say something like "I don't have a problem with that, don't tell me what I'm feeling! You're being critical, you're a perfectionist" etc. and it goes back and forth like that with me saying similar things about him. But, if I didn't try and resolve it, then me being a control freak is just causing ongoing problems!

If anyone could offer me some insight on his side of things I'd really appreciate it.

You might want to google the phrase dismissive avoidant attachment. People with that attachment style are so scared of rejection that they cannot face any conflict or any suggestion that they've done something wrong. They don't necessarily know that though, a lot of it is repressed and they can be completely unaware of what is actually going on in their mind. So it comes out as out-of-proportion anger and fault finding in others rather than themselves. If he does have this attachment style then his thoughts and actions are coming from "I cannot allow her to reject me". Which is so incredibly ironic, dontcha think.

I would say you both need individual therapy as well as couples therapy. In the meantime getting angry with him is going to make any disagreement far worse, even when you are justifiably angry. You have to speak calmly and pepper what you say with reassurances that you aren't angry with him, that you just want to work out why this has happened (appeal to his logical side not his emotions). It will be very difficult to do this I know. I would bet that 90% of your arguments are about your and his reactions to the original disagreement, rather than the original disagreement itself.

To help him express dissatisfaction try wording it as asking him what he needs. He might be out of touch with his needs and/or find it hard to ask for them to be met. So this will get him to think about it a bit more and gives him the chance to tell you. Don't react badly to whatever he says otherwise it will put him off being honest in future.

I don't see AvPD in his behavior at all. I do see the possibility that he is giving up on the relationship and that your personal issues might be warping your perspective. Couples therapy might not be an option, but I think you definitely need individual therapy.

He takes what you say literally... Um, yes, that is completely normal. You're the one with the problem if you think he shouldn't.

He doesn't understand things that bother you... Again, those are your problems. No one else is required to get inside your head, though if you work on your communication skills he might understand you better.

He doesn't express dissatisfaction with you... For the life of me I can't understand how that could be an issue, unless you are a drama queen who can't tolerate peace and stability.

Get therapy. You're driving away a nice guy who cares for you. Do it now. It might still be too late. He's not going to put up with your behavior much longer.

inverse you are way off mark in regards to our problems and rereading my post I see that a lack of specific examples could be the problem (or perhaps you took personal offense to this for some reason or take issue with my description of myself).

No he might not have AVPD but he certainly has traits of it which is why I've asked here.

If you are reacting negatively to my own admissions of mental illness then good for you I guess but I don't have BPD just see traits of it in myself which is quite common for bipolars.

The degree to which he takes things literally is not completely normal. If I said its raining cats and dogs you don't take had literally do you. He doesn't communicate in metaphors as easily as I do and that causes communication problems (this is one example of taking things literally). Most people communicate using sarcasm, exaggeration, metaphors and various other non-literal devices and it is not normal to think it's literally raining cats and dogs (for example - my husband isn't like that, just don't have an example to mind).

He doesn't understand things had bother me - these aren't just "my problems." An inability to empathize with things either person experiences causes huge problems in a relationship. If you had just really hurt yourself physically and someone was just like "get over it, you broke your arm, of course t hurts" you'd be a bit miffed right? Now he doesn't do this. This is a silly example like the one above just made up to simply explain how things are. The "of course it's like that" sentiment though is one he uses and that can be hurtful.

I haven't driven him away, you've got no clue what the full picture is, this isn't our day to day life, but an example of the communication problems we have.

Not expressing dissatisfaction is a huge problem. If something really pisses him off and he never tells me and I keep doing it and then one day he finally blows up about it and I had no clue that me leaving my socks on the floor bugged him that much (an easy fix) that causes massive problems in our relationship. It takes 2 seconds to say pick your socks up honey that really bothers me so much and id get the message and not do it anymore. Instead he is secretly pissed about it for months leading for various fights that I don't know are actually because he's pissed about socks and a way out of proportion blowup months later.

I don't take kindly to being called a drama queen and frankly do not understand why you bothered to comment with your accusatory tone and total lack of advice. What's the point???? It sounds like you lack relationship experience yourself. Please don't bother to comment back, I will not respond and am posting this reply only to help the people who've read this thread perhaps in search of advice themselves and to provide clarity on the situation and reassure people that I'm not a drama queen causing made up problems due to my own mental illness. Your comment was entirely non constructive and I really don't appreciate it at all. Why bother commenting something so close minded and completely missing the picture.

AvoidantPenny thank you for your thoughtful advice I've found it very helpful. You are right that often were fighting about our reactions to things rather than actual issues. I really appreciate you explaining how my anger impacts his ability to communicate and I am realizing rejection is s fear of his too. So thank you for the info and it has helped me even in the week or so since I posted. We are set up to begin couples counseling but can't afford individual on top of it right now. We're trying really hard to eliminate things that lead to fights using different ways like charts and me being more anticipating his needs like you said, framing it that way. I think he is out of touch with what he needs and also reluctant to ask for it due to being afraid of me being upset or angry. He really wants to make me happy so badly and I want to make him happy so badly but we try to go about that in different ways. He tries so hard to make sure everything is perfect in regards to chores and me, being very disorganized, do my best with that but more so do my best to make sure we're having fun together and he's getting emotional support. So there's communication problems and such. Thanks again for your help

The only person you can control is yourself. I agree with inverse and AvoidantPenny that you need to get counseling. Nobody can read your husband's mind -- not you, and not anonymous people over the internet. If you find a good counselor, they can probably let you know if couples therapy would be helpful. But right now the very best thing you can do for your marriage is to find help for yourself and work on becoming healthy.

I wish you the very best.

inverse wrote:He doesn't understand things that bother you... Again, those are your problems. No one else is required to get inside your head, though if you work on your communication skills he might understand you better.

He doesn't express dissatisfaction with you... For the life of me I can't understand how that could be an issue, unless you are a drama queen who can't tolerate peace and stability.

Get therapy. You're driving away a nice guy who cares for you. Do it now. It might still be too late. He's not going to put up with your behavior much longer.

You don't understand how relationships work, do you? Both partners should be understanding of what bothers the other person and refrain from purposely doing things that they know will upset the other. It's basic respect and consideration.

When someone feels unable to express dissatisfaction it comes out in other ways such as them being grumpy or "off" and creates a horrible atmosphere. She actually says that's what's happening in her post, you must have missed it.

As for your conclusion...

- He doesn't like to resolve fights
- He says worse things in a fight than I do
- I used to never say "###$ you" but after so long of hearing it I gave in within the past 6 months and now say things like that right back to him.
- His anger is explosive as well
- I can't seem to express any negativity about our relationship (big or small) without him blowing up at me
- He "blows up" a lot bigger than I do
- it comes out that he always thought that my reason for being upset by X thing was wrong and he "can do whatever he wants" and my reason is bad and invalid.
- He says that any good that there is is made worthless by a fight,
- He seems unable to accept responsibility for his role in the conflict,
- he bottles things up and I only find out 3-4 days later (with some pushing) that he's been pissy about something he didn't tell me.
- He has a hard time apologizing
- he gets very upset, overly defensive, and we end up fighting instead of resolving.

Is that really your idea of a nice guy?

fishie wrote:He really wants to make me happy so badly and I want to make him happy so badly but we try to go about that in different ways.

Have you heard of the 5 languages of love, and there are also 5 languages of apology too. You don't need to buy the books, you can easily find descriptions online.

Have you considered talking with a therapist about how to approach him? It would be great if he would go with you for couples counselling, but you cannot force him into therapy.

I think a therapist could help you figure out a communication style that might help your husband be more comfortable addressing conflict with you.

*mod edit*