AsPDs and Psychopaths raising Children

"Manipulate" may be a strong statement and not very accurate in that regard. Certainly not in your case. Some people do cry in order to manipulate, but it is more adults that do that. Or people that come from families where it works.

I would describe it more as some form of primal communication type. It may not be so much about having it your way as being unable to make pain stop. When it is genuine, it comes because of some pain or hurt. So it is a way of saying it. Sometimes it can also be a sign of feeling impotent or unempowered. Hopelessness is never very far from that emotion. It is not something do take lightly if you care about the person.

It is also an opportunity for bonding. Failure from someone to act on it properly can lead to a lack of trust in the long run. There is no reason to trust someone that does not care about hurting you, or letting you get hurt.

Onebravegirl wrote:Crying can also be about frustration. Not having the words or even understanding to communicate what is inside. Kind of like a baby. Communication is such a skill. If it isnt learned or fully developed, a person will revert back to what they know. For some it is rage (temper tantrums) for others it may be crying.
I know some Asian cultures smile when they are uncomfortable. It can look insensitive to others sometimes but it was what they learned to do from early on.
One

LOL i had an asian friend in highschool with social anxiety, and he would smile when anxious or uncomfortable.. funniest thing ever. People thought he was on some sort of upper. Cause he's just sit there, smile and nod, and say the very least amount of words possible. lol

Tungsten wrote:It is also an opportunity for bonding. Failure from someone to act on it properly can lead to a lack of trust in the long run. There is no reason to trust someone that does not care about hurting you, or letting you get hurt.

Interesting, so she could be crying some times because she's hurting inside, my angry intolerant reaction to her crying, she's probably seeing as me getting mad at her for hurting? Then again, it's her own damn fault lol if she wasn't so sensitive. Maybe getting angry/annoyed with her for feeling hurt over stupid things will tougher her up a bit.

Tempest80 wrote:I also know I would give my life to save theirs.

How do you know you would give your life to save theirs if you have never been in a situation to prove it?
I too have a child and have often thought the same as you, but the more I've thought about it, the more I've come to realize it's possible I would put my own life before hers if the situation ever truly called for it. Don't get me wrong, I have no desire to see harm come to my daughter in any way, but I'm almost certain that if I had to make a choice between her life and mine, I would probably choose my own.
It's all good and well to assume what you would do for someone you care about, but you can't possibly know until you've been forced to make that choice. It all comes down to how much you are prepared to sacrifice and in what situation you are prepared to do it.

For all the parents on this forum and anyone who has a 'loved one' (be it a child or husband/wife etc), here are two scenarios I want you to consider. What would you do in these situations? -

Scenario 1: Imagine someone wearing a mask (to protect his identity) has entered your home and kidnapped you and the person you care most about. He his holding a loaded gun to your head and has asked you to make a choice between you and your 'loved one'.
His words to you are, "I intend to kill one of you quickly and let the other go free, without harm, but you must choose who lives and who dies. If you can't decide, I will torture and kill both of you and you will wish you had made the choice. You have exactly 1 minute to decide".
There are no guarantees he will keep his promise, but there is nothing to say he won't either. He could kill one of you quickly, then torture and kill the other anyway. What do you do?

Scenario 2: You and your 'loved one' are out walking along a scenic route and along the way you decide to cross over a log that is acting as a bridge over a fast flowing river. The log looks strong, steady and secure and easy enough for two people to walk on without much difficulty. The risk of falling appears minimal, so with that in mind, you both start to walk across it together. Suddenly, your loved one loses their step and falls into the river below. S/he is screaming out for help as the undercurrent attempts to drag them away. You know that if you don't jump in to help (you being the stronger swimmer) there is a good chance your loved one will drown, but if you do try to help, you could both drown. What do you do?

Tempest80 wrote:

Tungsten wrote:It is also an opportunity for bonding. Failure from someone to act on it properly can lead to a lack of trust in the long run. There is no reason to trust someone that does not care about hurting you, or letting you get hurt.

Interesting, so she could be crying some times because she's hurting inside, my angry intolerant reaction to her crying, she's probably seeing as me getting mad at her for hurting? Then again, it's her own damn fault lol if she wasn't so sensitive. Maybe getting angry/annoyed with her for feeling hurt over stupid things will tougher her up a bit.

I think you get the topo.
A better approach would probably to teach how to express things in a more mature way.
The idea is to have clear boundaries on what is capricious and what is a legitimate complaint. But for that, you have to ask what the problem is. Only then can you decide on the proper response.
She won't toughen up if she does not know why you are angry, or why she should not hurt.
If you have a better strategy to offer her, then you will have to communicate it to her.
Just being angry at someone hurting is not mature in itself, IMO. It would just look like injustice or insensitivity. There is nothing to learn in there.

At the previous scenarios I would probably sacrifice myself.
I know for sure on the second, because something similar happened when I was still pretty young. But the victim was still younger. Maybe I was 8 or so at the time, not sure.

For the first scenario, I would consider myself dead anyhow, so taking a chance does not cost anything. But I might tell the idiot to ###$ off if I don't buy this stuff. Which would probably be the case in the circumstances.

Iniquity wrote:How do you know you would give your life to save theirs if you have never been in a situation to prove it?

I don't know what I would do in either of those scenarios. I can't mentally place myself in them, I've always had trouble putting myself in the past or future or hypothetical situations. I'm a live in the present type of person lol

So, I guess I don't know that I would give my life for them. I keep them away from danger as much as possible and so far there's never been a situation that's tested what my reaction would be. When I'm given ultimatums I refuse lol when I'm given choices, I'll think logically about them. I can say for certain I'd put my kids lives ahead of other peoples lol.

Tungsten wrote:A better approach would probably to teach how to express things in a more mature way.

By using words? I try to tell her to use her 'big girl words' to tell me what's wrong, at 7 years old though, I may be speaking to her like she's 3... now that I see that typed out lol It's either that or I get frustrated/angry. The kid needs therapy to help her communicate I think, and I think I need to get some parenting classes/help with a trained professional... and be honest about my diagnosis to the therapist, as to maximize the benefits. I've gotten some great advice from people on this site, but I don't seem to be able to use it at the appropriate times, when it's needed. Perhaps if I get it tattooed into my arm

I did stand up for her at school this week. A new boy in her class spit on her on purpose, my daughter was too embarrassed (her words) to tell her teacher, so I did the next day... and her teacher said she was disgusted with that and would definitely talk to him and the parents. Then the other day, outside at recess this little brat of a boy proceeded to push a girl down that my daughter was playing with and shove leaves in her mouth (I had to hold back the laughter when I heard this lol), well my daughter was very upset about this... I don't like her upset about things.. it annoys me. So I spoke with the teacher again and also took things into my own hands a bit, I went up to the little boy when no adults were around to see and said "Listen you little $#%^, keep your f*cking hands and bodily fluids OFF my child and her friends, you touch any of them again and I will hunt you down and cut your hands off" lol stupid kid turned white as a ghost. I don't like anyone regardless of age, causing distress to my children. If the kid tells his parents or teacher, no one will believe him.. even if his parents do... the teacher won't. I have too good of a reputation in my kids school, I've done more volunteer work there than I can count. Plus, the kid has already made his own bed as a mean bully... just add liar to the list lol

Yes, by using words. Words, decision, action. That would be the complete cycle.
Maybe she does not have them though. It takes training to put words on emotions.

I don't think I would go around and talk about any PD, because people tend to panic when faced with their own ignorance.
But as an alternative, you could say you tend to act aggressively when faced with adversity and you have trouble relating to someone crying in those situations. It would probably work as well.

If she is attracting bullies at her age, it is not a good sign. She probably is sending victimized messages around. Which attracts some people looking for weaknesses, as you know.
You won't always be around to solve those problems, she has to be able to deal with it herself somehow. I don't know what can be done at that age, but it is probably a good time to learn conflict management techniques.

Tungsten wrote:She probably is sending victimized messages around.

I bet almost everyone on this site was bullied at one stage or another as a kid. I'm not sure many of them would agree they 'sent victimized messages' to those who bullied them. I know I sure as shlt didn't. I've always been a strong-minded and confident person, but I was also the quiet loner who hung out by myself most of the time, which is why I believe I was bullied. I had no friends to back me up which made me an easy target for the bullies who usually attacked in their little groups, cause we all know how hard it is to attack someone one-on-one, right... /sigh
Admittedly though, I too have been a bully to others over the years and was much nastier than any bullying I received. In fact, the type of bullying I did got me into trouble with the police. Mind you, I was an adult at the time and not a child, so my actions were taken more seriously.
Anyway, the point I'm trying to make here is, not everyone who is targeted is someone sending out victimized messages. Though some people do appear weak and vulnerable, there can be a number of reasons why a person is targeted.
If you go beyond bullying here and consider those who are targeted as potential prey, there are women who are targeted by serial killers simply because they are sexually desirable (to rape and kill). Even men and children can be targeted for the same reason. It's not always about who is the weakest or most vulnerable, though generally speaking, anyone who is vulnerable is more likely to become a target anyway because they are easier to lure and trap.

Tungsten wrote:If she is attracting bullies at her age, it is not a good sign. She probably is sending victimized messages around.

I don't think that she is sending those messages at all. This is the first time a kid as ever done anything to her that could be considered bullying. It was another kid that this bully shoved to the ground. My 7 year old gives off a very confident message about herself at school, she gets along very well with everyone, is very helpful and not dramatic in the least. She has tons of friends, too many really. My kids are throwing a halloween party tomorrow and my 7 year old ended up invited 28 kids and 25 RSVP'd and these are just some of her friends that she has knows some Preschool and Kindergarten. It's just this one little $#%^ that is new to the school, that's causing problems. None of the children in her class like him. He's an overweight, insecure bully. He has probably been the victim of teasing due to his appearance alone and may be taking a preemptive strike to make himself look tough, since he's at a new school. Whatever the reason, I won't have it.